Date   

Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

Hannah T
 

Forgot to sign off.Hannah, Uk
1/8/14
Ziggy and Jaffa

Yahoo! Groups

 


Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

Hannah T
 

And Formula for Feet people just just told me it also has soya concentrate in it. Well blow me down with a feather. Michelle and unks, thankyou very much. Ziggy is coming off it and we will see what happens with the seizures.Next step-does anyone in the Uk know of a great vit/min balancer that has everything in in like formula for feet, but without the alfalfa and soy?!Hannah,Uk
1/8/14
Ziggy and Jaffa

Yahoo! Groups

 


Best time to retest?

Bonnie
 

Although my pony Lad was controlled on 12 mg pergolide in January of this year ( 5 pmol/L) his July ACTH was 20.6 pmol/L.

His dose is now 24 mg pergolide. He has been at this dose for 10 days.

When should his ACTH be retested? 

 Bonnie Ivey, Ontario 12/08

Lad , IR/PPID
  ECHistory6

 

 


Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

Hannah T
 

Oh my god unksblaze. All it says is 'dried forage' on my bag. I am going to call them straight away and take Ziggy off it. Why aren't they more specific with things? I am so cross! Thankyou for the 'heads up'.


Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

 

Hannah - In your CH you say you are giving Ziggy Formula for feet - Have you checked the ingredients?  The first ingredient is Alfalfa meal and your CH says Ziggy is allergic to Alfalfa. Michelle might have something here.Jean in very hot South Carolina
with Amber, Buster and Nikki
August 2004


Re: Pergolide to give away

Sandra Hodge
 

Hi Diane,
My aged gelding is on powder form, but will take your capsules.  Please advise price for same.
Thank you,
Sandra Hall
ERICK..OK...73645


On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 4:44 PM, "aet001@... [EquineCushings]" wrote:


 
Diane, I'm so sorry for your loss.  How kind of you to "pay it forward" with your Pergolide.  Fly free, Rocky, green grass and blue skies forever.  Amy in PA '06ish (Herbie IR, Darby, lost beloveds on the HIH site Echo, Dylan, Pebbles, Cherry, Misty who was C/IR)
---In EquineCushings@..., wrote :

My PPID horse, Rocky, had to be put down as a result of colic. I have
52, 2mg Pergolide capsules from Pet Health pharmacy that I will send to
someone who can use them.

Diane



Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

Hannah T
 

Thanks Michelle,He is only on soaked hay,pergolide and a vit/min supplement. He doesnt get anything else because the slightest thing puts weight on him (even soaked and rinsed speedibeet). The food allergy thing is really interesting.I already know he has intolerances to alfalfa, molasses, and all grain and soy so he doesn't have those things anymore. So I am at a bit of a loss if this is an allergy. He has been on the same batch of hay since last year also.
I did wonder if anyone was feeding him at my yard so I have put up a camera in his stable, and we plan to move yards when he has stabilised a bit. What product was your soy in? Could it be something in my hay I wonder?
I am thinking of putting him on ginseng, but am a bit scared to because of his intolerances.  I know a lot of humans do well on it but I am actually allergic to it myself so you never know with a horse either!


Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

attreeking
 

Hi Hannah,

I have a shetland pony who had seizures and it was food allergy, he's allergic to Soya products. I went through
the same thing with my equine vet, thinking it was the medication, tumour size (ended up doing brain scans) etc
Sammy would suddenly starting shaking,  staggering, then ataxia would set in. He would also get nystagmus in his eyes.

If you are giving him any bagged feed, I would cut this out and see if that helps, and keep everything very basic
for the moment, just a basic forage only diet and unmolassed sugar beet and his medication. I would'nt add any further supplements at this point from this company, I would give Ziggy a chance to settle down for a few weeks and see from there. 

Hope this helps.

