Re: Hank cushings


Hi Jaini, 

hanks ACTH levels were 86 pg/ml. 

we didn't include an insulin test for Hank, should I have that done now we know he has cushings? What diet should I be starting him on? He's at pasture, would a diet similar to my laminatic horse cookie be ok whilst I make arrangements for a proper nutrition annalysis? My other horse is stabled, on soaked hay, Carol leytons laminitis mix, salt, magnesium, Apple cider vinegar, vitamin e, equine chai, gastro coat, and 1 cup of hygain zero. Is this suitable to get Hank started on some supplements or should I wait until I have something tailored to him? 

Thank you. 


December 2016, Adelaide Hills, SA, Australia

Re: compounding pharmacy

Stephanie Stout

Hi Gail,

I have been using Pet Health since 2014 for Pergolide capsules. They have been wonderful to work with and the shipping is always quick.

Hope that helps.
Stephanie & King
October 2014
Case History 

Re: Updated Tena and Felix files uploaded for feedback


Thank you all for the kind feedback. I am very grateful to this site, Dr. Kellon, Lavinia, and my own farrier, as they are the sole reasons Felix isn't fertilizing cactus. He is finally very comfortable and I am excited and anxious to see how far back he can come! 

Lavinia, yes the radiographs were taken this time in boots with some kind of straps that caused the odd shadows, rather than the wooden blocks from last time. He tends to have a slight pulse on both fores, never on hinds, and some days it is a little easier to find than others. It makes sense to me that it could still be damage from the sinking. Vet noted slight heat in one fore as well, though that wasn't as apparent to me. I look forward to receiving your mark-ups, and please note that the newest hoof pics were taken after latest trim, which was done after radiographs.

Blood work is in and Case History is updated, thanks Paula for the tips! I used IR calculator as well. Vet seems to think Felix might have EMS, is that related to IR? Would I need to run more tests? Is EMS a disease or metabolism? Since the Insulin numbers looked good, I'm hoping the unsoaked Bermuda has acceptable sugar/starch content. I don't have room to store a squeeze, so am continuously hunting for sellers who test hay, but no such luck in Arizona. Anyone have any tips out here? I've been supplementing with the Ontario Dehy Timothy Cubes as much as I can afford. Also in my quests to find low sugar/starch foods, the lowest consistent sugars have been in the Mountain Sunrise Alfalfa Pellets, which are steam bound. The Timothy pellets are usually higher, should I switch to the alfalfa pellets as a carrier for Copper Complete? I also have a friend with a pasture sound recovered founder horse who swears by Lakin Lites, says her horse didn't begin to recover and be healthy until she switched. I don't like the molasses as a binder, and also have read that alfalfa should be fed in low percentages. But is it harmful to feed small amounts of alfalfa? Is the main concern the iron overload? How do small amounts of Alfalfa negatively affect a horse? All I have read is that some horses have adverse reactions with not much explanation. My farrier has suggested beet pulp, but the numbers I have found state that beet pulp is higher in ESC/starch than the plain alfalfa pellets. Should I do a hay analysis on a single or a couple different bales, thinking that they are all similar in this region? Thanks for enduring all these questions.

Jaini, thank you for the feedback about diet and exercise! It's slowly getting less overwhelming. Druid has been a huge inspiration through everything, knowing that he recovered and seeing the painstaking year he endured has helped me press on when Felix was at his worse. With the help of my farrier (we both have so many photos, notes, and memories), I'm sure we could come up with a timeline in the future. I'm hoping Felix will be able to return to work, but we shall see! We are only half way there, but the hardest part is behind us. Thank you for the encouragement.

Tena Federico

Fox, Felix, and Fievel

Apache Junction, AZ

August 2016,,,20,2,0,0

Re: treating laminitis correctly,


On Wed, Jan 25, 2017 at 02:56 pm, LJ Friedman wrote:
never ice a laminitic horse with endocirne problems

I did not know this, but it makes sense in conjunction with cold weather worsening laminitis.   
Shannon and Majik (IR) and Rafiq (PPID/IR, over the rainbow bridge)
Houston 2009

Majik's Photo Album

Rafiq's Photo Album

Re: treating laminitis correctly,

Lorna Cane

Find the last post of Dr. Kellon. Look at the bottom of the message,click on More, click on All Posts by this Member.

