Date   

When to remove boots

jessica skene
 

Hi,

can we remove boots if temperature is over 4 degrees but snow is not melted yet

--
Jessica Skene  - Abitibi, Québec, Canada
Sonara => Canadian X QH mare , 13 years old, historic of founder and Laminitis, IR / EMS

october 2017

Link to case history: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jessica%20Skene%20and%20Sonara/SonaraCaseHistory2019.pdf
Link to album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=10295&p=Name,,,20,1,0,0
Link to hay analysis: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jessica%20Skene%20and%20Sonara/analysedefoin.pdf


Re: Need help with long term diet - hay testing

NinaJW
 


-- He is not losing weight so it’s probably more than that. I will purchase a scale thru Amazon. Teff hay is very lightweight and I know I can’t give him that alone anyway. As for sending hay out of the fayette/Woodford co area for testing, I buy only 2 to4 bales at a time as I board and can’t store more than that, By the time I tested it in an outside lab, I would have 2-4 new bales. There are things that I cannot micromanage particularly during Covid-19 requirements in my state. I am doing my absolute best for a horse I love with all my heart. He isn’t a fan of wet/ soaked hay for more than a day or two. You have to bear in mind that while the PPID diagnosis is new if not unexpected, being massively overweight when I bought him and crusty necked for 13 years. I have always given him a diet under the assumption he was IR. He has never had colic, any degree of hoof problems including abscess. He’s 22 now and I do not want those things to become issues. He gets farrier work every 4 weeks also. Exercise is the no. 1 thing I am trying to change for his best interest right now. :/

Nina and Jadon
Kentucky 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nina%20and% https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=244202


Re: Diagnosing PPID in spring-summer

Maria Duran
 

Thank you very much for answering to all my questions Dr. Kellon.
--
María Durán Navarro 
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain)

Plutón´s Case History
Plutón´s Photo Album
_._,_._,_


Re: Need help with long term diet - S Day

Sherry Morse
 
Edited

I am assuming this is in answer to Dr. Kellon's question.  We are not talking about Triple Crown Lite which is unsuitable for an IR horse, nor about the Mountain Sunrise Timothy Pellets.  We are discussing OBTC which have a guaranteed analysis.
 

 

 

 

 

 
 


Re: Pergolide Mesylate Capsules @ Thriving Pet

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

A few things here, Sue. The requirement that a pharmacy be licensed in every state where it ships is not new. It's a state requirement everywhere. It's not up to Indiana to comply; it's up to Thriving Pets to meet their requirements. I'm not sure why you're focused on the Czech Republic but members can give you feedback on providers they have used.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Need help with long term diet - hay testing

Sherry Morse
 

Hi Nina,

Have you contacted Equi-analytical directly?  They are still doing hay testing at this time.  8lbs of hay a day - as Lorna already mentioned - is not enough for a horse that's supposed to be 1200lbs.   




Re: Step counter

Sherry Morse
 

Gail, 

For what it's worth I ride with a GPS all the time and with my Garmin I keep it set to bike mode and for Endomondo (which is an app on the phone) I use the riding mode.  Both of them are fairly accurate for mileage as well as pace as long as they have satellite reception.  




Re: Step counter

Sherry Morse
 

Pat,

They've used GPS trackers on the New Bolton pony herd to track how far they walk in a day.  I believe they just attached them to the halters but to find out for sure I would suggest you contact Dr. McDonald - her contact information is here: https://www.vet.upenn.edu/research/academic-departments/clinical-studies-new-bolton-center/centers-laboratories/research-laboratory/havemeyer-equine-behavior-research-lab.

As an aside, the average - off the top of my head - was close to 20 miles a day for mares.  




Pergolide Mesylate Capsules @ Thriving Pet

Sue Hansen
 

I have been ordering Pergolide Mesylate Capsules-2.75mg from Thriving Pet with great success the past couple years.  Recently they have required a license for every state they ship to and Indiana so far has not complied.  Is there another pharmacy that you recommend that purchase their Pergolide Mesylate from the Czech Republic?  My 31 year old mare requires two 2.75mg capsules daily and is getting along wonderfully.    Thank you for your help.
--
Sue H.
June 2017. Markle, IN USA
Case History https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Sue%20and%20Dawn  .
Dawn's photo album  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=9764  .


Re: Need help with long term diet

Bobbie Day
 

Nina
I bought a fish weighing scale from amazon, I think it was around fifteen bucks.
I put the hay in a hay net to soak.
Pretty boy, I must say though that twelve pounds is the same amount I give my little RM mare, she’s only about twelve hands and eight hundred pounds. My big horses eat twice that, I bet once you weigh your hay you’ll be surprised.


--
Bobbie and Desi
Utah, Nov 2018

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Bobbie%20and%20Desi

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=78821


Re: Possible NASTY abscess (a bit long)

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 
Edited

Natalie,

The key to getting through this is to concentrate on eliminating the cause of the pain, not on the pain itself. I know that's easier said than done but if he is  passing manure, urinating, drinking and eating he'll  make it through this until you can get rid of the cause. Make sure he has a protected spot with a dry bed to lay on if he chooses to do that. If he has that option and prefer to lay elsewhere, so be it. His choice. Laying down is fine. Horses have spent months down and still recovered.

The muscle trembling is pain, and muscle fatigue from keeping the leg nonweightbearing.

I hope you have stopped the bute completely. It is all risk, no benefit. He obviously isn't getting much of anything in terms of pain relief but it is threatening gut (stomach and colon), kidney and also slowing resolution of the abscesses. Stop it. Get him back on Jiaogulan even if you have to syringe it in. You can use it with the omeprazole. Pain also decreases appetite so you can't use that as measure of omeprazole working. It's working! Soak all hay (is it tested yet?). No reason he can't have the Mad Barn in some beet pulp or sprinkled on hay. Be sure to salt his hay to keep water consumption up.

