Date   

resistance to pergolide?

macivor19@...
 

Do horses become resistant to pergolide?  I've been upping the amount of Prascend I'm giving based on frequent peeing.  Should I just let ACTH run a little high this time of year to prevent resistance down the line? Or does this make any sense at all? This is my time with seasonal rise.


Thank you, someone, for helping!  


casey oregon 2015

I tried attaching my folder, but each time it switched to History 8... 



Cornell labs and timing of being fed

lj friedman
 

I;ve always had labs done at 11;30 am..  after breakfast and before lunch.. Next lab draw will be betw 1-2pm  with lunch fed  around 11:30-12 noon.. should I hold back lunch till after the blood draw for acth insulin glucose and leptin?  lj friedman san diego nov 2014


White Urine Spots

Suzanne Mansolilli
 

Apologies if this is a duplicate post, seem to have lost the previous one.


After having refused to eat his minerals since June, I've recently been able to get Monty to accept the required amounts of flax, Vit E, salt  and Quiessence with some APF and a handful of Timothy pellets. He's been eating this mix for a coupe of weeks.  I just got a new load of hay and a new mineral balance, so I've bought some pelleted copper and zinc in hopes they'd be more palatable, with the intention of  adding in each mineral one-by-one to identify what he finds offensive and find appropriate substitute.  


So three days ago, I added pelleted copper and zinc rations as a palatability test.  I must note here that the amounts of the copper and zinc are for his new hay, which he'll be starting in about a week.  Since he's still on the old hay, the Cu & Zn ration is about half of what he should need for his old hay, but it's only a week and it's better than nothing.


But...yesterday I noticed a white residue in about 10 places where he'd urinated.  He also had the white residue on his hind legs and hooves. So yesterday I eliminated the Cu and Zn pellets from the mix, and this morning found no new white urine spots.


Photos of the spots are in my photos folder, link below.


Does anyone have any thoughts on this?  Would the white residue indicate anything potentially harmful to Monty?  And do you think it's fair to think it's the copper or zinc?


Thanks,


SuzanneM & Monty

Western Colorado — July 2014

Photo Album: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/photos/albums/1794323561

CH: ECHistory8



Re: Test Results for Jasper

corrine haffner
 

Hi Lavinia

I got both perscriptions today so can start upping his dose at 1mg every 2 to 3 days that's 4  0.25 mg capsules will leave me short on those pills.So up to 6 mg? 

Diet i'll do the ODTB cubes although he's not eating them real great last day or so,would 25lbs total a day be enough without hay in his diet?? Still gotta post on the hoof issue been busy with colicing issues today,will try and get a post up this evening.  He's pretty lethargic today along with colic issues.

Do i just cut hay out of diet now? or wait till he's on close to 25 lbs of cubes? Will i need to re test after he's on the target dose of pergolide for 3 weeks.??


Re: ACTH

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Tiffany,

An ACTH of 49.6pg/ml wouldn't be a red flag if a horse wasn't having any issues. But Maggie is showing classic signs of fall-associated changes and her ACTH level has more than doubled from what it was a year ago so that points toward possible early PPID being a factor. For her, this is a RED ALERT. Some horses will have excruciating foot pain when their ACTH rises even a few points, never mind when it's risen more than twice what it was. A trial of pergolide would not be amiss here.

She was extremely IR last fall as well - was insulin/glucose/leptin tested this time or only ACTH? Why do they want a urine sample? What is her daily water intake amount? Can you get a copy of all the lab work that has been done and post it to your case history?

Really need to see current hoof pix, and xrays when you get them. Horses will always walk on their toes if there is hoof pain as they don't have a way to walk on their heels, even if they want to.


Re: Test Results for Jasper

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Corrine,

Definitely need to up the pergolidedose  as soon as possible as the ACTH has risen considerably since the last testing and is continuing to rise. As he is on 3mg dose now, if he were mine I would be looking at raising it to 5 or 6mg as a target to aim for catching and getting on top of the rise. Would do 1mg changes every 2-3 days as he seems to be responding well to changes in dose now.

The glucose is solidly above the high normal range, making Jasper diabetic as well as PPID. Leptin has risen too.The rising ACTH is playing a part in this but the unknown hay (even tho is is soaked) may also be playing a part. Need to get the diet excruciatingly tight as well, with tested hay + minerals or using all ODTB cubes - whichever works the best.

He won't get any lasting foot comfort until the PPID/IR is solidly controlled. The repeat infections are also linked to this as the PPID and IR will depress the immune system.

Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut
Jan 05, RI
EC Support Team


Re: Jesse.. a few stumbles today

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Agree 100% with both Kathy and Nancy here, Lj.

Jesse's trim did have issues in the beginning and there haven't been any updates in some time so if things have slipped a bit, esp behind, it could easily explain the situation you're seeing.

Easy fix - get the trim on track.

Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut
Jan 05, RI
EC Support Team


---In EquineCushings@..., <threecatfarm@...> wrote :

Agree, Kathy, that feet would be a good first place to look. Hinds are often forgotten, or last minute, and so important, but if the fores are off too, it can cause stumbling, back and hip issues.

---In EquineCushings@..., <kathbrink@...> wrote :


Just a thought...when was his last hoof trim? 




ACTH

Tiffany Woodward
 

I know it has been awhile since I have posted or sought any advice for Maggie.  I have updated her case history as much as possible.  I do not have the most recent x-rays posted as I haven't received those from the vet yet. 

After noting increasing thirst/urination starting in August, her ACTH was rechecked on 9/9/15 (via Cornell).  Result was 49.6.  Vet says that is normal for this time of year.  Her ACTH was checked the first week of October in 2014 and her result then was 17.  Blood was also run at the vet clinic and showed normal kidney function but dehydration.  They have requested urine but I was not able to get a sample since then.  Could this level of ACTH be indicative of early Cushing's?  Is it even high enough to contribute to hoof pain?  Vet says no.

