Date   

Re: Pergolide

Nancy C
 

Just want to second Linda R's suggestion. This affect is usually transitory and can be helped a great deal with the APF.

It's an adaptogen. More about adaptogens, APF in particular, including responses from horses on tehlsit in similar situations here

<http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/EquineCushings/files/APF/>

As Linda says, living with uncontrolled disease is not where you want to go.

The correct diet helps support them too.

Hang in there.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003

NewEnglandEquineBalance@...

--- In EquineCushings@..., Megan M <megan1123@...> wrote:

Ok so I did the tapering and my horse still lost appetite and is not himself after starting the pergolide.


Re: Dawn's Insulin is in G:I is 1:80

Lorna <briars@...>
 

Hi LeeAnne,


Sigh.
Sorry about those numbers.
But you caught it!!I know you're hyperventilating with all this,but you know we don't allow that(you do know about the pot calling the kettle black,don't you?).
The doctor prescribes chocolate.
Oh,yes,and red wine.

Yes,I feed the J-Herb in the meals most of the time.I have always thought that when we do that the suggested dose is 1.5 times the away from meals dose.
That's what I do with Mov-Ease,too.

My J-Herb doses are fairly high now.I'm feeding about 1 Tbsp BID.

I'm so glad you are upping the Pergolide for Dawn.Yay!

Scritches all around!

Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002
*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf


Re: Dry lots?/ ECHorsekeeping

Lorna <briars@...>
 

For members wanting to learn from those who have been on this journey ,and have developed some ingenious methods of looking after their compromized horses when it comes to dry lots,small mesh haynets,soaking hay,muzzles,you name it, one of sister sites,EC Horsekeeping is the place to lounge around in.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHorsekeeping/

See you there.

Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002
*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf


Re: Pergolide

Linda Rollins <lindarollins38@...>
 

Hi Megan,
Have you tried using APF? Lots of info on it in the files. Just type "APF" in the search box. We have found it very useful helping horses adapt (no pun intended) to the pergolide. "Happy & spunky," but dancing on the edge of something bad that could happen. Stick with it. It will all work out! Thousands of us - and our horses - have been through EXACTLY what you both are going through now.

Linda in MA, Peanut in RI with Lavina
EC Support Team
9/07


Pergolide

megmetz
 

Ok so I did the tapering and my horse still lost appetite and is not himself after starting the pergolide. I don't like this at all. His is less interested in things, nervous, agitated and this all started once I upped him to his full dose. He is 30 years old and was happy and spunky before I started the medicine. What are my alternatives? I do not feel good about continuing after seeing his reaction to it.

Megan
New Jersey
Feb 2012

Sent from my iPhone


Re: New Source for Pergolide Not 100% Successful

Lorna <briars@...>
 

Hi Ian,



A pharmacy which many of us use here in Canada had independant testing done last year,and I put a message up in the files concerning this.
Canada Sources File

Part of the message is,"The lab results said they were stable and compounded 1mg Pergolide Mesylate capsules with a measured 0.949mg/cap which is where the USP guidelines says it should be for compounded medication.

Please contact Kathryn Davies <shawnigangirl@...> if you would like copies of the results.

Perhaps you would be able to do the same concerning your results?


Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002
*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf


Schilling's Peppermint Extract OK?

lauramollrich <lmollrich@...>
 

I received my HorseTech minerals the other day and my horse won't touch them.

I ordered Uckele's flavorings and he won't touch that either.

So, I bought a small bottle of Schilling's Peppermint Extract from the grocery store. I put a small amount on the palm of my hand and rubbed them together. He wouldn't stop licking so I took his BP and massaged it with my peppermint hands, added the minerals with a handful of Timothy hay pellets. He licked the bowl clean!

I read the ingredients: Water, alcohol. Is this safe?

