Date   

Re: cost of cornell labs in covid world

LJ Friedman
 

sirry about vrt names    i replied back privately 
--
LJ Friedman  Nov 2014 Vista,   Northern  San Diego, CA

Jesse and majestic ‘s Case History 
Jesse's Photos

 


Re: I have my hay report and pasture Report

Barbara Henry
 


-- Thank you for responding! I have done most everything that you outline above. I will try one more time. I am running out of time I pick up my Teff hay on friday. Farmer used #601 test. Both my huband and I spent all week trying to get it loaded. No luck! Microsoft insist that I pay even with the free version! The main problem is I do not own the Word program. I have to buy it or rent it. I have windows 10 and it is horrible. Also I use goggle Gmail which fights with outlook. can I mail my folder for a mod to upload it? Or who do you recomend I work with to balance the meal around the teff hay? 
Barb Henry in Ca 2020


Re: Casteberry

 

I count hay cubes (ODTBC) in my horses' daily forage calculation. If I were feeding beet pulp, I'd include it too!

For new members, we need to emphasize slow and steady weight loss, no crash starvation diets, and yet none of the free-feeding baloney that's touted online as the key to weight loss and equine bliss. 

FWIW, with my super-easy keeper TWH Cayuse (who bears an uncanny resemblance to Cheryl's Jewel), I found that if my horse is overweight, I cannot  feed 1.5% of body weight and expect her to lose weight. After she is very close to her ideal weight, she maintains on 1.5% of body weight in hay. To actually lose weight, she needs to be on minimum maintenance levels of forage by NRC standards. That level ratchets down as she drops weight by body measurements.  I must  calculate her rations based on her caloric needs. And I count every single morsel that goes into her mouth. With a 9 year history, I know how many Mcals she needs in mild weather. Anything over that, and she packs it on. 

I think Dr Kellon said it best: feeding is as much art as science. There are many variables, not only from horse to horse, but in our estimates of their weight and how well we realistic we are in our assessment of  BCS.  It could very well be that my estimate of my horse's ideal weight remains too high to this day, and that explains the math. For years I operated on a false assumption by using the weight the vet gave during her repurchase exam at age 6 as her ideal weight. That was apparently at least 50 pounds higher than her actual weight at the time! 
--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos 


Re: TRH Stim Results

 

On the new hay. It takes time for our horses' digestive systems to grow new populations of microflora to process new hay, even if it's the same type of grass as the old hay.  I do it very slowly, often taking two weeks with my more sensitive horse, starting at 1 pound per day, adding another pound next day, pausing any time I see signs of digestive upset. 

How long did you take to introduce the new hay?
--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos 


Re: Casteberry

celestinefarm
 

Kirsten, Tipperary"s ideal weight would be around #1050, which would equate to appx.16 lbs of hay. He currently gets daily 15 lbs , plus one pound of hay cubes, and one pound of Equal balance chopped hay per day.  I can't feed him hay in a hay net as it triggers his COPD. So I feed him shaken out flakes of steamed hay three times a day. I discontinue feeding him beet pulp in the summer as it just adds pounds. I can't reduce his hay any further. Reducing calories is one part of this, exercise is another. Just like with humans, Calories in , energy out.  All that changes however with health problems, age,  As an older horse, I have to be cognizant that he doesn't have great teeth, he doesn't absorb nutrients as well, and he needs a consistently filled gut for it to work properly. Colic in older horses is a big concern for me, I've lost a couple of horses to severe colic and I do not chance it . His hay is very moderate in sugar and starch. He's currently on 8 mgs. of pergolide as he does have out of range ACTH and I have increased him 1 mg in the last few weeks. I"m already seeing improvement in the stubborn fat pads he was carrying and in his crest. He doesn't get much exercise, I haven't ridden him in years and he is no longer breeding. So lack of exercise is one of the issues.
Dawn Wagstaff and Tipperary   

Saline, MI  2003

Tipperary Case History

Juniper Case history: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Dawn%20and%20Juniper/Case%20history%20Juniper.pdf .


