Date   

Re: measuring minerals out

Nancy C
 

Hi Erin and Lars

We have this info already listed here and in the NRCPlus Group files.

BULK MIXING MINERAL BATCHES.pdf 69KB
Things you should know when doing mixing your own minerals.

If you have comments or questions, we'd love you to keep them on list as part of group protocol.  So we all can benefit.

Thanks very much for your help with this.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
Equine Cushing's and Insulin Resistance Group Inc.

 







---In EquineCushings@..., <spottythehorse@...> wrote :

- - - - -

Hi Erin,

If you send me a private e-mail I will send you a short description on how to make your own custom mineral mix.

Lars
Sweden, July 2008 



Re: Making ODTB palatable

beverly meyer
 

My senior mare gets zero hay and will eat ALL other food except ODTB cubes. Not picky!
I am mixing with Standlee Timothy/Alfalfa and lots of BP, but she strongly dislikes more than a bit of ODTB.
One month and no change.
Any suggestions on making ODTB palatable?  The picky eaters file were mostly eating hay, or were refusing minerals. She is refusing ODTB. 
Only relevant suggestion was soaking in hot tea, or changing to soybean hulls instead!
Thanks so very much.


Re: confusion of pergolide dosage in the files

bigwhitevan2002
 

Umm , odd question on this subject,

 as I understand whole heartedly the struggle with affordability and I also cannot justify such an open ended expense, which is why I was having such a troubled day when I got the bill for the meds,...if this was a monthly expense well......I would just have to say good bye....

?Can someone in the states get a scrip for a " clients' horse and mail  it to the 'client' in Australia? seems legit to me but I am not a lawyer, ....? 

To Leigh, the Pharmacy I used is Pet Health Pharmacy , I think my initial price was so high because I ordered 8 scrips, probably no other way around it to get my two horses up to the 1mg dose gradually..

I am calling them today to find out if this is the case..

To Lisa, the work was never pointless, your efforts have made huge difference in Miami well being and comfort even if its for a short time it was never pointless, because you have been helping him , and that is the point, its the journey that matters , and at the end of the journey even if its a short one, you have already made all the difference in the world to your guy , because you took on the work , put in the efforts, and HELPED him.



Julie
Oregon 06


Re: measuring minerals out

lars_a_swe
 

---In EquineCushings@..., <chf1752@...> wrote :

I'm looking for a scoop that will hold the weight of minerals I need to feed, so all I have to do is pick up the right scoop. 

- - - - -

Hi Erin,

If you send me a private e-mail I will send you a short description on how to make your own custom mineral mix.

Lars
Sweden, July 2008 



Speedi Beet and iron

beverly meyer
 

Speedi Beet says no need to rinse. Just soak briefly and serve.

It is gray in color and has 762 mg. iron per 2.2 pounds.

Any feedback on rinsing?
How much iron does Standlee beet have?  Files say ppm but I don't know how to translate that to mg.

Thanks,

Beverly Meyer

5/14

Fred and Ginger


Re: Phyto Quench for Pain

palomino.1982@...
 

Ellen-

Message # 97861 from Dr. Kellon:

Phyto-Quench is a unique product. It's a blend of anti-
inflammatory/anti-oxidant herbs and nutrients:

Quercitin
Boswellia extract
Grape seed extract
Ginkgo Biloba extract
N-acetyl cysteine
Vitamin E
Vitamin C
Capsacin
Curcumin
Ginger
Citrus bioflavinoids
Pancrelipase
Bromelain
Lipoic acid
Niacin

It was formulated for chronic conditions, where the coagulation
cascade is activated. You can literally see improved perfusion and
color in horses with extensive wounds when they're put on this. It's
one of my favorite products for a variety of painful and
inflammatory or allergic conditions.

You can also do your own search through our message archives.

Susan
EC Primary Response
Oceanside,CA 2007



Phyto Quench for Pain

eswilli2@...
 

Can you direct me to an article or conversation that Really explains why and how Phyto Quench is good for pain. Thanks in advance.