Then look for the Subject lines on the topic, and you will find various links, plus her own words wrt icing.


Lorna in Eastern Ontario, Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002

Re: treating laminitis correctly,

LJ Friedman

I didnt find the studies.  I only showed her one of dr kellon's quotes.   are there studies on line?
LJ Friedman San Diego Npv 2014


Re: compounding pharmacy

LJ Friedman

Ive used pet health since nov 2014,  very pleased    I just paid  $3.22 each for 12mg comp perg.--
LJ Friedman San Diego Npv 2014


Signature test


Hey, just checking to see if signature is working. 

Beth and Nosey

Moorefield, WV
Jan 2017

Re: compounding pharmacy

Lavinia Fiscaletti

Hi Erin,

That's the direct link. It's in the Wiki.
Lavinia, Dante and George Too

Jan 05, RI

EC Support Team

Re: compounding pharmacy

Erin R. <caprinesociety@...>


Is Pet Health's pricing similar?  I've been trying to read back posts and it looked liked they were about 15% higher.  I need 9 mg's of perg., and can't afford much over that.

In one of the threads, I heard mention of a list of pharmacies but haven't seen one.  I need to order perg. asap!  I can't believe Thriving Pets did not send out an email to all their pergolide customers.  If they did, I didn't see it but haven't been on the list for a long time.  Has anyone priced Rood & Riddle in Lexington, KY?

Erin and Nick, Ohio, 2008

Pergolide and cyproheptadine?


I have spent a some time reviewing the earlier info on the combo of pergolide and cyproheptadine  A friend, not on this list, was given the combo for a newly 
diagnosed PPID horse.  She called me asking if this combo could possibly cause IR or worsen IR.  I could not find if this was true or not.
I have asked that she join and suggested to use just plain pergolide or Prascend.  Many thanks in advance for your time.
Nancy Reed
San Diego County
Jazzi 2013 (IR, now 8 week post op and doing very well.)

Re: compounding pharmacy

macivor macivor <macivor19@...>

I have used Pet Health for 2 months and like them.
casey oregon

compounding pharmacy


I had been getting my horses’s pergolide from Thriving Pets but they recently moved and are no longer fulling prescriptions.  They recommended Pet Health in Arizona.  I wondered if anyone in the group has experience with this pharmacy or is you have any other suggestions for reputable compounding pharmacies.


Thanks in advance,

Gail Schiel

Re: Floss's Xrays

Lavinia Fiscaletti

Thanks, Tori.

Will have those for you soon.
Lavinia, Dante and George Too

Jan 05, RI

EC Support Team

Re: Nutritional powder exposed to moisture

Karin & Inky <ksherbin@...>

From Patty: Could you have the TC30 and Nutritional Powder together in one container or Baggie, and the beet pulp and oil soaked and mixed together in a bucket?  And then at feeding time just have him thoroughly mix the dry and wet together?  That's what I do, but I'm not at a busy barn. I have a big mixing spoon in the barn. 



I can try. Previously when I have left colanders for r/s/r of beet pulp, or big spoons and big containers for mixing, they have not been used. That is why I try to make things as simple as possible.


Based on the group’s feedback I went out and got a small fridge for the feed room so I could prepare beet pulp in advance that is r/s/r. Usually I can’t get to the barn except on weekends. Someone had said a few days worth of BP could be stored in the fridge, as well as frozen BP that would thaw by the time the merely cold portions are used up.


Currently I have stored 14 meals for the week, the TC 30 and nutritional powder in containers together. I suspect the farmhand is pouring the CocoSoya into the container after the feeding shift is done, i.e., 8 to 12 hours before the next feeding. So after the evening feed, the farmhand prepares the meal for the morning feed. Same routine after the morning feed, prepares for evening feed.


I will see if the farmhand is willing to mix the two components right before feeding as you suggest if no one can say that the nutritional supplement will retain its value if mixed with oil or water products for any length of time.



