Bring back the toe from underneath - Video?
|
Hi all, Thank you! |
|
|
|
Trisha DePietro
Hi Joy. I don't know of a specific video that pulls out just that part of the trim....maybe Pete Ramey has a trim video that might speak to it? You could google Pete and see what comes up....
-- Trisha DePietro Aug 2018 NH Dolly and Hope's Case Histories Dolly's Photos Hope's Photos Ω |
|
|
|
Joy, Daisy Bicking has a neat slow-motion video of bevelling the toe (from underneath), but I am still trying to find where I saw it! I'll post a link once I find it, but if anyone else knows the video in question, please let us know.
Pete's DVDs have plenty of videos of him bringing back toes--the "Under the Horse" series. I think you can rent the DVDs if you are in the US. -- Maxine and Indy (PPID) and Dangles (PPID) Canberra, Australia 2010 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Maxine%20and%20Indy |
|
|
|
Thank you Trisha! I'll go look around for it.
-- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|
|
Hi Maxine, thanks so much. I'm going to search for Daisy's video. I'll look for Pete's video too.
Much appreciated! Joy -- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|
|
Daisy Shepherd
hi joy, did you find that video? i need it also. thanks, daisy,tiko,whisper
|
|
|
|
No, not yet but I will share a link here once I finally do. Still searching....
-- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|
|
Joy, Pete's videos are in a set of DVDs called "Under the Horse". I think they are available to rent--if you do a search in the Messages here, I'm sure it has been mentioned. I had to buy the DVD set, because we can't rent them here.
Around the 30 minute mark in this ELPO trim protocol video, it shows rasping the toe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NK17KR_jjjo From Daisy, this isn't the video I was thinking of, but it does show backing up the toe at 1.42minutes https://vimeo.com/412727920 Can you ask your trimmer to supervise you doing the rasping so you get the idea? -- Maxine and Indy (PPID) and Dangles (PPID) Canberra, Australia 2010 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Maxine%20and%20Indy |
|
|
|
Thank you Maxine!
I was bringing back Willie's toes for about a year with no problems, but after my EXCELLENT hoof care professional moved to another state, I have struggled to get a good trim for him. The last time I brought back his toes, he had so much retained sole, that he was sore b/c the sole was in contact w/ the ground. The trim is getting better but the newest person is extremely careful and does minimal trimming and his toes are just too long. I just wanted a video to remind me of how exactly to do this. Previous trimmer showed me and it was going very well. I don't even want to ask new trimmer b/c she will probably tell me it's not a good idea to bring his toes back "too quickly" (lord help me please). I guess she's planning on getting there eventually but the trims are just too conservative to help Willie right now. Thank you again, this is super helpful! Joy -- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|
|
Joy, I thought you might be looking for where to set the breakover. The ELPO video excels in mapping its location. Once that it located, I rasp the wall at an angle from 10 to 2 o'clock. Where the toe is too long, it isn't always necessary (or even possible) to have a thick rounded hoof wall like you see on the video. Below is a shot of the new breakover compared to the mark-up. I didn't manage to get the fetlock flexed at the same angle in the after shot (on the left) compared to the mark-up on the right, but you can see the breakover on the left toe with the more putty gray color. The toe/sole is touching the ground. The hoof wall at the toe is out of weight bearing. This is the hoof of a recovering laminitic, so it doesn't look like a nice shiny exfoliated ELPO hoof.