Your homemade poultice is fine, and likely more effective than Animalintex which doesn't actually draw anything out.

For pain relief, try rubbing the coronary bands, back of the pasterns, lower legs and any hard muscles with Sore No More (here's one Canadian source: https://www.pleasantridge.ca/index.php/horse-health/liniments/sore-no-more-2.html ). Stores may be closed but mail order isn't! The Arnica formula is very effective and horses also respond very well just to being "fussed over".

Once this crisis has passed (and it will), focus on getting your diet as tight and balanced as possible and make sure the trim is meticulously balanced.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Invokana dose and pharmacies

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Kim,

That's in the file I send directly to the vets. They can then  modify  based on their findings and the history of your horse.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Diagnosing PPID in spring-summer

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Maria,

Line by line answers here:

Yes, and there may also be an element of middle lobe enlargement.

If the horse had no past or present symptoms, no laminitis history or high insulin, that reading would be a grey zone and I probably wouldn't treat.

The natural progression of the disease has not been well studied.

Fall is the start of decreased fertility or anestrus in horses.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Possible NASTY abscess (a bit long)

Portagecreek
 

I have been away for awhile but a new bout of abscesses has come around. (Main questions in bold below) A couple weeks ago my guy slipped on the ice and went down onto both front knees. This was followed by swelling, heat and digital pulse in the LF, some swelling up the pastern and leg. My vet examined him, prescribed Bute to get the swelling down. I knew I shouldn't give it him but the leg was so stocked up. A few days after Bute, we suspect ulcers came back and he stopped all 'meals' and hay only. I started aloe right away (1/2C) but he was not interested in any supplements/hay pellets. We were on a great diet of MadBarn, jiagoluan and Mov-Ease....now it's all off the table!

On this past Monday, he started getting a muscle spasm/tremor in his RIGHT front tricep area and some heat in his right front hoof. This gradually worsened - the tremors and unwilling to bear weight (but mind you still recovering from a draining abscess on the LEFT front). We thought it may be an abscess. Given the whole virus situation, vets are only doing emergency calls but I did pick up Omeprazole to start and sent him a video of the muscle spams and continuous shifting of the legs. He agreed it was most likely an abscess but he has difficultly standing on the other leg to be investigated by our farrier.
5 days later, the tremoring is worsened and he can hardly stand to bear weight, it's getting worse, which may be 'good' news (but I am on the verge of mental breakdown! :))
We have been able to very quickly clean out and apply a home made poultice (our tack supply stores are closed completely so I am out of Animalintex poultice and using a diaper, Epsom salts, warm water and ACV).

I am quite sure this is a terrible abscess but you know how we second guess these things and watching them in pain is awful. He's laying down a lot now, to relieve pain I am sure. I am concerned that he gets cold from laying on the wet ground (it's still winter here, snowing today), and isn't eating while laying down.
Thoughts on laying down a lot?
Anyone else had muscle tremors/spasms due to an abscess lasting a week?
IS my DIY poultice OK? (keep in mind, pandemic, basically have common household ingredients)
About how long before you have noticed improvement with appetite on Omeprazole?
--
Natalie

New Brunswick, Canada

2019

Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Tane%20and%20Natalie/Tane%20Case%20History%2012312019.pdf

Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=95995


Re: Need help with long term diet

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

The TC product we were talking about here is the Naturals Timothy Balance Cubes.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Need help with long term diet

Lorna Cane
 

Hi Nina,

As Sherry said, until we know how much he is being fed, by weight, we can't know what is needed.
I worry about a 15hh horse being fed only 8 lbs. of hay,nothing else to speak of.

Good idea about getting a luggage scale. Then you will know how to proceed.
Let us know,when you do,ok?

--

Lorna  in Eastern  Ontario
2002


 


Re: Need help with long term diet

Lorna Cane
 

Hi Nina,

Did you remember to hit Save ?

--

Lorna  in Eastern  Ontario
2002


 


Re: Need help with long term diet

NinaJW
 

Thanks Lorna! I think I did it :)
--
Nina and Jadon
Kentucky 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nina%20and%20Jadon


Re: Need help with long term diet

NinaJW
 



On Fri, Apr 3, 2020 at 10:03 PM Lorna in Ontario <windybriars@...> wrote:
Hi Nina,

You got it! He's handsome.

Now ,can you go back to the signature box ,in Subscription and add the Photo link.....https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=244202
to your signature.......remembering to hit Save.

In your other post ,did you mean he is only being fed 8 pounds a day of hay, or did I misunderstand?

--

Lorna  in Eastern  Ontario
2002

--

 Yes. About 8 lbs is what I can get in the bag plus what he eats in the paddock with his muzzle on. If he eats much more I’ll never get the weight off him. Although I should note I am guessing. I cannot find a scale anywhere except a luggage scale on Amazon which would probably work. Money, money and more money.. lol :) Thanks for the compliment on him. I hope I can get him back to showing his leg stripes and shading. One photo (with snow) is from the winter I first bought him. He was a whale!!!




--
Nina and Jadon
Kentucky 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nina%20and%20Jadon


Re: Need help with long term diet

lvbnazgrl@...
 

There is a question/answer page "from their nutrition experts" on the Triple Crown site.  I called them to confirm.  
  In a conversation with a nutritionist who studied with you, it was suggested that I offer my PPID horse Triple Crown Lite if I was unable to find Mountain Sunrise Timothy Pellets.  I also had the iron content confirmed by TC in a telecon.  Some of the labels also show the iron content..I believe TC Lite is one of them.  

--
S Day in AZ 2020

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