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Re: Problem with wearing of Easy Boot Clouds

Patti SoCal 2020
 

My wonderful trimmer suggested getting the velcro strap replaced on my EB Clouds. I did that through a local saddlery store and it has extended their use.
--
Patti. SoCal 2020


Re: Problem with wearing of Easy Boot Clouds

gypsylassie
 

Hi Deb, If you can't find any repair shops closer to you, you could try Modern Shoe Shop in Dixon.   They do all kinds of shoe and boot repair and might be able to help you.  I haven't been to them, but have thought about taking in some half chaps to see about zipper repair.   It would sure extend the life of hoof boots if they can repair them.  
Laura K Chappie & Beau over the bridge
2011 N IL


Re: Problem with wearing of Easy Boot Clouds

Deb Walker
 

Thanks Michele. I feel like a moron...why didn't I think of that??? I will have to check into it. There aren't a lot of shoe repair places left, but I'll definitely check it out.
--
Deb and Scotty I/R & PPID
Northwest Illinois, May 13, 2019
Case History:
 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Deb%20and%20Scotty
Photos:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=90619


Re: Problem with wearing of Easy Boot Clouds

Michele Einarson
 

I wonder if a shoe repair place could replace the velcro with a better quality.
--
Michele & Mosey
Feb 2019
Reno, NV, USA


Problem with wearing of Easy Boot Clouds

Deb Walker
 

I seem to recall someone posting (not sure if it was this subgroup or not?) about Easy Boot Clouds not wearing as well, and that the company was not willing to do anything about it. I am on my 5th pair of Clouds, and have always gotten extremely good wear from them. When the velcro finally lost it's "stick" on all of his old ones, I bought a new pair. Wouldn't you know, about that time, he was able to start going bootless for longer periods of time for the first time since severe laminitis. Have had to use them a little more often as of late, and even though I have no record to prove it, I would say he has worn this new pair a month or less overall and the velcro is already giving away. Just wondering if anyone else has experienced this or been able to resolve it with the company.

His old boots were worn 2 years or more 24/7. When the velcro gave out on those, I tried duct taping, etc. and that was unsuccessful.
--
Deb and Scotty I/R & PPID
Northwest Illinois, May 13, 2019
Case History:
 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Deb%20and%20Scotty
Photos:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=90619


Re: Abscesses, antibiotics, and bute

 

If you do get boots to big, Make Sure someone rasps the correct breakover! Otherwise it will put strain on his tendons. Like wearing clown shoes.
--
Diann Kuzma
One Hoof at a Time
PHCP Practitioner
Joined 2018


Re: Abscesses, antibiotics, and bute

Barbara Rosensteel
 

Hi Bobbie, I  sent a private message to you with the information on my horse's hoof measurements and Cavallo size.  Please let me know if you have not received it. 

Barbara


Re: Abscesses, antibiotics, and bute

Kirsten Rasmussen
 

Barbara, one quick way to get big boots to fit is to add a thick sock and/or thick foam pad in the bottom.   At least until you can get the correct boot size.

My very thin soled horse (7mm) needs to wear 1 boot size larger than his hood measurements would suggest just so I can fit 12mm foam pads into the boot.  So keep that in mind when ordering/trying boots.

--
Kirsten Rasmussen
Kitimat, BC, Canada


Re: Abscesses, antibiotics, and bute

Bobbie Day
 

Barbara
What are his measurements? What size was his cav’s that he’s outgrown?
I have a lot of boots maybe I have something that will work.
If you want to message me I can check for you.