She is VERY sore on her heels.  Frog area, heel area, pressing across back of hoof.  Toes really aren't painful and she actually prefers to walk on her toes.  No evidence of navicular.  Pulses are low, almost normal and have been for a month.  Heel pain persists.  She rakes toes back and stands on a wedge of shavings.





https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/TiffanyWoodward%20and%20Maggie/

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/photos/albums/540173897

 



Re: Test Results for Jasper

corrine haffner
 

Hi Kerry

Jaspers doing ok not great,no haven't got prescription yet so haven't upped pergolide. Vet also gave prescription for the 3 mg, haven't got those either and have 1 more capsule left for tomorrow then i'am out.

Here's results,  Glucose 145 mg/dl  Lab normals   71 -113 mg/dl

ACTH 80.2    Lab normal  9 - 35


insulin 98.4        10 -40


leptin 6.2            1 -4



Corrine & Jasper

MN 4/2014

http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Corrine%20and%20Jasper


Regioinal database update - Volunteer needed

Nancy C
 

We've been talking about the regional database and members have stepped up to loan out a hay corer and  give support regionally. As noted, there have been a lot of new members added to the group since that list was started and adding more volunteers who will help out in their area is a good idea.

We need a volunteer to collect names that can then be put in to the database. IF you are interested in helping with this, please drop me a pm  - threecatfarm "at" cyberpine "dot" net.

Just a reminder, besides the DATABASE and FILES sections,  the LINKS section is also a great resource.


You can access these and MORE under the MORE tab (convenient huh?) on the group home page directly under the cover photo.


Thanks!


Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Please join us at the 2015 NO Laminitis! Conference, Georgetown TX, November 6-8, 2015
Early bird expires September 23, 2015
NO Laminitis!








Re: Jesse.. a few stumbles today

lj friedman
 

Thanks for the reply. Jesse is alert and appears otherwise normal.. His last trim was 8/21 and the feet look okay. Sending in pix for Lavania to look at, is my plan.  lj friedman san diego nov 2014. 


Hay Probe to loan in CA central coast area

Lydia Lawson
 

I bought a hay corer from Equi Analytical and would be willing to loan it out to anyone or help someone get a sample in my area if they need to test hay. I looked in the files but did not find a database for that so just wanted to put it out there. Im in the San Luis Obispo area.

Lydia Lawson
Lydia@...
CA 2008



Re: Jesse.. a few stumbles today

Nancy C
 

Agree, Kathy, that feet would be a good first place to look. Hinds are often forgotten, or last minute, and so important, but if the fores are off too, it can cause stumbling, back and hip issues.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Group mod
February 2003

Early Bird Registration for the 2015 NO Laminitis Conference expires in 11 days.
nolaminitis.org


---In EquineCushings@..., <kathbrink@...> wrote :

Hi Lj,

Just a thought...when was his last hoof trim? 




Re: Jesse.. a few stumbles today

Kathy Brinkerhoff
 

Hi Lj,

Just a thought...when was his last hoof trim?  How is his trim looking and working for him?  I have an arthritic QH who I need to keep any eye on so that his toes and break over are correct or he will drag his hind toes and stumble........and his stride is wonky.    


Kathy Brinkerhoff

SE/WI  10/12




Re: Test Results for Jasper

 

Hi Corrine, how is Jasper and have you been able to increase pergolide yet with your vet's new prescription?

Kerry in NY
Sept 2014


Re: Jesse.. a few stumbles today

 

LJ,

You mentioned Jesse's had a few days off and that its hot -- likely he's just stiff from not moving, as most older horses tend to be (PPID or not) when they miss several consecutive days of working. I'd keep an eye on it but wouldnt worry just yet. Likely when your trainer starts riding again he'll loosen back up.

I find when its exceptionally hot my horses tend to stand around (they live out 24/7) more than usual and the older ones get a bit stiff.

Without any other problems noted I dont think I'd worry too much abt the stumbling just yet. Its excellent you are observing Jesse so astutely -- hopefully you are keeping a journal of your notes.

Is Jesse acting fine in every other way (eating, drinking, urinating, defecating, bright/alert, etc?)

Kerry in NY
Sept 2014


Re: New blood work done

Lorna Cane
 


 >>I don't think I did a great blood draw, would that make much of a difference?

Hi Kimberley,

What do you mean by this?


Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002


*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf








Re: Jesse.. a few stumbles today

lj friedman
 

thanks for the reply.. I guess I'm brainwashed that the answer to everything is to increase pergolide.. Jesse finished a pentosan regimen a few weeks ago as well as being on mov ease.  thanks for suggesting an alternative cause..   lj friedman san diego nov 2014 


Re: Jesse.. a few stumbles today

Valletta Lochridge
 

As a practitioner of Equine Craniosacral Therapy, I see many horses who drag their hinds or stumble in the hinds.  Often, this issue 
is a result of problems in the low back and/or hind limbs.  I'm not saying that this is the cause of Jesse's stumbles today.  I'm only saying that if it continues, (and I would watch it very closely) you may need to look into physical issues and pain.  You've said in the past that Jesse has been diagnosed with arthritis.  Be aware that, as in humans, the arthritis may not be limited to only the joints near the feet.

Valletta in CA
Jan 2012


Re: Jesse.. a few stumbles today

lj friedman
 

With the seasonal rise still in effect., I was told to re-test and re assess mid September.. when does the rise start to taper off.. If the vet is coming out on tuesday, sept 15th, should I re test  cornell labs then? 

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