Date   

Re: Picky eaters checklist

Maria Duran
 


Oh thank you for telling me. I will keep that on mind too.
 
Thanks!
 
María.
 


De: main@ECIR.groups.io [mailto:main@ECIR.groups.io] En nombre de Lorna
Enviado el: miércoles, 24 de julio de 2019 17:18
Para: main@ECIR.groups.io
Asunto: Re: [ECIR] Picky eaters checklist

Yes, Maria, a two-way street. Hopefully, the aroma from  a top-dressing of the BRP, will get to her sniffer before that of the mixed-in minerals.Ha!
I just meant that too much of someting like BRP, with its aroma, can also be offputting for her.

They sure keep us on our toes!
Good luck.

--

Lorna  in Kingston, Ontario, Canada
ECIR Moderator
2002
https://ecir.gro
ups.io/g/main/files/PPID%20and%20IR%20Success%20Stories/Success%20Story%20%233%20-%20Lorna%20and%20Ollies%20Story.pdf


 


--
María Durán Navarro 
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain)

Plutón´s Case History
Plutón´s Photo Album
_._,_._,_


Re: Blood test units

Maria Duran
 

Hi Bonnie,

Per Dr. Kellon´s CIR course, for glucose to convert mmol/L to mg/dL multiply by 18. For insulin to convert from mmol/L to uUI/mL divide by 6. I don´t know abour the other units you mention for glucose, maybe someone can explain it better.

--
María Durán Navarro 
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain)

Plutón´s Case History
Plutón´s Photo Album
_._,_._,_


Re: Jesse sore

Debra
 

Hi LJ,

I'll be curious to see what Lavinia has to say about the trim. To me, the toes still look really long.
--
Debra Doerfler
San Marcos (San Diego County), California
Lady Sierra Snarf n' Snort AKA "Sierra"
2009 TB rescue mare, adopted 2017
Member since March 2019
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Debra%20and%20Sierra

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=91011


Re: Picky eaters checklist

Lorna Cane
 
Edited

Yes, Maria, a two-way street. Hopefully, the aroma from  a top-dressing of the BRP, will get to her sniffer before that of the mixed-in minerals.Ha!
I just meant that too much of something like BRP, with its aroma, can also be offputting for her.

They sure keep us on our toes!
Good luck.

--

Lorna  in Kingston, Ontario, Canada
ECIR Moderator
2002
https://ecir.gro
ups.io/g/main/files/PPID%20and%20IR%20Success%20Stories/Success%20Story%20%233%20-%20Lorna%20and%20Ollies%20Story.pdf


 


Re: Picky eaters checklist

Maria Duran
 

On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 01:30 PM, Lorna wrote:

Don't forget that horses have an awesome sense of smell. I guess I look at BRP as being effective because the aroma entices the pony to eat whatever is under it....just because of aroma,as opposed to taste. Sometimes I have added a tiny bit more,if the effect seems to have worn off. 

It depends on the 'victims' but that's been my experience.
I always start with the least amount I can get away with,and increase to effect.

 

 Yes but I fear that the awesome sense of smell is a two way road haha. I mean that she can also smell the awful aroma of the minerals and aminoacids. I will give her the bag next week and try as you say by adding only as little as possible. This victim is a bit tricky :)

Thank you Lorna!

--
María Durán Navarro 
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain)

Plutón´s Case History
Plutón´s Photo Album
_._,_._,_


Re: Toxic plants - fleabane?

rebecca.ann.crowe@...
 

Thank you! We did put our hay fields back into a crop rotation for two years to eliminate a minimal amount of hoary alyssum, and that has worked to eradicate it. I'm working to cover all my bases to address other factors while we implement the trim and wait for our hay analysis. We haven't had fever and very little stocking up, so the hoary alyssum is an unlikely factor at this point. Thanks again!
--
Becky Crowe
Luck, Wisconsin, USA
Joined July 2019
Thunder Case History
Thunder Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=93211
Soozee Case History
Soozee Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=93212
Frodo Case History


Re: Persistent lameness after trim

Sherry Morse
 

Aunna,

Just seconding Lorna's recommendation that Cadet needs to be eating less so he can lose weight (which will help both his comfort level and his insulin).  

As per the guidelines at https://www.ecirhorse.org/DDT+E-diet.php if his ideal weight is 950lbs. and his current weight is 1066 he needs to be eating 1.5% of the 1066lbs (16lbs) or 2% of the 950lbs (14.25lbs) - whichever is greater.  So his current diet of 21lbs of hay + Cavalor is 5 pounds more than day than he needs. 

If he's comfortable wearing boots at this point I would leave him in them to protect his feet.  Having current foot pictures will help us evaluate the trim and see if there's anything that could be changed with it to help Cadet feel better.