Re: Abscesses, antibiotics, and bute

Barbara Rosensteel
 

Thank you Lavinia.  I am sorry for taking weeks to reply.   The abscess blew out a small hole on the edge of the hoof near the heel.  I kept it clean and put on gauze pads until it was finished draining, then continued to clean well until it was drained and closed up.   Then on July 22nd he didn't want to put weight on his left hind foot, and I thought it might be another abscess.  However he had a high temperature and by Saturday, the left hind leg was badly swollen from the groin down to the coronet.   I thought it might be damage and inflammation to the deep digital flexor tendon except for the high temperature (102.5 - 104.5).   I gave him bute to try to bring down the temperature and cold hosed his leg Saturday, Sunday, and Monday morning.   I began to think it might be lymphagitis.   I couldn't get one of the veterinarians out on Monday, so called another and stopped by her office to get banamine in order to trailer him to her clinic.  She said she did not think it was lymphagitis, and drew blood to send to Cornell for a tick-borne disease panel as she thought it could be Lyme disease.    She gave him a shot of dexamethasone and an antibiotic (Excede).   That was last Monday.  The swelling went down after the antibiotic and dex and he was pretty much back to normal by Tuesday.    The tick-borne disease tests came back negative.  I still don't know what caused the swelling and high fever.

I have Cavallo boots for him but they are now too big following his last two trims.  I have to order new boots and am considering Scoot boots or Easyboots or Renegades.  I need to order them ASAP because after the trimmer removed the flaky, chipped hoof wall he is putting even more weight on the flat, thin soles.

Thanks,
Barbara


Re: Help with Hoof Evaluation

Rachel Fazio
 

Hi Lavinia - thanks so much for your reply, sorry I am still trying to navigate posting messages.  Now that I think I have figured out how to post via the web, I think I will do so.  Yes, Ty has been IR probably for a long while, but we first figured it out in 2016 shortly before I found this site and started taking Dr. Kellon's classes.  We manage him mostly on symptoms - fat deposits over eyes, at tail head and sheath.  During ACTH rise he can get footsore, he also gets lethargic and rubs his head a lot (not sure if that is a PPID symptom) but so far overt laminitis has not been our experience (thank goodness) and hopefully, that trend will hold.  We are very strict with his diet, but during fall the last couple of years we are soaking even low sugar hay (6% ESC less than 1% starch) just to try to keep him as close to normal as possible. - so seems like something more is going on.  I know that cortisol rhythm testing is not a valid PPID test - unfortunately, we have very limited access to veterinary care up here - and our vet is reluctant to do the Cornell test - but I will keep working on him.  Otherwise, we would have to drive at least an hour, which I think would throw off the results anyway.

Ty just turned 26 in May.

If you can do some markups I would appreciate it - his hooves are hard as granite and I think the new trimmer is having a difficult time, but I would appreciate any guidance so I can at least start to have a conversation with her.  She hasn't done anything to the soles on previous trims - but she did trim back the frogs the first trim, this is what has grown back since then and I have asked her not to trim them anymore.

Hopefully, you will receive this reply - but I will also cut and paste and send it out via ECIR main - with Re: Help with Hoof Evaluation Response to Lavinia.

Thanks again,

Rachel


Re: Help with Hoof Evaluation

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 
Edited

Hi Rachel,

Ty is  one handsome boy.

I don't see that you have posted at all to the main ECIR group. Until you post, you won't be able to get any input regarding Ty's management or issues. As he is at least IR, all questions (including hoof/trim ones) should be asked on the main group. All future discussion regarding him should be moved there.

How old is he? Based on the insulin results in his album, he is definitely IR but the insulin result isn't in the range where overt laminitis usually occurs. Unfortunately, cortisol rhythm testing is NOT a valid test for PPID. You really need to get an ACTH test done, along with the insulin and glucose. Sending the samples to Cornell is advised.

Thanks for adding the photos and rads. When were the rads actually done? Are these of his front feet?

The rads show significant side bone; ground parallel coffin bones, with broken back HPAs on both; underrun heels; lots of arthritic changes visible along the pastern bones; medial wall flaring on both feet; long toes; sole depth is just adequate.

Photos show underrun heels, with the central sulcus splitting up into the soft tissues. Hinds have bull-nosed dorsal walls, indicating that the coffin bones are likely ground parallel or even negative plane. Frogs appear to be stretched forward all around.