Ellen Willis
Strafford New Hampshire
Joined March 2014
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Ellen%20Willis/


quantified vs. metabolically active ACTH

cgunderm
 

Hi,


I discussed with my vet the idea of taking my two Cushings horses (who are in the beginning stages of Cushings, with ACTH levels in the 70s and 80s last fall) off pergolide during the spring months (they are on 1mg of Pergolide each), particularly March/April/May/June. He didn't like the idea. He said if I absolutely wanted to take them off it, it should be December/January/February because those were the months where the equine metabolism is least active (and I didn't like *that* idea because it was in December/January/February that my mare Lili foundered winter before last) . But what struck me most is that he distinguished between metabolically active ACTH and metabolically passive ACTH. He said so far ACTH assays only quantify ACTH levels, but tell us nothing about whether it's active or not. For this reason, some horses will develop laminitis with levels much lower than others, who are not laminitic with higher quantifiable levels. Since we cannot measure this activity/passivity right now, he recommends keeping them on pergolide at all times because we just don't know. He is an ex-research vet from Cornell, so not someone whose take I would just dismiss as uninformed. I just wondered whether people had heard of this before on here, and what your opinion of it was.


Thanks,


Christian


with Lili (13 yo PerchX, Cushings), Caspio (16yo Andalusian, Cushings), and two others.

Western Massachusetts

January 2013



Re: Got a second opinion, more than just Cushing's? uploaded Ellie's first CBC.

Nancy C
 

Hi Diane

I understand being confused.  Want to send you back to Dr Kellon's earlier post to you:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/conversations/messages/187173

 

I really doubt a vet can tell you what stage of PPID this is conclusively without  necropsy. Don't want to be doing that.

Recommend you focus on getting the PPID under control.  It can be done.  181 is out of range but many, many have dealt successfully with the level.  

Also get your diet in order.  Test the hay and balance.  Based on past supplement use that will be a huge step forward for Ellie.

If the issue is not PPID or dietary related and comes roaring back, she will be much better able to deal with it with PPID and diet under control.

I can't speak to your CBC's and Dr Kellon has already done so in the above message.  Here's a couple links about fibrinogen testing.

https://ahdc.vet.cornell.edu/sects/clinpath/modules/coags/fibtest.htmhttp://www.abaxis.com/pdf/Study_Jan_Feb_Measurement_of_Equine_Fibrin.pdf

 

Keep breathing and hug your horse.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
Equine Cushing's and Insulin Resistance Group Inc.

 







---In EquineCushings@..., <dshoenfelt@...> wrote :



I'm so confused.

Dianne and Ellie
South Central, PA
May 2014
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Dianne%20and%20Ellie/

 








Re: Bea's blood work from Cornell

Nancy C
 

Hi Michele

Want to second Maggie's recommendations.  I would hold of on riding her until you know more.  Hand walks would be good if she remains comfortable.

Would be really interested in hearing more from your vet and Cornell about your results.  IMO she's a good example of not needing the OST to show she's IR.  Her baseline insulin/glucose and  eACTH would have shown her condition without the risk of the glucose challenge.

Hang in there.  With practice it gets easier in a short time.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
http://ecirhorse.org/index.php/equine-cushing-s-and-insulin-resistance-group-inc



---In EquineCushings@..., <spiral1957@...> wrote :

 It's good that the fatty puffs above her eyes are gone.  Can you send us some photos of her feet?

Maggie, Chancey and Spiral in VA

March 2011
EC Primary Response
Yahoo Groups

 


Re: Got a second opinion, more than just Cushing's? uploaded Ellie's first CBC.

dshoenfelt@...
 

I did just upload Ellie's first CBC, taken on may 19th to compare to the one taken on May 28th if anyone wants  to take a look.

Thanks,
Dianne and Ellie
South Central PA
May 2014
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Dianne%20and%20Ellie/


Got a second opinion, more than just Cushing's? uploaded Ellie's first CBC.

dshoenfelt@...
 

The vet I've been working with has been concerned about Ellie's high fibrinogen levels (900 on her first CBC, 500 on the second after 6 days on SMZ's)  Actually a little more concerned about this than the Cushing's alone.

I got a second opinion on the lab results and that vet is in agreement that "whatever else" is going on is of more concern than the cushing's alone at this point. 