Laura Mollrich
Laguna Beach, CA
1/2012
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory5/files/Laura%20Mollrich/


Re: New Source for Pergolide Not 100% Successful

ferne fedeli
 

On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 8:46 AM, ianwiththrivingpets <ian@...>wrote

WE ARE CURRENTLY MAKING SOME IT CHANGES TO ENABLE AUTOMATIC RE-ORDERING
WHICH WILL >MAKE THIS OPTION MORE CONVENIENT.

Great idea, Ian!!! A couple of times I sort of spaced out and didn't
reorder until I was down to only 3 or 4 capsules, but with your quick
service managed to not miss any doses!!! Auto re-ordering would be great
for people like me!!!
Ferne Fedeli
No. California
4/2010







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Re: Dawn's Insulin is in G:I is 1:80

tomtriv <ThePitchforkPrincess@...>
 

Aleve will block the jherb. I bet you know that. If she's not head bobbing and you don't think the Aleve is improving things, maybe think about spacing out the doses a bit while you wait for the jherb.
Wasn't sure but thought it probably would block. Yes I will do that. How long will it take for Aleve to get out of her system so I can start the J herb when it comes?

Is it probably that if she isn't head bobbing without pain killers, then the trim has helped?
It may have been due to the few days she was getting no hay as she was in the riding ring. Sadly that had to change so the manure in it can dry out and not wreck the ring's footing. So Dawn is out with the herd and her rough "playmate". I'll keep an eye but will do all I can to her muzzle to prevent hay sneaking.


Best routine is to syringe in. Some feed it in food. Checking the gums before you start and looking for pinker gums and better foot comfort would be my litmus test.

Understand syringing can be an issue with a BO.
Feeding 20 early is an issue too so the AM (between 6 am and 8amish) dose will have to go in her food. I normally do the barn in afternoon so I can make sure Dawn doesn't go until evening with no food. I think I can work around the feeding issue. She gets 6 pounds of soaked cubes. I can certainly feed her as soon as I arrive, and then wait/muck whatever for an hour after she eats. Or feed her before but that would make a pretty lopsided "half" day. Would three dosages be better then? It could go in her AM and PM food and I can do a proper dosage in the mid afternoon.

Since there is no time scheduled routine, is there a danger if I gave her the herb at say 3pm and barn owner brought in at 6pm and gave her more? I'm sorry this is so convoluted but boarding is always picking the lesser of evils.

I am always honored to look at your Case History.
LOL I'm glad to hear that. I want it up to date and clear so that when stuff goes down it is ready to go. Or at least quickly updated. There is nothing more annoying than to have to fuss with questions when you are freaking out a little.

Speaking of freaking, gotta fly. The weather is supposed to get pretty dramatic and I want to be sure Dawn isn't pelted with hail and the horses have water if the power gets knocked out.

-LeeAnne & Dawn,Newmarket, Ont PPID & IR 03/2004
Case History: http://tinyurl.com/yk7mvd6
Photos: http://tinyurl.com/6h64yh
All Season Muzzle Photos: http://tinyurl.com/55c52m
Hoof Pics: http://tinyurl.com/6qc79x6
Videos: http://tinyurl.com/5u2pdkv


Re: Dawn's Insulin is in G:I is 1:80

Nancy C
 

Hey LeeAnne

Sorry this was missed.

I suppose this leaves no doubt that this foot pain is laminitis?
Not sure about "no doubt" but how about very likely?

Here's the good news: you caught it. You're working towards refining your DDT+E. Keep breathing.

Excellent news on the pergo.

Aleve will block the jherb. I bet you know that. If she's not head bobbing and you don't think the Aleve is improving things, maybe think about spacing out the doses a bit while you wait for the jherb.

Best routine is to syringe in. Some feed it in food. Checking the gums before you start and looking for pinker gums and better foot comfort would be my litmus test.

Understand syringing can be an issue with a BO. Can you work out a routine to syringe in at those times you go over there? So maybe she gets syringe from you but in the feed from BO when you can't be there. Would perhaps have to play with the dosage. Needs to be higher in the food. again, gums will tell you when you are right.