Best regards,

Michelle
UK - joined 2007





 



To: EquineCushings@...
From: EquineCushings@...
Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2014 03:18:11 -0700
Subject: [EquineCushings] Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

 
Hello,I am now up to 3/4 of a 1mg Prascend pill with Ziggy per day. We went up to this dose yesterday after being on a 1/2mg for 4 days. He had another seizure in his stable last night and has 2 black eyes. The vet has been out and given him a neurological exam and cannot find anything wrong apart from the partial blindness in his left eye. He has had a few seizures this year already but before he started on the Prascend. I don't know if the seizure was due to the Prascend dosage increasing because he did loose control of himself neurologically when we first started on the 1mg dose.
I have found a few other people on the internet who's ponies have had seizures after starting Prascend. Then again, one vet has told me that he could be having seizures because of the pituitary tumour increasing and pressing on his brain. It's very very distressing to witness.
My vet has advised me to stay on this 3/4mg dose per day for a week, and to only decrease it back to 1/2mg if Ziggy continues to have seizures or side effects. If things go smoothly, to increase up to 1mg after a week.
He has not gone off his food this time round but is still very depressed. I have also noticed a foul odour coming from his stable since I have started Prascend. It seems to increase every time his dosage increases, and then stabilise a bit. I have checked teeth, droppings etc and even for a dead animal.But it seems to be coming from his pores. Does anyone have any thoughts on the above?
Lastly, whilst surfing around the internet, I found this site online.It is a British site, and I wondered what everyone thought about the products they are selling.
MetabolicHorseCo
 


Thanks,

Hannah
1/8/14,Uk
Ziggy and Jaffa
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Hannah/
Yahoo! Groups

Yahoo! Groups





Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

Hannah T
 

Hi again group,Could anyone help me out with the correct dosage for american ginseng? Would you recommend the powder form?

Hannah,Uk
1/8/14
Ziggy and Jaffa

Yahoo! Groups

 


Re: 2 crippled ponies.Please help.

Hannah T
 

Hello,I am now up to 3/4 of a 1mg Prascend pill with Ziggy per day. We went up to this dose yesterday after being on a 1/2mg for 4 days. He had another seizure in his stable last night and has 2 black eyes. The vet has been out and given him a neurological exam and cannot find anything wrong apart from the partial blindness in his left eye. He has had a few seizures this year already but before he started on the Prascend. I don't know if the seizure was due to the Prascend dosage increasing because he did loose control of himself neurologically when we first started on the 1mg dose.
I have found a few other people on the internet who's ponies have had seizures after starting Prascend. Then again, one vet has told me that he could be having seizures because of the pituitary tumour increasing and pressing on his brain. It's very very distressing to witness.
My vet has advised me to stay on this 3/4mg dose per day for a week, and to only decrease it back to 1/2mg if Ziggy continues to have seizures or side effects. If things go smoothly, to increase up to 1mg after a week.
He has not gone off his food this time round but is still very depressed. I have also noticed a foul odour coming from his stable since I have started Prascend. It seems to increase every time his dosage increases, and then stabilise a bit. I have checked teeth, droppings etc and even for a dead animal.But it seems to be coming from his pores. Does anyone have any thoughts on the above?
Lastly, whilst surfing around the internet, I found this site online.It is a British site, and I wondered what everyone thought about the products they are selling.
MetabolicHorseCo

 



Thanks,

Hannah
1/8/14,Uk
Ziggy and Jaffa

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Hannah/

Yahoo! Groups

Yahoo! Groups



Re: Soaking hay

PapBallou@...
 

Hi -
Some people think it's iron, but iron is red/orange.  Most is simply plant pigments.  If you have any sun bleached hay and soak it, you'll find the water a very light color.