We all agree that this recent dramatic weight loss, behavior/energy diminishment, lethargy etc must have been caused by something other than just Cushing's, since it came on so quick?  No one can seem to figure out what "else" is going on with this mare?

This vet said he would suggest more bloodwork in two weeks to see if her fibrinogen levels have stayed in the normal range (he was concerned that it was still high-normal - 500, and not lower)  His concern is that "whatever" this thing is, may come roaring back after the SMZ's are discontinued?  (My current vet seems to think her CBC points toward kidney trouble.  This new vet was not so convinced that kidney is the issue.)

The second-opinion vet also said that Ellie has pretty "significant" cushings, and must have been Cushinoid for quite some time for her levels to be 181.  She is not an early case of cushing's, but rather late stage?

Late stage cushing's really surprised me, because she doesn't have the typical long curly hair coat, no cresty neck, no fatty patches, no foot soreness or laminitis at all what-so-ever.  My current vet wasn't even going to run a Cushing's test, and would not have done so if I hadn't asked for it, because she didn't think the mare looked typical Cushing's either.  She also seems to think we've caught it early?  So is she early or late stage, I just don't know anymore?? 

I'm so confused.

Dianne and Ellie
South Central, PA
May 2014
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Dianne%20and%20Ellie/

 








CASE HISTORIES: WHY THEY ARE IMPORTANT

ThePitchforkPrincess@...
 

Your horse's Case History is the most important step to be completed upon joining the Equine Cushings List. A well filled out and up-to-date Case History is critical for obtaining timely and relevant advice from the volunteers.

Provide as much information as possible. There are sections to enter data on physical symptoms, diet, exercise, blood tests, owner observations, past veterinary care or anything that you feel may be relevant to your horse's condition.

Please use standard units of measurement. To ensure the usefulness of your blood work results, be sure to include the type of units used by the lab and the lab's normal ranges. This will not only help the volunteers to help your horse, but will provide scientific data to help the ECIR group gain the trust of science-based equine professionals and shape future protocols.

Don't delay posting your case history if you are missing some pieces, it can be updated when you have the information you are still gathering. However, the faster your case history is up and completed, the faster you will receive support from the Volunteers or Dr. Kellon.

Don't be afraid to link to additional information about your horse. Links that take volunteers to photos, videos, x-rays, specific messages in the ECIR groups or other sources of information can help support staff better understand your horse's situation. This means you and your horse will benefit from answers faster. 

When posting questions in the group make sure you include a link to the folder that contains your case history so volunteers can find your information quickly and easily.

When the time comes that you or your horse no longer needs the ECIR List's advice, as a gesture of “giving back” to the group please leave your Case History, photos, x-rays etc. for the group to access. Your horse's information can be used to provide answers to future questions and help other horses. Additionally please fill out any of the polls or database tables that apply to you.

Templates, instructions and an example for posting Case Histories can be found here:
http://tinyurl.com/3hzhwz

Thank you for your cooperation.

Owners, Moderators & Primary Response Teams of the Equine Cushings Lists

 



Re: confusion of pergolide dosage in the files

bizzibizzigirl
 

Hi Pauline

How does that dose of Prascend work out? If you're giving 11mg of compounded now, how can you give 1mg Prascend instead?

I'm facing going back to liquid. I've done my math and at present dose, it's around $1700 a year. I just cannot justify that, no matter how much we love him and how hard I've fought :(

Bova make a 1mg in 1ml suspension so I think this will be my next option.  

I also found out today that my clinic marks up drugs by 110%.  Really doesn't seem fair on long term use drugs.  Was going to email you Pauline to see if you can help me out at all.  I have a friend asking another vet on my behalf too in hope of acquiring more cheaply.

This has made all my hard work seem pointless now.

Lisa & Miami
Victoria, Australia


Re: Bea's blood work from Cornell

Maggie
 

>I just uploaded Bea's findings from Cornell...

