Hi Cass, not sure I am clear on what you mean about the update.  When I update their case history it shows on the page that I updated it.  If I add new data, like blood work I add the date and if I make changes to diet/exercise that has a date block I add the date?  Is there something else that I should be doing?  We grow our own hay and test it and it tests at or below 10% ESC/starch combined.  A current small batch I have is at 10.2 so I am soaking it.  Of that 10.2, the Starch is 1.7.  Previous years' hay usually tests with starch at .7 or so and ESC 5-7 %.  I am soaking because I am doing everything I can.  Yes, we discontinued Metformin quickly as both horses stopped eating.  Yes, we are using DDT+E as appropriate.  I guess my question should have been if I am doing everything right, (except for exercise for Mouse), what should my expectations be of a significant insulin drop?  If it is not going to get there without the exercise piece for Mouse, that will have to wait as he is lame.  I do not know if that is the insulin or a tendon/ligament injury or something else. When Mouse has had laminitis in the past, he has never been lame or unsound but DPs were the only clue without bloodwork.  In Mouse's case, his DPS have been a clear indicator of pain or a problem for many years so I do rely on them pretty heavily.   Ryn has never been lame nor has he had bounding DPs and I did bloodwork on him as he and Mouse are genetically close.  I am under the impression that 4 hours of feeding hay is what should be done before blood testing(if they run out overnight and they will ) but are you saying it needs to be more than four hours?   Can Timothy Balance cubes be part of the morning meal as they get sick of wet hay for four hours.  Thanks for the input!

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https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Kimberly%20and%20Mouse
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=275222

Kimberly joined 7.17.2018 Virginia