I am always honored to look at your Case History.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003

NewEnglandEquineBalance@...



--- In EquineCushings@..., "tomtriv" <ThePitchforkPrincess@...> wrote:

-LeeAnne & Dawn,Newmarket, Ont PPID & IR 03/2004
Case History: http://tinyurl.com/yk7mvd6
Photos: http://tinyurl.com/6h64yh
All Season Muzzle Photos: http://tinyurl.com/55c52m
Hoof Pics: http://tinyurl.com/6qc79x6
Videos: http://tinyurl.com/5u2pdkv


Re: Dawn's Insulin is in G:I is 1:80

tomtriv <ThePitchforkPrincess@...>
 

I think a lot of us feed Jiaogulan
in with our horses other supplements. I'm sure you are aware of the fact that
you need to increase the dosage when you do that.
Thanks Ferne! I thought that might be the case but wanted to be sure it didn't just waste the herb.
I'm pretty sure Lorna does

that, so she will probably give you more info on exactly what her dosages are.
I look fwd to hearing from her (or anyone else!) on this.

I give my Cushings Arab 2 teaspoons am and pm to give you an idea.
Having read the files I am a little leery of trying this right off the bat so advice is very welcome. I want Dawn to have a fighting chance before founder really happens.

-LeeAnne & Dawn,Newmarket, Ont PPID & IR 03/2004
Case History: http://tinyurl.com/yk7mvd6
Photos: http://tinyurl.com/6h64yh
All Season Muzzle Photos: http://tinyurl.com/55c52m
Hoof Pics: http://tinyurl.com/6qc79x6
Videos: http://tinyurl.com/5u2pdkv


Re: Dry lots?

Nancy C
 

See below....

--- In EquineCushings@..., "skyappy95" <skydove103@...> wrote:

1] If you have an IR horse, is it necessary to keep them in a dry lot
24/7?
If the horse is IR and not in work and has the continued issues you've been describing the last months with Copper, yes. Until her IR is under control and she is back in work.

We never did see any blood work did we, Catherine?

If so, how do you make one if you live in a climate that is very wet & things grow? Also, how big should it be? What if the horse is alone, what will be the quality of life?
That's exactly where I live. I have used a combination of processes. Most of this has been discussed on ECHorsekeeping. Lots of info there. Need to go back there for the how to's.


How will the horse get enough exercise if it is penned up all the time?
You need to rethink the concept of exercise. Turn out is not exercise. She's not getting exercise now. In order to bust IR, heart rate needs to be raised much higher than than the average resting hear rate for at least 20 minutes. If I recall correctly it needs to be 75-90 bpm. Most horses need to work up to that. You have to move the horse. Or find/pay someone who can do it for you.


To me this seems like a pretty boring life for a horse but maybe some
of you have figured out ways to make it better?
Yes, I have figured it out. It's all discussed on ECHorsekeeping.


What have you all done if you don't have a dry lot?
If you use muzzles instead, I don't get how do you feed often & be
always be around to put the muzzle on or take it off & make sure
horse is getting enough water.
Takes trial and error. New ways of thinking.

What about winter? How do you all make sure your horses get enough
exercise in the winter if you don't have cover & the weather is bad
all the time like in Oregon. [this winter was unusually good but not
sure that will happen again].
You have to move them.

You know Catherine, this has been going on a very long time. As I said yesterday, I'm on a bunch of other lists. Seen how frustrated you are in various other places. It seems to me you've got three choices:

1. - Keep doing what you are doing
2. - Change what you are doing, fully adopting DDT+E
3. - Rehome Copper.

There are many, many people here who could help find a good home for her. Many have been in your position and done exactly that. Their horses lived long and healthy lives.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003

NewEnglandEquineBalance@...