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/photo/7296/3440313 Scoot boots has better photos in this brief explainer about the mustang roll. https://scootboots.com/blogs/blog/how-to-do-a-mustang-roll This photo also shows rasping from the breakover at an angle with the toe of the hoof wall out of weight bearing. The next step is to round/bevel the wall to make it pretty. https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-f4FE_23HuIg/URFD_v0IYtI/AAAAAAAAA38/CpmY30ok8wk/s1600/IMG_6246.JPG I learned from my trimmer how to maintain the breakover. Since he sets it every 4 weeks, I can simply maintain it. I don't try to make it look professional. I set the breakover with a few swipes of the rasp from the bottom and finish the job from the top with hoof on a hoof jack. That's easier for both of us. I recommend getting the best full-sized (14") rasp money can buy along with a wooden handle. It's about the $4-5 difference between a dull clunker and something that will do the job efficiently for an amateur. Your hands and wrists will thank you. -- Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012 ECIR Group Moderator Cayuse Case History Cayuse Photos Diamond Case History Diamond Photos |
|
|
|
Cass! Thank you! This is all extremely helpful. I do have a good Bellota top sharp 13" (or maybe 12"?) rasp - I got the slightly smaller one b/c I thought it would be easier for me to handle not knowing what I was doing (it is!). Still need a hoof jack
Question, approximately what angle are you using when you're rasping between 10 & 2? Initially I thought it s/b 45 degrees but I read somewhere a 28 degree angle was better (I believe this was from a Pete R article but could be wrong). Or does this even matter? Lastly, if there is too much retained sole and it's not going anywhere even with picking, should I risk bringing back his toes even if that means sole is touching the ground? Is it ever appropriate to run the rasp across the sole to bring it level with the hoof wall? Thank you again. I have a lot of good info on this thread. Thanks to everyone! Regards! Joy -- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|
|
Hi, Joy. My guess is that I’m rasping between a 30 and 45degree angle. I can barely manage that on the RF. But with what I’m doing, it doesn’t matter. I rasp from the sole side to set where I want to shorten the toe. Next I put the hoof on the hoof jack and finish the job from the top, which is much easier for me. I generally rasp more or less straight up and down. I only finish beveled to remove any tough or sharp edges. As for the sole touching the ground, I defer to Lavinia and others. In our case, Cayuse is bearing weight across the entire bottom of her hooves that can be in ground contact: wall, sole where it isn’t so concave it only touches when weight bearing, bars, and hoof wall — though the wall touches minimally at the RF toe where we still see damaged laminae. My rasp cannot touch much of her sole because of hoof concavity. At the toe, I absolutely rasp the sole to set the breakover. I have no fear because it’s physically impossible for me to do too much with my arthritic hands and wrists. We have kept every scrap of sole that isn’t easily removed with a pick. One exception is near the bars, where my trimmer checks for embedded bar. You may not need to do that, but Cayuse had months of retained sole from being in glue-on boots. We left all we could, allowing movement to loosen the excess. Around the bars, though, it was a bit tricky because the junction isn’t easy to see without digging. I do NO digging and don’t use an hoof knife. I don’t know how. I leave that to my trimmer, who has a nose for laid over bar that can cause bruising and discomfort. Just yesterday Cayuse took an off step. When I picked, I broke off a piece of bar that was mostly broken and was grinding a hole in her sole. |
|
|
|
Thank you again Cass, you've been very helpful. This is the info that I needed, along with some of the vids you linked, I think I'm good to go. Saturday I'll work on my pony's toes.
Much appreciated!! Joy -- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|
|
If you decide to buy a hoof stand, I would buy a light weight one, I think they are a green composite. I made the mistake of buying a metal one and it’s really heavy. The other thing I wish I had done was buy the “pony” size. My mare is only 14.2 hands and it’s a bit high, way too high for my pony and little donkey. I did have hubby cut the “neck” down 2” but it’s still heavy enough I don’t use it often
|
|
|
|
Good video on using the hoof jack on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maQ80scsnC0
-- Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012 ECIR Group Moderator Cayuse Case History Cayuse Photos Diamond Case History Diamond Photos |
|
|
|
Thank you Helen, I will take your advice.
-- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|
|
Thank you again Cass. I've saved the video to watch when I'm off work later.
So much great info/advice from everyone. Thank you! -- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|
|
Hi Trisha
Canberra, Australia 2010 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Maxine%20and%20Indy |
|
|
|
I just LOVE everything
Daisy posts ... this particular one, a healthy shod hoof, with his first
transition trim out of shoes. Feet like that (padded and shod) often have
plenty of sole ready to exfoliate (which she does), often times embedded bars
(ouch!) that need shortening, and frogs that haven't seen ground in a long while
(gonna take a while for those 'butt cracks' to 'heal').
The toe shortening is facilitated with a quick 'map' and marking, great nippers (that have a compound spring on them), a sharp well placed rasp, and her cordless angle grinder. Saying this because, recovering laminitic horses often have very thin soles that shouldn't be touched. And may need their bars left alone, and and and. Know what you're taking off and why. Ellen Harvest,
AL |
|
|
|
I love Daisy's vids too. I don't need to worry about thin soles, my horse has always had extremely thick front soles. I don't touch them myself, but when they are flaking and coming off my trimmer does remove what can easily come off.
I'm just trying to bring the toes back on all 4 in between trims. I don't need to do anything more than that. -- Joy and Willie (EC/IR) Nevada County, CA - 2019 Case history: Willie's Case History Willie's photo album: Willie's Photo Album |
|
|