Linda
EC Primary Response
West Coast
May 2004


Re: Soaking hay

Deborah Ide
 

Does that mean that when you see brown or dark "post soak" water, the hay had iron on it and that 's why the water is brown or (looking at the next post about "hay tea" does it just mean that that is the natural color that occurs when grass is soaked? Deborah
Connecticut
November 2012


Re: MIRG calculations

k frog
 

Nancy,
 The labs were run at Phoenix Central Laboratory in Washington State. They were ordered by another Veterinarian.
 Insulin 7.6uIU/ML  Ref. Range 10 - 30 uIU/ML
 Glucose 93 Mg/dL  Ref. Range 60 - 120
This sample was submitted 8/2/14
We drew labs today and will send to Cornell for an ACTH, Insulin, Leptin, and Glucose.
Thanks,
Karen
Oregon, 2013


Re: pictures

tross24
 

I would really appreciate someone advising me on what to feed an older cushings horse that is still very competitive as a sport horse. Presently giving Triple Crown Senior but I do see it has alfalfa in it as a first ingredient. Also, advice on hay would be great.
Thank you
Margaret

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 19, 2014, at 6:28 PM, "'karen ansteensen' kansteen5545@... [EquineCushings]" <EquineCushings@...> wrote:

 



Thank you Lavinia -
    Much appreciated.
Karen
Scarborough, ME
May 2014


Re: pictures

karen ansteensen <kansteen5545@...>
 


Thank you Lavinia -
    Much appreciated.
Karen
Scarborough, ME
May 2014


Re: pictures

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Karen,

I added your pics to Bay Lady's album. Here's the link:


https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/photos/albums/1235401778


Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut

Jan 05, RI

EC Support Team










Re: MIRG calculations

Nancy C
 

Hi KarenThe full IR Proxies paper is in the files.
Blood Testing for IR  Cushings Disease tinyurl.com/2kqu5v

Look for

IR PROXIES ORIGINAL

The PONY FIELD STUDY is also there.

 This is the equation listed

Proxies adapted for basal plasma
glucose (mg/dL) and insulin (mU/L) concentrations

HOMA25 = (glucose − insulin)/22.5
QUICKI15 =(log [glucose X insulin])–1
Glucose-to-insulin ratio = glucose/insulin
HOMA-BC%25 = (20 X insulin)/(glucose − 63)
Insulin-to-glucose ratio = insulin/glucose
RISQI = 1/√insulin = insulin–0.5
MIRG = (800 − 0.30 X [insulin − 50]2)/(glucose − 30)
HOMA = Homeostasis model assessment. QUICKI = Quantitative
insulin sensitivity check index. HOMA-BC% = Percent HOMA–betacell
function. RISQI = Reciprocal of the square root of insulin. MIRG
= Modified insulin-to-glucose ratio

Are you able to share the lab values, reference range, and which lab you are using?

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
Equine Cushing's and Insulin Resistance Group Inc.

 




---In EquineCushings@..., <kfrogner@...> wrote :



We have a horse with normal G:I and RISQI, but symptoms all say IR.


Thanks, 

Karen CVT

Oregon, 2013


 


Re: Pergolide to give away

aet001@...
 

Diane, I'm so sorry for your loss.  How kind of you to "pay it forward" with your Pergolide.  Fly free, Rocky, green grass and blue skies forever.  Amy in PA '06ish (Herbie IR, Darby, lost beloveds on the HIH site Echo, Dylan, Pebbles, Cherry, Misty who was C/IR)
---In EquineCushings@..., <dianeschneider1@...> wrote :

My PPID horse, Rocky, had to be put down as a result of colic. I have
52, 2mg Pergolide capsules from Pet Health pharmacy that I will send to
someone who can use them.

Diane


MIRG calculations

k frog
 

My boss is trying to figure out the math behind the MIRG calculations. I gave him a copy of the calculations off the Freil site (copy below) but he does not see a valid equation here. Help?

MIRG
Horses that have elevated blood glucose, or abnormally low insulin responses, may have RISQI and G:I results that are normal because they have actually crossed the line from insulin resistance to actual diabetes.
MIRG = modified insulin:glucose ratio. It is calculated by: [800 0.3 x (insulin 50)2] /(glucose 30)]. If G:I ratio or RISQI are positive, there is no need to do this calculation, but if the horse has symptoms of IR and those equations are normal, you should check the MIRG, especially if blood glucose is elevated. A MIRG result greater than 5.6 means the horse is IR and at risk of laminitis


We have a horse with normal G:I and RISQI, but symptoms all say IR.