Hi Michele,

Bea's lab work is not the labs we normally ask for, which is a single blood draw for an eACTH, insulin, glucose and leptin on a NON-fasting horse.  The numbers are somewhat confusing as reported and I suggest that you call your vet and/or Cornell for interpretation.  You are right that we do not have columns in the case history form for the tests that you did, so you would not be able to enter your particular lab results except the baseline ACTH and PRE-OST insulin, which are both elevated.  Did you fast Bea for these labs?  What labs did you do on June 2nd when you retested her?  The ACTH of 88.6 and insulin of 48.66 shows that Bea is both PPID and IR, so a double whammy high risk for laminitis.  Though exercise is good, continuing to ride this horse is very risky as her laminae could be very fragile and you risk fracturing those connections.  Our goal is NO laminitis and I would want to see her numbers in a much better range before I rode her or worked her a round pen, which also puts strain on fragile laminae.  Long straight lines with no tight turns would be appropriate exercise for Bea at this point.  It's good that the fatty puffs above her eyes are gone.  Can you send us some photos of her feet?

Maggie, Chancey and Spiral in VA
March 2011
EC Primary Response
Yahoo Groups

 


Hello

Shellie Galpin
 

Hi l am new to the group and have a beautiful mare with Cushing. She was diagnosed 5 months ago. We have been to hell and back in that short time.  Toadie my mare has suffered with major hoof abscesses in all 4 feet at one time, had some rotation in all 4 feet also and has had 3 respiratory infections.  She is currently sick ATM with a vet appointment this Friday. Scope and x-rays. She had a build up of pus in her head that is coming out a green/yellow colour with a horrid smell.  Vet cant put her on the right meds until they know which way to treat her. Only other problem is l have to float her there, at least one hr drive and Toadie has had 2 seizures before she went on the Pergolide.  So l am a but  nervice/scared about her being in a float.  She has had bloods taken on Monday to re-check her levels, to see if she is getting not enough/to much Pergolide.  I don't understand why she is sweeting extensively atm, the slightest heavy rug and she is dripping.

I am hoping to find wonderful people on this site in similar or experienced situations as l now find my self.

Thanku Regards Shellie

  


Re: confusion of pergolide dosage in the files

Leigh Jacobs
 

Julie,
I use Pet Health Pharmacy. For a 2 month supply of 3.25mg caps, I pay less than $61.
Leigh, Ace&Shadow
Tucson 2011

Sent from Leigh's iPhone

On Jun 3, 2014, at 5:45 PM, "threecatfarm@... [EquineCushings]" <EquineCushings@...> wrote:

 

Thanks Pauline.  Somehow I missed that info. Wish it were not so.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
http://ecirhorse.org/index.php/equine-cushing-s-and-insulin-resistance-group-inc




Re: confusion of pergolide dosage in the files

bigwhitevan2002
 

ahhh, I see, well that makes sense sort of, I will call and find out, I did not order online , the vet had her office manager do it with me dictating what I wanted in her other ear, 

This info makes me feel a little better, I just was not going to be able to afford that for the next X amount of years, it has been weighing heavy on my mind today..

As always Thanks for all the help, suggestions and support.
Julie
Oregon ,06


Re: confusion of pergolide dosage in the files

PapBallou@...
 



..cost me a bit over 223$ that works out to 2.00$ a day , somehow I was thinking the compounded pergolide was a bit less expensive


Julie -

Did you order online?  You should have an invoice with everything broken down for you.

Like Mandy, I'm wondering if they aren't charging you more for the lower dose caps since they may not have them on the shelf as they do with the more typical 1 mg, 2 mg doses etc, and have to special process them.

Linda
EC Primary Response
West Coast
May 2004


Re: confusion of pergolide dosage in the files

Sara Gooch
 

Julie,

It's my understanding that the pharmacy I use, Pet Health Pharmacy, has a  $27 or $29 "minimum" for any prescription order they fill. So you are probably being charged that or a similar minimum for each of the dosages, even if the dosage is just a few pills. And your monthly bill wouldn't be at all that high once the dosages are consistent.  

I forget exactly what I pay for 30,  3mg capsules, but it's in the mid-30-something range.


Pet Health Pharmacy is very helpful about answering questions--I imagine others are too.  If in doubt about the extended cost, call and ask the pharmacy.


Good luck--


Sara,  2011 NE California




 

 

  

96341 - 96360 of 279932