The trim should focus on shortening the toes horizontally so the breakover moves further back. Preserve all vertical height in the heels (don't try to move them back right now). Leave the soles and frogs alone except to remove any loose tags.
I can try to get you some mark-ups in time for Sat if you'd like.

Let me know with a post on the Main ECIR group.

--
Lavinia
Jan 2005, RI

Moderator/ECIR Support


Help with Hoof Evaluation

Rachel Fazio
 

Hi - I have been a passive member since 2106, and just recently uploaded my case history and photo album with the hopes of getting some guidance on my horses hooves and how to communicate with my new trimmer as we recently had to make a change.   

I feel like something is not being done quite right with his trim, but am not sure if I am imagining things - his feet were right where we wanted them and we had to make the switch, and I want to avoid heading in the wrong direction.  He isn't lame, but they just look different - so figure maybe Lavina could take a look if she has a moment and tell me I have nothing to worry about or give me some advice.  Anyway the trimmer is coming on Saturday the 31st - so if it isn't possible I understand, I did try to send it in with more time, but I don't know what happened there.

My horse is Ty, I am Rachel.


Many thanks, for this and for all that the amazing ECIR volunteers do!

Rachel





Re: Remove false sole or no?

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Susan,

I wouldn't call that false sole - it's exfoliating sole that was wearing off. This can also happen if there was a sub-solar abscess that separated the layers of sole. Sometimes it comes off in bigger pieces, sometimes it continually wears away. The amount of sole a barefoot horse builds depends on the terrain, the climate and the horse itself and changes all the time. When there is a rapid change from conditions that required more sole (or less concavity) to ones the need less (more concavity), the shedding can become quite obvious.

I tend toward the "leave it in place" school, as it is still protecting sole underneath that may not be quite ready to be exposed. It will usually peel off on its own fairly quickly. If the horse seems to uncomfortable, I'll take it off. If you remove too soon and the horse seems uncomfortable, boot/pad or apply Hoof Armor for a short time until the new sole has had enough time to harden up.

--
Lavinia
Jan 2005, RI

Moderator/ECIR Support


Remove false sole or no?

Susan
 

Both of my riding horses (they both get about 30 minutes of dressage training a day) have developed false soles this summer for the first time. It's been hot and dry for the last 2 months.  They  both have  been on jiaogulan for about a year now. One is PPID, the other was diagnosed with navicular last year. They are both sound now. They live on a track so they are moving all the time and they get about 1-2 hours of grass a day.

At first I thought I was seeing some separation of the white line and a very flat sole. But today the hoof pick went under the sole at the point of the frog and I was able to peel the sole off of the PPID horse in one piece. The other horse has had some smaller pieces break off, but not all of it. In general, should a false sole be removed and what is the theory behind the decision? On the "leave it alone" side it seems like it would provide a bit of extra cushion. But in favor of removing it, it seems like thrush could get started under it and removing it has given the hoof  more concavity.

I saw him standing stretch out of times in the last week, so I cut back his grass. Is it possible that he was looking for relief from the bulge caused by the false sole. He showed no signs of lameness while being ridden or moving around the track. After I removed the false sole from the PPID horse he walked away  sound, but it's only been a few hours. I'll know better tomorrow when I ride him if he shows any signs of sensitivity. Should I remove the remaining false sole on the other horse?
--
Susan in BC 2020
Copper and Ella's Case Histories
Ella's Photos


Re: Negative side effects of Jiaogulan based on pathology?

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 
Edited

Honestly, I don't know how/if the Hoof Armor would affect drainage. I'd go with trying to get anything that might be trapped out. Definitely wouldn't back off the j-herb as if something is there, it needs to move out. Circulation is going to increase to the feet whether there is ski tipping or not.

Do you have current photos of her feet? If not, add some to her album and let us know when they are up.

