Date   

Re: Bloodwork for IR

Maria Duran
 

Finally got it. THANK YOU SO MUCH!
What a difference when you know the whys :)
--
María Durán Navarro
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain) 


Re: Second episode of laminitis ! Not sure why !

Renee
 

Thank you Jaini, 
She got better before I read your message but I started to soak her hay again and she got even better after 24h! So, I will keep doing this till spring.  It help to make her get her supplement because I can sprinkle flax seed and supplements in it. 
Do you think to much grounded flax can be a risk for ulcers or compaction colic? I was giving her 200gr/day.

We are adressing the iron problem in the water this week. We are suppose to get the filtration system Friday! I am still waiting on tri-amino that dr Kellon recommended before. Hope I’ll get it this week to. Everything take longer to get here.

thanks again!
--
Renée and Camilla
Port Cartier, Québec
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Ren%C3%A9e%20and%20Camilla

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=81104


Re: Winter Laminitis - New Case History attached

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

That sounds like progress. The problem with stall rest is they don't move so blood circulation is even worse. When that is an issue they are typically reluctant to start off walking but get better the more they move. You can also give the arginine 3 or 4 times a day, up to 10 grams each time.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Standlee BP pellets - I "did a thing" - would like to post a photo

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Just a guess but it could be a combination of very small dirt/dust particles trapped in a "gel" of very fine beet pulp.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Poll on Weight Loss

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Please take a second to respond to the poll. I should have clarified this is at maintenance and without cold weather stress!

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/message/232299
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Bloodwork for IR

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Epinephrine (adrenalin) causes increased glucose and suppresses insulin: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7001181
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: InsulinWise- would this really help with IR?

ironic_acres@...
 

LJ,
It was my understanding that they use the Dex suppression test to decide if a refund will be given. Not one hundred percent sure, but when I looked at it, I remember that being the deal breaker for me. Equithrive is basically the same thing, correct?
Good luck. Let us know.
Tracy and Migo
Ohio

On Monday, February 18, 2019, 11:04 PM, LJ Friedman via Groups.Io <luke4275@...> wrote:

(found the  message by finally finding the message search box.. thank you for alerting me how to.. etc

Company says there is a synergistic effect with all the ingredients.. making the low dose of reservatol  , not an issue..
the company will return money for the product. if not satisfied.. . I will try for 6 weeks and do cornell  labs.... with a horse over 200 for insulin. like . Jesse..  what is the harm..?   2 # for 30 days. I ordered 4#.. You can order online  easy.... do a search.  ...  My  vet suggested I look at the product..   
--
LJ Friedman  Nov 2014  San Diego, CA

Jesse's Case History 
Jesse's Photos

 


--
Tracy and Migo
Ohio, USA
February 2013

Case History
Migo's Photo Album 
Ω


Re: Bloodwork for IR

Maria Duran
 

I understand that the glucose is a bit raised because the stress triggered a small peak but then how do I know her barely elevated insulin is not caused by the same reasoning? Is it not possible that the pancreas released some more insulin to deal with that small increase in glucose and it is all caused by the stress?

She has other IR symptoms but just making sure I understand all right.

Thanks a lot Dr. Kellon.
--
María Durán Navarro
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain) 


Re: InsulinWise- would this really help with IR?

LJ Friedman
 

(found the  message by finally finding the message search box.. thank you for alerting me how to.. etc

Company says there is a synergistic effect with all the ingredients.. making the low dose of reservatol  , not an issue..
the company will return money for the product. if not satisfied.. . I will try for 6 weeks and do cornell  labs.... with a horse over 200 for insulin. like . Jesse..  what is the harm..?   2 # for 30 days. I ordered 4#.. You can order online  easy.... do a search.  ...  My  vet suggested I look at the product..   
--
LJ Friedman  Nov 2014  San Diego, CA

Jesse's Case History 
Jesse's Photos

 


Re: Micky sheared heels

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Not shifting his weight behind tells you his fronts have been more comfortable - he hasn't been shifting as much weight to the backs to try to get it off his more painful fronts. One thing about the shoes/pads/no trims for extended periods that was positive is that it allowed his soles to add some depth.

If you can't pick up a foot to trim, it can be trimmed by having him stand on a 2x4 with various parts of the foot overhanging the edge of the wood. Or stand the foot on a thick piece of styrofoam and trim right thru the foam. You can also stand him on a thick pile of bedding or in sand, then scrape away around the perimeter of the foot to access it for trimming. This all means that the hoof pro needs to get on the ground to work - not necessarily the most comfortable position for the pro but it gets the job done and makes the horse more comfortable and cooperative. Giving a dose of bute the night before and again the morning of a trim is perfectly acceptable when needed for temporary comfort.