Re: Toxic plants - fleabane?

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Hoary alyssum is the major weed associated with laminitis but there is no toxicity that will  only cause laminitis with no other signs (fever and stocking up with Hoary alyssum) and no toxicity that causes EMS.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


locked Re: Riosa Hormone tests are back - feedback please from Dr. Kellon

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Abnormally large follicles are the same thing as cysts but sounds like you haven't found that recently.

I contacted a prominent theriogenologist about Riosa because things just weren't adding up. [Will send his reply to your vet if requested.] He agreed those numbers are consistent with anestrus and she was not cycling. Cycling means her ovaries are bringing up waves of follicles. Behavior that looks like estrus does not mean she is truly cycling. He emphasized that unless you follow a wave of follicles, confirm ovulation and formation of a CL you can't say she's cycling.

Progesterone and LH that low on two readings 10 days apart means she's not cycling.

He has seen this before and gave three possible scenarios:
- anestrus
- persistent corpus luteum
- granulosa theca cell tumor

Also possible but more rare are mares that do not cycle because of infertility related to XY chromosome abnormalities.

Most mares are well on their way out of seasonal anestrus by end of March/early April when your bloods were done. CL persisting all this time doesn't seem likely, or GTC tumor - but who knows?

What you DID learn from the blood work is that the behavior is not related to cycling so Regumate (or marble) won't help. That doesn't rule out reproductive tract/urinary tract pain or irritation though. I would suggest:
- urinary and uterine cultures
- serial ultrasounds to look for abnormal structures and follow the uterus, cervix and ovaries through to ovulation and CL formation to make sure she is now cycling


--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: biotin/ dr. kellon

Nancy C
 

How much biotin is in the sportshorse?  Can’t read the label. 

Adequate copper and zinc has a very big impact on feet and skin.

Over the years members have found that they can devise ways to acquire and store 3-6 months of hay for the reward of targeted tight balance. 

Good info here. https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/5%20Core%20Diet/1.%20Hay%20Information/Finding%20and%20Storing%20Hay.pdf
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
ECIR Group Inc. President/Treasurer  2019-2020
Join us at the 2020 NO Laminitis! Conference, October 22 - 25, Harrisburg, PA


Re: Persistent lameness after trim

Lorna Cane
 

Hi Aunna,

Sorry Cadet is uncomfortable.
I'm less well-versed in hoof matters than others. But I agree with you that he is heavy. Have you considered cutting back on his hay? His total feed, if I'm not missing something in his CH, is 21 pounds. If he were mine, I would be happier if he were being fed no more than 18 pounds, and  even 16 might be appropriate. Are you in a position to regulate his nets?

--

Lorna  in Kingston, Ontario, Canada
ECIR Moderator
2002
https://ecir.gro
ups.io/g/main/files/PPID%20and%20IR%20Success%20Stories/Success%20Story%20%233%20-%20Lorna%20and%20Ollies%20Story.pdf


 


Persistent lameness after trim

riggslippert@...
 

Hello,

My horse Cadet was diagnosed with IR last fall and experienced cold-induced laminitis in early February.  My case report has been updated.  He spent the winter in a stall with turnout in a round pen, wearing boots, socks, and leg warmers.  In early April, we was returned to a group paddock with his regular companions.  In early May, he had foot radiographs taken at Michigan State University (in photo album).  He appeared to be doing well until late May, when he developed some foot tenderness.  He had access to minimal grass, but his insulin was elevated, so he was moved to a dry lot on 6/11/19.  The hay situation where I board is constantly changing; at that point I was unable to test what he was eating.  He seemed to improve again and I left town for six days.  When I returned, he was significantly worse.  On 6/26/19, he was confined to a pipe corral with zero access to grass and fed soaked hay, TCTBC, and his supplements.  He improved again until he was trimmed on 7/2/19.  Since then, he was been lame at a walk on cement unless he wears boots.  I rechecked his insulin 16 days after the diet change and it was still elevated.  I know the group recommends Cornell, but Idexx is free for employees where I work, so I can't justify sending out the samples.

Cadet is currently back in the dry lot eating hay tested 2.1% ESC + starch.  The rest of his diet is unchanged.