Karin & Inky

Forest, VA


July 27, 2015





Re: Nutritional powder exposed to moisture


Hi, I don't know the answer about the powder and moisture.  Could you have the TC30 and Nutritional Powder together in one container or Baggie, and the beet pulp and oil soaked and mixed together in a bucket?  And then at feeding time just have him thoroughly mix the dry and wet together?  That's what I do, but I'm not at a busy barn. I have a big mixing spoon in the barn. 

I don't think a week at a time would work.  I believe beet pulp when wet/soaked is only supposed to be refrigerated for a couple days at a time.  Any longer and supposed to be frozen.  I'm thinking if you soaked the powder for 9-12 hrs, it would make all the feed taste bad if it's the taste he doesn't like.  But could be worth a try if it's ok to do with the powder.  

I've also read here that some people have to top dress the minerals rather than mix in.  

Good luck!


Sept 2016

Kernersville, NC

Rated G Case History:

Rated G Photos:

Re: Floss Blood Work

Paula Hancock

On Wed, Jan 25, 2017 at 10:01 pm, <toriadore@...> wrote:
Can I copy and paste it here or is it better to add it to my Case History?

Hi Tori,

That's great news that you have a vet who is more willing to work with you!

Please add the results to your case history and fill in the IR calculation results section as well.  If you have specific questions about the results, you can post that here.

Paula with Cory (IR) and Onyx (IR/PPID)

Bucks County, PA, USA

ECIR Primary Response

NRCplus 2011  ECIR 2014

Re: Splash Lab results

LeeAnne Bloye <ecir.archives@...>

On Wed, Jan 25, 2017 at 03:55 pm, k frog wrote:
(to be updated soon by LeeAnne

 'Tis done:

- ​LeeAnne, Newmarket, Ontario - Email me (If link doesn't work use ECIR.Archives at gmail dot com)
Dawn's 10 Year Case History
Taken For Granite Art - Lightweight Cement Sculpture and Memorials

ECIR Archivist March,2004

Are you in the Pergolide Dosage Database?

View the Database Stats

Nutritional powder exposed to moisture

Karin & Inky <ksherbin@...>

I am trying to figure out a way to get my horse to eat his full dose of nutritional powder without reducing the efficacy of the supplement. He is boarded and the farmhand makes up the meals 9 to 12 hours in advance.


I have tried leaving a small amount of the powder mixed in with TC30 pellets and work up to the full dose of the nutritional powder, custom-mixed by HorseTech. However, when I reach a certain point, not close to the full dose, the horse refuses to eat his meal of TC 30. I am considering adding beet pulp to the meal to further dilute the taste of the powder.



Does moisture over the course of hours or days affect the efficacy of the nutritional powder? Here are two thoughts I had:


1.       The farmhand, who prepares the meals 9-12  hours in advance of feeding, pours Cocosoya oil on the TC 30 and HorseTech mixture and adds beet pulp that is already saturated with water. In other words, the powder is mixed in with Cocosoya oil and moist beet pulp for up to 12 hours.


2.       I prepare the meals for seven days and leave them in the refrigerator I just installed in the feed room. The meals would be a mixture of TC30, the Cocosoya oil , beet pulp and HorseTech supplement. That means the nutritional powder would be mixed in with foodstuffs prepared with oil and water for up to a week. I would do this to ensure that the food is thoroughly mixed and make it easier for the farmhand, who may or may not cut corners depending on how slammed he is.



I also bought peppermint oil but have not asked the farmhand to pour that into the mix. The same question would apply: would leaving the powder in food that contains peppermint oil mixed with water affect the value of the supplement?



I do have a message out to Rod at HorseTech but in case he doesn’t know the answer I thought I’d ask in case anyone here has been in a similar situation. Thanks!



Karin & Inky

Forest, VA


July 27, 2015

Re: Was IR Increase -Now Toe tenderness/pulse Improved


Digital pulse back to normal, toe tenderness reduced/gone(?) but I still have him in padded EasyCare Transition boots. Will remove boots to check his movement and possibly keep him booted a bit longer. He is perky again and feeling better.

Continuing to work on tightening his diet. 
- Bonnie 07-2016

Charles County, Maryland

Mouse Case History, Photo Album

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