To get sole shots when the horse isn't able to lift a foot for long - see if you can get him to just tilt the foot forward, cocking it on the toe. You can see the sole that way and possibly get the picture. A bit of a contortionist act for you but again - think outside the box and work with whatever the horse is able to give you.

Hang in there.

--
Lavinia and George Too
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
ECIR Support Team


Re: Poll on Losing Weight - Please Respond #poll

Cheryl Oickle
 


--Oops apologies.Please ignore my last comment. I need to read the questions more thoroughly.  I was obviously under feeding my horse on the analysed hay hence the weight loss. Ideal weight 800 lb by tape should be baseline 16 # to maintain. I was feeding 15 of low sugar! She was never over weight to weight loss was not intended.I increased to 18 lb and that’s over 2 per cent to a slow weight gain to ideal of 800#. She is thriving at 17# now a day.
Cheryl and Jewel
Oct 2018

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cheryl%20and%20Jewel

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=81063


Re: Poll on Losing Weight - Please Respond #poll

Cheryl Oickle
 

Jewel was never overweight but once I obtained analysed hay, I was feeding at 1.5 percent of her body weight. She lost a lot of weight.  I increased to 2 per cent and had to increase again to have her plateau in three months We have had an exceptionally cold month and a half here in Southern BC and forage has been increased to keep her weight stable
--
Cheryl and Jewel
Oct 2018

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cheryl%20and%20Jewel

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=81063


Re: Poll on Losing Weight - Please Respond #poll

jmc
 

FWIW, YES not only for my horse who IS IR, but for the slightly chubby mini mule as well (who isn't tested or suspected of IR, just likes to eat) - I suspect she's actually at a proper weight now, though it's hard to tell under all that hair. I believe making sure the ESC+starch is low (6.7%) made the difference, last year my hay was untested (and "much tastier", per the equines) and weight loss was negligible, even with 2% of ideal weight.
--
Jodi
June 2018
NW Wyoming

Yankee Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jodi%20and%20Yankee

Photo Album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=54386


Re: Cadie IR now PPID

Paula Hancock
 

On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 03:13 PM, Vanessa Register wrote:
not so hopeful, but maybe I loaded Cadies Case History.
Hi Vanessa,
For some reason it ended up in the general files and not in your folder, so I loaded it to your case history folder.  If you click on the link in your signature, it should be there now.  When you want to change it, you may need to get one of the moderators to delete for you.
Hope that helps!
 
--
Paula with Cory (IR & PPID?and Onyx (IR/PPID)

  and Remy (ir/PPID)

Bucks County, PA, USA

ECIR Primary Response

NRCplus 2011  ECIR 2014 

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Paula%20and%20Cory

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=1624

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Paula%20and%20Onyx
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Paula%20and%20Remy

 


Re: Cadie IR now PPID

Vanessa Register
 

not so hopeful, but maybe I loaded Cadies Case History.
--
Vanessa Register
Yucaipa, CA

Jan 2011

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cadie%20and%20Vanessa


Re: Micky sheared heels

Kath Chase
 

I will do this for Micky Lavinia,  I’ve got to get it together stop crying, I will do it for my boy.

My biggest problem has always been getting him to hold his feet up ever since  October 2016. Can only pick them up for short periods. Even all the farriers and trimmers have had to give him breaks in between.  Bute has been used for shoeing purposes and sedative was given when formahoof was applied.  The hinds are incredibably difficult even the trimmers and farriers have had problems lifting the hinds more so right hind can only pull it fwd to trim as he can’t pick it up normally.

Will do my very best to get good clear photos and will get them through to you ASAP. Micky was always pigeon toed when I bought him back in 2004.  But movement was straight. Didn’t have lameness issues, but was always kept in shoes as previous owner said he he needs to be kept in shoes,  he always had yucky eyes on and off since 2004 also Every  Farrier since 2004  has said during that time that his feet have never been good. Micky always had regular shoeing done every 6 weeks until the crisis October 2016.

Is interesting since hinds have been under Farrier no.6 and Farrier no.7 we haven’t had the weird movement from behind  and the shifting weight in the hinds has stopped also in past  2 months  and also doesn’t point RF Ike what he used to do frequently.  Just trying to give as much info as possible to help Micky. 