Effectiveness of j-herb is reduced when given with a meal but a small amount of food just to mix it in is OK. If fed with meals, increase the amount by 50% - or until you see Jazzy's gum/tongue color get deeper pink/red.

To update your signature, click on the Subscription tab in the upper LH corner of the EC Hoof web page. Scroll down to the signature box, add your general location and year of joining, then scroll to the bottom of the page and hit Save.

--
Lavinia
Jan 2005, RI

Moderator/ECIR Support


Re: Negative side effects of Jiaogulan based on pathology?

Michelle Coburn
 

Thanks Lavinia, I have been using Hoof Armor for awhile now on the front half of the sole. Won't this effect getting drainage out? I just applied a new layer not too long before this issue surfaced, of course!  She's ALWAYS in boots/pads when out of her paddock, with is a mix of dirt, pea gravel and stall pads/mats.

I almost feel like I should back off the Jherb, but maybe since I've started this process it's better to see it through? With the ski tipping of the coffin bone, is there going to be increase in circulation with all the bony changes? So hard to know how to move forward! I also have been giving it mixed with a little water in a syringe, but she's not having that any more. What changes in effectiveness or dosage if given with food? Sorry for all the questions, but these are this is keeping me up at night.  :(
__
Michelle and Jazzy
PS-How do I figure out how to do my signature?


Re: Negative side effects of Jiaogulan based on pathology?

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Michelle,

Sounds like the J-herb may be mobilizing abscesses - which is not uncommon. Thin soles are prone to bruising so abscessing can be the next step. That material needs to move out, tho the process isn't fun for owner or horse. I'd be careful with soaking when you have thin soles as making them soft on top of thin can be dicey. Better to use a Numotizine poultice, which can be effective in initiating drainage and is very useful because it will change color in areas that had drainage. Scrub the foot well then apply a layer of Numotize and cover with cotton gauze or a diape.  Secure the cotton or diaper well then put inside a boot or wrap with duct tape or Gorilla tape. Leave on 1 to 2  days. https://www.bigdweb.com/product/code/294.do?gclid=Cj0KCQiA5vb-BRCRARIsAJBKc6KHNvrUDEU0PkpYDdE7N8moWo5i2eawvlG6XpSfhsMBWOuxClRsn9MaAmeyEALw_wcB

Ski-tipping isn't affected by J-herb but getting the trim tight will help to ensure that it doesn't become worse. It will also help to increase the sole depth. Padded boots in the meanwhile, to protect and help increase circulation, are also a must on anything but the softest, most forgiving surfaces.

--
Lavinia
Jan 2005, RI

Moderator/ECIR Support


Negative side effects of Jiaogulan based on pathology?

Michelle Coburn
 

I've (re)started my thin soled mare (I do use Hoof Armor) on J-herb to try and increase circulation and get better blood flow to build sole depth. After 4 days she's coming up lame, limping on front right, which is her weakest thinnest hoof sole. Boots and pads, and photobiomodulation are being used. My first question is, is there a certain set of circumstances like hers (ski tipping of coffin bone) which ISN'T helped by Jherb, and will only cause discomfort, or is it worth continuing to use it, even though it's probably moving some ugly internal hoof pathology to rear it's ugly head that may be beyond help? Second question is: I know Dr Kellon recommends soaking with Epsom salt baths, but with a thin soled horse (<10 mm) what should I do? It's always such a balancing act, and this is only the second time since I've owned her she's had this, we've been maintaining very well, with Pete Ramey helping me. He's kind of out of circulation now, but we do have David Landreville coming this weekend, and he's going to look at her. Thanks for the information, I appreciate this group so much, and even though I don't post often I read the daily messages. I have uploaded hoof rads somewhere in here!

Michelle Coburn and Jazzy (sorry if this isn't the right signature!


Re: thin soles

Daisy Shepherd
 

thanks to all who replied; all good recommendations.   daisy and tiko

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