Re: Dawn's Insulin is in G:I is 1:80

ferne fedeli
 

On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 12:03 AM, tomtriv
<ThePitchforkPrincess@...> wrote:

How important is it that Jiaogulan is fed 20 minutes before feeding? Will
it still work if fed with food?
Lee Ann, so sorry to hear about your horse! I think a lot of us feed Jiaogulan
in with our horses other supplements. I'm sure you are aware of the fact that
you need to increase the dosage when you do that. I'm pretty sure Lorna does
that, so she will probably give you more info on exactly what her dosages are.
I give my Cushings Arab 2 teaspoons am and pm to give you an idea.
Ferne Fedeli
No. California
4/2010


Re: Dry lots?

Bonnie
 

Hello Sky,

I believe Ontario winters have Oregon's beat! Lots of snow and very cold. Originally my rented area included a barn and an old cow pasture.
At first I kept my horse alone. I made a run-in shelter, 3-sided, with a split curtain made of heavy tarp as the door. The tarp was the kind truckers use and has lasted years. The shelter gets used during stormy weather, and in summer as a refuge from flies.

Instead of using the whole pasture, I made a paddock paradise track around it. Electric fencing of a portable type was used. There is much advice and information available on pp tracks. I used Roundup to remove the growing grass and other vegetation. Eventually the track was packed by the horse's feet so growth is much reduced. The track was made a section at a time so the horse was always in a no-grass area.

The track is used much of the year, and when deep snow makes it unusable, I rope off a long narrow section for the winter enclosure. As the food and water are at one end, and the shelter at the other, the horse keeps moving much more than he did in a rectangular pasture.

A grazing muzzle was not an option for my horse as he can get one off easily.

I use an electric water bucket, having run an overhead cable to a fence, and installed an outlet. It keeps the water open in very cold weather.

Hay nets, made of small mesh, are hung in different spots on the track. The horse moves around, not quite finishing one, then moving to check out another, then going back to see how much is left...The track is on a hill, with trees for shelter at the low end. The horse can exercise his body and his curiosity at the same time.

A second owner's horse moved in last fall and the track system has worked well for both. Our feeding system is: Give a small meal of beet pulp in early a.m., and put the horses out with bagged hay. If possible one owner puts out a small bagged meal mid-afternoon. Between 5 and 6 pm a meal of beet pulp/soaked hay cubes, and a bag of hay, is given after the horses are brought in. A large hay bag is served in each stall around 9 pm.

The small-mesh hay nets have made it possible to keep food in front of the horses much longer than putting out flakes, which are vacuumed up in minutes.

Don't be discouraged: it is possible to give a horse a good quality of life using some ingenuity. Others will give you many more ideas.

Bonnie Ivey, Ontario 12/08


Re: New Source for Pergolide Not 100% Successful

Nancy C
 

See below....

--- In EquineCushings@..., "ianwiththrivingpets" <ian@...> wrote:

Hi, Nancy. MY ANSWERS ARE BELOW IN ALL CAPS.

OK. I'll presume you are not yelling at me then. <g>


BY THIS I MEAN THAT WE ARE TRYING A NEW SUPPLIER TO TEST THEIR PERGOLIDE. THE NEW SUPPLIER STOCKS LARGER QUANTITIES OF PERGOLIDE SO WE COULD POTENTIALLY PURCHASE A KILO OR MORE OF PERGOLIDE AT A TIME FROM THIS SOURCE. DURING THE TRIAL WE PURCHASED OUR USUAL 100G JAR WHICH LASTS US ABOUT 2 MONTHS. ALL OF OUR PERGOLIDE IS STORED IN THE REFRIGERATOR.
So sounds like this new but now old supplier's stock could have been hanging around longer too then.



THE NEW SOURCE HAD THEIR OWN ASSAY RESULTS AND 3RD PARTY ASSAY RESULTS. I REQUESTED AND RECEIVED BOTH RESULTS PRIOR TO PURCHASING THE NEW PERGOLIDE.