The only thing i cant do, is get Rads :-( I’ve just bought new native grass  hay, and big bag mineral pellets  from same supplier  these have no iron in them the best I can find to give him the best nutrition for his  medial side approx 25% bone  loss, I need to update case history with new hay test also 
Thanks again 

--
Kath Chase & Micky
Yinnar Vic Australia
July 2017
Micky's Case History
Micky's Photos


Re: When to redo bloodwork?

 

Hi, Alanna - ideally, one should test 3 or 4 times per year, but not all of us can afford to do that for various reasons. If you can only test once, then test in about August to make sure you are in a good place for the seasonal rise. If you can test twice, then test in August, and again in October or early November.  If you can test 3 times, then do August, October, and spring (which is April/May here, could be March/April in balmier climes).  Bonnie is correct  to remind us all of what Dr. Kellon says: any time is a good time! It is all useful information.  
--
Jaini Clougher (BSc, BVSc)
Merlin (over the bridge), Maggie, Gypsy, Ranger
ECIR mod/support, BC 09
DDT+E = effective treatment for PPID and EMS/IR equines: https://bit.ly/2J4ZgYT

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jaini%20and%20Merlin-Maggie-Gypsy .
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=34193  
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=39711


Re: Winter Laminitis - New Case History attached

Diana RL
 

Thank you so very much for  all the advice.  How many days before the Jiaogulan takes full effect? I started him on it 7g (one scoop) 3xs a day over the weekend. He gets 5g L-arginine 2xs a day now too.

Upon your recommendation, I "forced" him to walk today and 3 days ago he couldn't even put weight on his feet.  I am hoping the supplements are working and not just wishful thinking on my part.




On Mon, Feb 18, 2019, 2:14 PM Lavinia Fiscaletti <shilohmom@... wrote:
Hi Diana,

Here are a couple of sources for the Jiaogulan powder, which is much more economical for equine-size dosing:

http://www.mybesthorse.com/productsorderhere.html

https://uckele.com/jiaogulan-powder.html

https://www.herbalcom.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=cEcommerce.dspProducts&CategoryID=2403&OrderClause=ProductName,ASC&LinkKey=I

If this is winter laminitis, then gently walking him around the indoor for 5-10 minute initially would be helpful. See how he reacts and fine tune it from there. Sometimes, once you can get them moving they will then move on their own. Need to be careful if he is still on any NSAIDs, tho. Wrapping his feet in wool socks, plastic bags and then putting the boots over all of it will help to keep them warm and dry.

I've added the case history link, as well as your join date and general location to your signature so those should appear automatically now whenever you post. If you could get the hoof pictures and copies of the most recent radiographs uploaded to photo album that would be helpful as well.

Sounds like you are sourcing definitely safe feed - that's great. In the meantime, you can start by adding ground flax (Triple Crown Naturals Golden Flax or Omega Horshine are two economical options), vit E human gelcaps and iodized white table salt to his carrier meals - rinsed/soaked/rinsed beet pulp is one safe option that is usually readily available. Amounts are in found in the emergency diet.

--
Lavinia and George Too
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
ECIR Support Team



Re: Micky sheared heels

Nancy C
 

Hi Kath. 

Beating yourself up up is not allowed. You will hear often “You do the best you can with the info available.” I know how crushing it can be when a light bulb goes off and an understanding of a potential new opens up. Don’t let it get you. Your horse knows you are trying. Give Micky  a hug and get your strong face back on. You can do this. Hang in there. 
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
DDT+E = effective treatment for PPID and EMS/IR equines: https://bit.ly/2J4ZgYT

 


Re: Micky sheared heels

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Kath,

I need a clear sole shot of each foot (all four). Also need a lateral of LF and both hinds: please take it while Micky is standing as squarely as possible and include some of the cannon bone (the RF that is already in the album is perfect so use that as an example of what is needed). Please let me know when they are up.

This isn't an easy, straight forward situation - hasn't been from the start. I think it might be that the soft packing while the shoes were on was helping support that entire damaged, medial side so that it was able to start to grow in as a much stronger structure but then the multiple abscesses blowing out again weakened the medial wall so that it collapsed once more. Letting the toes get away from you was a negative that added more stresses.

Beating yourself up won't help and won't change the past so please stop. Look to learning from both the things that did work AND the things that didn't work so you and Micky can move forward from here. You can do this for your boy's sake.

--
Lavinia and George Too
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
ECIR Support Team

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