We changed to a new farrier with the laminitis diagnosis in February.  She is experienced and attends clinics with Dr. Bowker and other hoof experts.  His feet do look much better to me, but this is the first time he has been persistently lame after a trim.  The farrier looked at him yesterday and did not think he was actively laminitic.  She did not know why he was lame, but decided not to trim him for another week (at that point it will be 4 weeks since his last trim).  He seems comfortable walking in boots so I am hand walking him, since I know he needs exercise to lower his insulin.  I can take a set of photos, but wasn't sure if it would be better before or after his next trim.  I am hoping there might be something else I can do to eliminate his discomfort.  Thank you for any advice you can give!
--
Aunna
October 2018
Oakland County, Michigan, USA
Cadet Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Aunna%20and%20Cadet

Cadet Photo Album:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=84102




Re: biotin/ dr. kellon

Daisy Shepherd
 

my hay comes from multiple sources so hay analysis not done by owner of boarding facility and i cannot afford to do this every time the hay changes. thanks, daisy and tiko

--
-- 
Daisy, Tiko and Whisper
CO, April 2019
Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Daisy%20and%20Tiko 
Photo Album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=90099&p=Name,,,20,2,0,0


Re: IR? Cushings?

Erica Aulie
 

Hi Tanna,

Thank you for your suggestions. I am in process of creating a dirt lot where Cupid currently resides; I think this is more of where his weight is coming from.  Though I put out 24lbs of hay a day, he doesn't clean it all up.  I don't disagree that he could lose some weight, though.  I also recently cut his grain as I had been feeding him beet pulp in addition to his ration balancer.  He seems to be losing some weight already.

I don't think the ration balancer has alfalfa in it, but I can check again.  I'm thinking it's going to have to go, anyway, as the combined starch is 11%.
As soon as I have time, (hopefully tomorrow,) I will give the trim photo instructions a read and get them to Livinia.  Thank you so much for your input!
--
Erica and Cupid
Bastrop, TX, 7/2019
Case History


Re: Flax

jmc
 

Another option is the ground stabilized golden flax from Triple Crown. It is guaranteed to last for two years, 25 lb bag if I remember correctly.  This is what I use, and all my equines love it (I've used it as a taste enhancer)! - Given that this is an ag area, it is odd, but I simply cannot find the inexpensive 50 lb bags everyone suggests...


--
Jodi
June 2018
NW Wyoming

Yankee Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jodi%20and%20Yankee

Photo Album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=54386


Chaste Berry and anhidrosis

jmc
 

I know chaste berry can help reduce excessive sweating related to PPID. Can it also restart sweating if anhidrosis was caused by PPID?  I ask because my horse has been on One AC, triple dose, for nearly two months, with little change (started getting a little damp, sometimes, under the mane - but that's it). I restarted Chaste Berry a week ago, and while he's not "cured" yet, he's definitely sweating more than he was...

 

(PPID still not official; Vet has been insanely busy and hasn't gotten back to me - they're short a doc. sigh)


--
Jodi
June 2018
NW Wyoming

Yankee Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jodi%20and%20Yankee

Photo Album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=54386


Re: Toxic plants - fleabane?

rebecca.ann.crowe@...
 

Lorna,
Yes, the case histories are up-to-date if I'm understanding correctly.  If I'm not, please let me know.  All of their hay, feed, and supplements are listed.
I meant I will update as we get the hay analysis and once I start Thunder on Prascend.  I also ordered chaste tree berry for the other two but have not yet received it but will update once they start taking it.  Thanks!
--
Becky Crowe
Luck, Wisconsin, USA
Joined July 2019
Thunder Case History
Thunder Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=93211
Soozee Case History
Soozee Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=93212
Frodo Case History


Re: Toxic plants - fleabane?

 

There are multiple lists online. This list is nice because it’s illustrated.
https://walworth.extension.wisc.edu/files/2014/03/A4019_ToxicPlantsWisconsinPasturesForages.pdf
This one is really extensive but probably contains many plants that only grow outside your region. https://www.aspca.org/pet-care/animal-poison-control/horse-plant-list

Sorry the links are so wonky using my iPhone. 
--
Cass for Cayuse (PPID/IR) and Diamond (IR)
Sonoma County, Calif. Oct. '12

Cayuse Case History                Cayuse Photos
Diamond Case History              Diamond Photos


Re: Toxic plants - fleabane?

Lorna Cane
 

"I will update once we have results."

Is everything else updated  aside from the results, Becky? I wasn't sure,as I was looking for details,especially nutritional.

For you,and others reading, everything you can add will help,even without test results.


-





Lorna  in Kingston, Ontario, Canada
ECIR Moderator
2002
https://ecir.gro
ups.io/g/main/files/PPID%20and%20IR%20Success%20Stories/Success%20Story%20%233%20-%20Lorna%20and%20Ollies%20Story.pdf


 


Re: Blood test units

Tanna
 

Good converter and info here: 
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/blood-sugar-converter.html

-
Tanna 

April 2019, (Yahoo Group member 2008)
Langley, BC, Canada

Tula Case History 
Hay Analysis I Hay Worksheet

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