Why would one not share the above data?
ASSAY RESULTS ARE PRETTY DETAILED AND NOT PARTICULARLY INFORMATIVE FOR PEOPLE OTHER THAN PHARMACISTS AND CHEMISTS.
Maybe but we have a number of chemists and pharmacists as members on this list that could probably help my old impaired hard drive process the info.


I AM NOT A CHEMIST SO I DON'T FEEL QUALIFIED TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION. DR. KELLON ORIGINALLY MENTIONED POTENTIAL INTERACTIONS BETWEEN PERGOLIDE AND INACTIVE INGREDIENTS SO PERHAPS SHE CAN ELABORATE ON THIS CONCEPT.
What do your chemists on staff say?



MOST OF OUR CLIENTS BEGIN REDUCING THE DOSE IN FEBRUARY, SOME EVEN WAIT UNTIL MARCH. IT MAY BE THAT YOUR HORSE NEEDED THE HIGHER DOSE A BIT LONGER- DR. KELLON AND OTHER LIST MEMBERS CAN PROBABLY PROVIDE FEEDBACK ON THE TIMING.
Thanks Ian. Just FYI - I put the document in our files regarding spring role back of pergolide together so I'm really, really familiar with the process. I have also thought my horse may continue to need higher dosage. There are many possibilities. It's why we toss these things around here so we may find further guidance.

IF YOU STORE YOUR PERGOLIDE IN THE REFRIGERATOR, IT SHOULD STILL BE EFFECTIVE.

I do. Purchasing 30 day supplies and keeping in the door of the fridge is what we advise folks here.


Either way, at current 7.5 mg, we're at twice the dosage we were on last year. Current elevation of symptoms are consistent with inadequate dosage.
PURCHASING A MONTH'S SUPPLY AT A TIME IS AN OPTION IF YOU WANT TO BE ULTRA CONSERVATIVE AND ENSURE 100% POTENCY. WE ARE CURRENTLY MAKING SOME IT CHANGES TO ENABLE AUTOMATIC RE-ORDERING WHICH WILL MAKE THIS OPTION MORE CONVENIENT.
Thank you again for sharing and being honest. Would be great if we could have a bit more info as above.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003

NewEnglandEquineBalance@...


Re: New Source for Pergolide Not 100% Successful

ianwiththrivingpets <ian@...>
 

Hi, Nancy. MY ANSWERS ARE BELOW IN ALL CAPS.

--- In EquineCushings@..., "Nancy" <threecatfarm@...> wrote:

Hi Ian

You mention stocking up. Why does this not mean that the stock is sitting around longer with increased potential for loosing potency even with refrigeration?
BY THIS I MEAN THAT WE ARE TRYING A NEW SUPPLIER TO TEST THEIR PERGOLIDE. THE NEW SUPPLIER STOCKS LARGER QUANTITIES OF PERGOLIDE SO WE COULD POTENTIALLY PURCHASE A KILO OR MORE OF PERGOLIDE AT A TIME FROM THIS SOURCE. DURING THE TRIAL WE PURCHASED OUR USUAL 100G JAR WHICH LASTS US ABOUT 2 MONTHS. ALL OF OUR PERGOLIDE IS STORED IN THE REFRIGERATOR.


When you say

We have 3rd party assay test results on all of Pergolide old and new.<<
...do you mean you have your own independent testing done or are you relying on testing data furnished by the pergo supplier?
THE NEW SOURCE HAD THEIR OWN ASSAY RESULTS AND 3RD PARTY ASSAY RESULTS. I REQUESTED AND RECEIVED BOTH RESULTS PRIOR TO PURCHASING THE NEW PERGOLIDE.


Why would one not share the above data?
ASSAY RESULTS ARE PRETTY DETAILED AND NOT PARTICULARLY INFORMATIVE FOR PEOPLE OTHER THAN PHARMACISTS AND CHEMISTS.