Thanks, 

Karen CVT

Oregon, 2013



Re: New Member from Colorado

Suzanne Mansolilli
 

Uhg! I just spent about an hour on an addendum to this post and it DISAPPEARED when I inadvertently swept my cursor over a link I included.  BEWARE you all don't make the same mistake!!!
Anyway, thanks to all of you who taught me how to search the files for the info I needed to convince my veterinarian to do Monty's IR bloodwork NON-fasting, we now have an appointment for next Tuesday.  However...as I mentioned in the previous post below, 2 weeks ago I changed Monty's hay from an 8.9% s/s that he had been free-feeding through a small-hole hay net for the last year, to a 1.9% s/s.  Also, at the same time, because of Monty's excess weight (body score 7) and per suggestion from my vet and this group, I am feeding 2 meals/24 hr at the rate of 1.5% of current body weight.  

But my concern is the marked change in his attitude toward his food. When he free fed on the old hay, he ate approximately 18 lbs/24 hr (2% of current body weight), eating for 15-20 minute periods and napping in-between.  Now, during the last 2 weeks on the limited feeding schedule, he'll eat his portion from a hay net, but he doesn't stop from the time it's given to him until it's gone (7am - 12pm with a forced 1-hr break somewhere in the middle when I clean his boots and re-wrap his abcess.  Then he eats manure and searches the dry lot for anything on the ground that resembles hay, taking a few breaks for napping, for the next 7 hrs until it's time for the evening meal.  So he eats over a pound an hour on the "meal" schedule, whereas he ate much slower free-fed. 

I know how important it is for him to reduce his weight, but I'm concerned that this new eating style directly contradicts the intentions of all the literature I gathered for my veterinarian concerning the advantages of the non-fasting test.  My test is scheduled for 1 week from today, and I just switched him back to the free-feeding to calm him down. What should I do?? Is this OK or should I go back to the meals?  

I posted the analysis for both the old and new hays here:

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/SuzanneM/ 

 

The old hay is the "Terry Porter ..." and the new is "Delta Hay Company's North End Middle" sample. Maybe from this you could tell me if he'll get as fat on the new stuff as he did on the old, or maybe it just depends on how much he eats of the new stuff.

At the same time, could you advise on which hay out of the 3 analyses from the Delta Hay Company I should purchase for the upcoming year?  I purchased a bit from the North End Middle cut as an emergency measure to get him off the stuff that disagreed with him so this last year.  Then I'll need help with mineral balancing.

I thank you for your support, or otherwise I'd be crazy by now.



---In EquineCushings@..., <suzannemansolilli@...> wrote :

I must mention that just this past week I changed Monty's hay from one that was 8.9% combined ESC + starch (which is what he'd been eating since last summer)  to a new hay that is 1.9% ESC + starch and 14.2 NSC.  I'm hoping it's OK to change his diet before the bloodwork???  I felt it was necessary to get him off the old hay ASAP, as I felt it was tipping him over the edge in regards to his foot soreness and rotation and the barn I'm at won't soak hay.  
 

SuzanneM and Monty

Western Colorado -- July, 2014

Case History:  https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/SuzanneM/

Photos:  https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/photos/albums/1794323561

 

---In EquineCushings@..., <gentpony@...> wrote :

Hi SuzanneM

 

 

 

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/conversations/messages/160091

  

(sorry link not working for me right now):

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/files/Blood%20Testing%20for%20IR%20%26%20Cushings%20Disease/

 

 

You already see physical signs of crestiness and patchy fat.  We use the IR test results (remember to get leptin, too) to monitor how effective the current diet is for controlling insulin resistance and to what degree, so the fact that Monty is eating prior to the blood draw is important.   If also PPID, that can complicate things, since PPID can also lead to insulin resistance, even if the ACTH is within the lab normals.  You may need tighter mineral balancing, lower s/s, more exercise, or even higher levels of pergolide to control IR, depending on the circumstances.   You will have a clearer idea where you stand with these persistent symptoms and the degree of IR / PPID control if you test, and at the same time will get a basis for evaluating any future changes.

 

Eva

SW Ontario,  Mar 2005

 

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