TRH Stim Results

Kelly Gilmartin
 

Our stim results came in today and it looks like we are in good shape there: Pre: 20.0 Post: 63.0 (this is after increasing to 2.5 mg a week or two before the test). Our insulin results are still pending but he was very high upon our last value (100). 

We are weighing hay (20lbs per day since 8/10 and have removed all turnout/grazing). I am awaiting hay analysis results but in the meantime Buddy developed Free Fecal Water when ingesting the new hay although mixed with old hay and soaked and steamed). So, we have removed the new hay (and I am frustrated because I just wasted my money on hay testing this batch).  I have only two horses in my care and its too risky to buy large lots of hay with picky eaters although I agree mineral balancing is ideal.  Should I just use Vermont Blend or some other balancer when customized hay testing and balancing isnt feasible? What do others do? Thankful for the advice of KG and Dr K but this is daunting to someone who cant buy large amounts of hay and cant financially afford to test each batch each time it changes.  

Also, would you add Thyro-L or metformin to his regimen? I feel confident our Pergolide dose is ok now but the insulin is still concerning. We arent moving yet as my Soft Ride boots are on the way and the farrier is trying to get out to trim. TIA
--
Kelly Gilmartin/Buddy
Western Massachusetts 
member since 2019
Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Kelly%20and%20Apostrophe%20GCH

Photo Album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/photosearch?q=Apostrophe


Re: Casteberry

Kirsten Rasmussen
 

I have a question for Lori and Dawn.  If their breeding is to be very thrifty keepers then by definition they are able to maintain a higher BCS while being worked.  19-21 lbs of hay seems like a lot to me if they are overweight.  Why not feed 1.5% of current body weight to see if you can't get them down to a 5 where some ribs are visible?  If their BSC is a 6, then aren't they still getting more calories than they need?  Just curious why reducing their hay is not an option, thanks!

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History  
Shaku's Photo Album   


Re: Feed Analysis

Kirsten Rasmussen
 

I meant to add that the protein is a little low, but as you have your hay balanced this is something your balancer can address, along with any other deficiencies.  The only real problem I can see is the high iron.

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History  
Shaku's Photo Album   


Re: Feed Analysis

Kirsten Rasmussen
 

The toxic limit for iron in horse hay is 500 ppm, and ideally it would be 100 or less.  Likely iron this high is from surface dirt on the hay.  In looking through the messages I saw there are a couple things you can do.  First, make sure your sampling probe and container are clean.  Second, look through some bales to see if there are any dirt clumps.  If there are, maybe your probe went through one.  If not try vigorously shaking off the hay and see what falls out, and/or rinse and dry a representative sample and send that for iron analysis.  Hopefully vigorous shaking, +/- rinsing will remove enough iron to make this hay safe to feed.  Either way, whatever you do to lower the iron for a follow-up hay test should be done every time you feed.

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History  
Shaku's Photo Album   


Re: Uckele treats GREAT BUY at Chewy 😊

iluvzhorses <iluvzhorses@...>
 

I only saw the cherry vanilla 4 lb. bag for 5.99 and the 12oz. bags (peppermint and apple-banana) are 4.70.  Either it was a pricing error and they fixed it or they are out!
--
Lisa And Louie
Eastern NC
2012


Re: is ESC affected by hay curing?

 

Hi Kirsten,

I was advised to let my hay cure for 6 weeks before testing from my mineral balancer. We bale large round bales and at 15% tested in the field we haven't had mold problems.

--
Nancy and Akira
3/20/2018  Burkesville KY

Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Akira


Hydroxyzine while on Metformin?

Mara
 

Is it okay to put my horse back on hydroxyzine as he is on Metformin?

It is the only thing that helps to control his itchy skin during the summer. Over the years I have tried addressing it through diet (increased flax, spirulina, chondroitin, etc.) and fly gear. 