I get it about different assays giving different results. We deal with this all the time. Not sure I am following teh potential interaction between pergolide nd inactive ingredients. Can you elaborate please?
I AM NOT A CHEMIST SO I DON'T FEEL QUALIFIED TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION. DR. KELLON ORIGINALLY MENTIONED POTENTIAL INTERACTIONS BETWEEN PERGOLIDE AND INACTIVE INGREDIENTS SO PERHAPS SHE CAN ELABORATE ON THIS CONCEPT.


Here's my update -

I've been worried I begant to back off the pergo too fast. We were doing pretty well until the end of February. In mid-January I began rolling slowly down from 9.5 mg in to current 7 mg. About half mg a week. Been there for some time now. Now I'm wondering about the pergo. My current supply was ordered February 2nd. Could be the supply or could be I'm past the 30 day mark.
MOST OF OUR CLIENTS BEGIN REDUCING THE DOSE IN FEBRUARY, SOME EVEN WAIT UNTIL MARCH. IT MAY BE THAT YOUR HORSE NEEDED THE HIGHER DOSE A BIT LONGER- DR. KELLON AND OTHER LIST MEMBERS CAN PROBABLY PROVIDE FEEDBACK ON THE TIMING. IF YOU STORE YOUR PERGOLIDE IN THE REFRIGERATOR, IT SHOULD STILL BE EFFECTIVE.


Either way, at current 7.5 mg, we're at twice the dosage we were on last year. Current elevation of symptoms are consistent with inadequate dosage.
PURCHASING A MONTH'S SUPPLY AT A TIME IS AN OPTION IF YOU WANT TO BE ULTRA CONSERVATIVE AND ENSURE 100% POTENCY. WE ARE CURRENTLY MAKING SOME IT CHANGES TO ENABLE AUTOMATIC RE-ORDERING WHICH WILL MAKE THIS OPTION MORE CONVENIENT.


Thanks for being up front with us, Ian.
YOU'RE WELCOME- I APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO LEARN AND SHARE WHAT I HAVE LEARNED.

-IAN
DENVER CO
02/2006



Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003

NewEnglandEquineBalance@...



--- In EquineCushings@..., "ianwiththrivingpets" <ian@> wrote:

Different absorption rates could be due to different particle size, different testing- mass spectrometry versus chemical testing etc. Since all of the inactive ingredients are the same, the only potential interaction would be between the new Pergolide and the inactive ingredients we have been using for many years.

I am not sure what the answer is but believe that returning to the old source is the best option given the increase in concerns from our clients.

-Ian
Denver CO
02/2006


Re: Need to Make Additions/Corrections to my File

Nancy C
 

Hi Laura

Directions are here

<http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory5/files/_Case%20History%20Template%20and%20Ins/>

Look for this .pdf

Posting and Updating Case Histories-1.pdf

It's essentially the same as when you made your first one. You need to download the form to your desktop, make changes, then upload the new copy to your folder.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003

NewEnglandEquineBalance@...

--- In EquineCushings@..., "lauramollrich" <lmollrich@...> wrote:

I can't find where the directions are but what I need to know is how to make a change to a typo I did in my file.
Laura Mollrich
Laguna Beach, CA
1/2012
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory5/files/Laura%20Mollrich/


MESSAGE POSTING ETIQUETTE - KEEPING ECIR USER FRIENDLY

tomtriv <ThePitchforkPrincess@...>
 

******************************
This is a high volume list that can be difficult to follow. To help make this easier for everyone, please follow the guidelines below:

1) Sign your posts with your first name, location, the date you joined. When asking for advice, provide a link to your case history or photos. All this information is important. It provides volunteers with the clues needed to get you quality responses, local support, vendors, vets, hoof care, etc. in a timely fashion.

2) Limit your signature to 3 or 4 lines.