Any insight appreciated. 
--
Mara
NJ
2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Mara%20and%20Enzo/?ord=dirname&d=asc


Feed Analysis

MJ
 

Hello, please find in my history case the hay analysis #2 (august 2020). Can someone review and provide comments and recommandations. I notice that the iron seems high. Is this a concern?. Thank You so much for the help.
--
MarieJosee
July 2020
Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/MarieJosee%20and%20Cashmere  


Re: is ESC affected by hay curing?

Jennifer Murphy
 

I have a similar situation, and now I'm curious as to what that answer might be considering ESC.

My hay supplier cut, dried, and baled one field just for me.  He cut early in the morning so the sugar would be low.  He delivered 100 bales and I had that tested using the 601 test.  The ESC came back at 8.3, the starch at .6 - sampled on 6/23, and I think the hay had been baled for a week or two.  He brought a second load and just for interests sake, I tested that load.  The ESC came back at 6.3, the starch at .7 - sampled on 7/6 using the 601 test.  The third and final load was delivered and after reading on this site that the wet chemistry test was recommended, I sent in yet another sample for the 603 test.  The ESC came back at 9.4 and the starch at .5 and that was sampled on 7/10.  I think I'll take one more sample and just have the ESC tested to see if there was any change.  You would expect to get fairly similar numbers throughout the 400 bales all from the same field.

The moisture contend on the three loads ranged from 7 to 9%, but it's been so humid that a lot of the bales just smell off.  I tossed one bale into the woods yesterday that had no visible mold, no dusty spores released when opened, but it just didn't smell right to me. 

--
Jennifer in NH
2020

CH - https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jennifer%20and%20Flea

Photo album - https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=251041&p=Name,,,20,1,0,0


Re: Easy Boot Cloud Fitting advice

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 


Re: is ESC affected by hay curing?

gypsylassie
 

Yes it will be interesting to see the moisture and ESC.  I've never tried a follow up test like that.     If it smells really good, I'll bet it cures nicely and won't mold.  At least its starch is low, so if the ESC doesn't go down much you can soak it if you want, or just feed it to your non-IR horse.  
Laura K Chappie & Beau over the bridge
2011 N IL


Re: Easy Boot Cloud Fitting advice

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Thanks Maxine. The 1s are the right size for sure after letting them settle for.the day. Coincidentally, I had purchased the easy boot RX to try just in case the cloud was too much andsl he actually likes that boot much better. So I think like some others have mentioned, maybe the cloud pad was too much.
--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104


Re: Bella's Insulin has Increased

Kirsten Rasmussen
 

Hi Lynn,

Sorry, I didn't see that the 2nd Cornell analysis was a duplicate of the BET analysis!  Doing the extra tests gives more information, but if you are worried about Bella's insulin being in the red alert zone, then just doing everything to lower it all at once and retesting once is fine.

For soaking hay in water that may have high iron, that's a question for Dr Kellon or a hay balancer.  However, in my personal experience I have noticed my horse drinks way less water when I soak his hay, so maybe their water consumption overall is fairly close.  I also let it drain for at least 15 min, after soaking and rinsing it until the water rubs clear.  Soaking for extended periods can cause iron to absorb into hay from water, but the 1 hr we recommend does not cause iron to increase in the hay....not sure how true that is for high iron water though, which is why I hope someone else will chime in.

The dry pasture grass is still alive.  I guess I really just don't trust pasture analyses because they can be so variable...so with severely IR horses I would never take the chance.  That's just my opinion though.

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History  
Shaku's Photo Album   


Re: Uckele treats GREAT BUY at Chewy 😊

Bobbie Day
 

Gail
They’re not very big, just little round pieces that can be easily broken. My little mare loves all the flavors. They’re soft enough to break in two.
--
Bobbie and Desi
NRC March 2020
Utah, Nov 2018

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Bobbie%20and%20Desi 

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=78821


Re: Uckele treats GREAT BUY at Chewy 😊

 

How big are these treats?  I am looking for something really small if I can find it.  I considered buying Charlie Bear dog treats which look like miniature oyster crackers.  About dime size.

--
Gail Russell 8/30/2008

 

 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Gail%20and%20Brother%20-%20Odin%20-%20Decaffe%20%20-Gunthar .

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