3) Delete all but the part of the message you're replying to before posting. Keep who is saying what clear by leaving the chevrons (>) in front of the text you are answering then type your response in a new paragraph below.

4) When threads take off in new directions indicate the topic change in the subject line. For example: NOW: New Subject (was Old Subject).

5) Don't re-post messages if they don't immediately appear on the group or go unanswered. Allow roughly 48 hours before re-posting with the words "2nd Post" in the subject line and simply provide the original message's number. Be patient, it is not personal or a reflection on you in any way. With so many posts some do get missed.

6) Feel free to take off-topic, horse-related discussions to our sister yahoo groups. ECHorsekeeping provides a place for discussion related to non- metabolic horses. Diagnosis, Diet, Trim and Exercise is the focus to allow members a place to discuss nutrition for non- PPID/IR horses. General horse keeping practices, lameness and other equine health issues that are not related to a PPID/IR horse, alternative therapies and equine related philosophical debates are also acceptable on ECHorsekeeping.

THE ECIR GROUPS:

ECHorsekeeping
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHorsekeeping/

ECHoof
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHoof/

For a complete list of our sister groups see the ECIR Files Table of Contents:
http://tinyurl.com/6lsvppq


***WARNING***
Solicitation is against list policy. If contacted privately by someone selling a product or service, be suspicious. These mails frequently target new members or those in a crisis. Often the product or service will not hold up to close examination. It could be harmless but also could be unsafe. Any suggested supplement, treatment, hoof care approach, etc, should be posted on the list so that everyone can benefit from list feedback. If you receive an e-mail selling something, either post to the group to ask about it, or forward the mail to

EquineCushings-owner@...
******************************

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Owners, Moderators & Primary Response Teams of the Equine Cushings Lists


Re: For trimming help

Kathy Brinkerhoff
 

Hi Jennifer,

Boards have owners and moderators who set the policies. I wanted to be respectful of this before I entered into an on-going discussion of nutrition on a hoof trimming focused board.

Based on my previous discussions with vendors/users of vitamin regimens, etc. it turns into a discussion which can sometimes (most times) confuse members and often gets heated. I contacted Cheryl privately to ask her the guidelines for nutrition/diet advice, etc. I understand and respect that Cheryl's primary focus is hooves. Cheryl advised me that if I didn't agree with a poster's nutritional advice or pitch to just not open his/her emails. This solution doesn't work for me. After this email, I confirmed what I was observing that in fact there is no policy on nutrition advice....it is open season.

It would have saved time and there would have been a lot less confusion if the owner would have come forward immediately and independently and advised those board members that she was on the EC/IR diet and was not interested in *diet* advice. Without this knowledge and in an effort to helpful members offered all kinds of advice and hence came the EC/IR diet contraindications.


Kathy Brinkerhoff

SE/WI 2007

--- In EquineCushings@..., "jennifer" <jennifermandy@...> wrote:

The members should speak up in these cases. I lurk there and did speak up, when a member who is also on this list got recommendations regarding diet that contradicted those recommended here.
The list member in any case does stick to this list's diet recommendations anyway. :D


Re: For trimming help NOW: A chord has been struck!

 

Hi Linda,

I have a two word comment...

AMEN and WOW... (Ma'am!)



Jan ~ Dandy & Rusty

Pac NW (WA) ~ 1/09
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory4/files/Jan%20Monstad/
<../../../../../ECHistory4/files/Jan%20Monstad/>


--- In EquineCushings@..., "Linda" <PapBallou@...> wrote:

But, my rant, again, goes for the owner who is being pressured to do
something. If you don't want to do what you are being pressured to do,
find someone else to work with you.

If you are the trimmer/farrier who is frustrated with what you see as
unwillingness by an owner to follow your recommendations, and you
believe your recommendations or philosophy is right, then don't go back!
Simple as that.

Whew - I feel better.

Linda (Ret USAF)
EC Primary Response
West Coast
May 2004

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