Date   

locked Ringbone...which is better Uckele's Tendon EQ or Devils Claw Plus Granular

Laura and Pabatsa in CA
 

Dr. Kellon/Group,

Last week Pabatsa got IRAP in both feet for ringbone. Currently he gets Tendon EQ but I'm wondering whether Uckele's Devils Claw Plus Granular would be more appropriate? My vet suggested he go on Adequan starting this week. I'm not sure what to be giving him at this point.

Thank you for your help!
--
Laura and Pabatsa in California
Feb 2012
Case History https://ecir.groups.io /g/CaseHistory/files/Laura%20a nd%20Pabatsa ( https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Laura%20and%20Pabatsa )
Pabatsa's Photos https://ecir.groups.io /g/CaseHistory/album?id=1740 ( https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=1740 )


Re: Could someone tell me if the blood results could have been affected by sedative

Carrie
 

Kirsten,
Thank you for your advice  it's helpful confirming my irritation & thoughts.

' .....hard to evaluate, too, because it is time-dependent from when the sedative was actually given....'

The sedative was given the same time as bloods were taken , I don't know which way round as I didn't see, I was busy holding her still as best I could.
I feel daft, as I requested for bloods first then Xrays... so presumed the sedative would be given later prior to Xrays during setting up.

Moving forward your suggestion to keep procedures the same, enabling comparison makes sense.
--
Carrie 
March 2021
UK


Re: Considerations for possibly buying a second PPID horse

Starshine Ranch
 

Hi Naomi,
How kind of you to even consider.  I have two PPID Morgan mares.  They are both on compounded Pergolide at 7.5 and 8 mgs.  One is also IR so I treat them both as if they were.  The IR horse is also prone to colic so I now free feed them both with expensive, tested low-sugar hay.  I have figured that between the hay, blood tests, the Pergolide and the trims that need to be done more often, it costs about $10,000/year for the two and I suspect that # will go up as the cost of everything else is now... and other issues could arise.  If you can afford it, then bless you for taking on a horse in need.
--
Linda in CA  2020  Midnight and Ostara
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Linda%20Midnight%20OStara


Re: Considerations for possibly buying a second PPID horse

Starshine Ranch
 


Re: Natural vitamin e source in canada

Laura H
 

Lots of options. I have used Elevate powder, but Mad Barn Vit E or Herbs for Horses Vit E (they have powder and pellets) are priced better.
--
Laura Heit - Ontario 2021


Re: Magnesium

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Classes are 10 weeks. Next starts Nov. 8 and after that is Feb. 7.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: DEWORMING PROTOCOL FOR PPID GELDING

Tracy
 

Reporting back on weighing supplements.  I use Uckele Equi-VM for my main balancing vitamin/mineral.
Weighed the scoops, averaged it out and instead of two scoops by weight - I need to be using 2.6.
That's enough of a difference to matter since this supplement actually has enough copper and zinc for this batch of hay!  Well - at least at 2.6 scoops it does.  The 2 I was feeding was a little 'short'.

Thank you Maxine!!!

--
Tracy and Salsa (1999 model year Paso Fino)
Middle TN USA, September 2019
Case History  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Tracy%20and%20Salsa
Photos https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=95827


Re: Remy is getting Laminitis again and I don't know why

melanie Schwartz
 

I added some new photos but I need to work on it and/or get someone to hold the foot while I take the pictures.  he was wabbly.  
--
MELANIE SCHWARTZ
DAVIE,  FLORIDA 33328
October 30, 2020
Remy's Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Melanie%20and%20Remy
Remys photos:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=263092


Re: DEWORMING PROTOCOL FOR PPID GELDING

Tracy
 

Duuuh - I'd never thought about using my kitchen scale to calibrate the scoops that come with Salsa's supplements.
Just sat my digital kitchen scale by the door so I can take it out and do this!  Interested to see the results!
Thanks for pointing this out!

Tracy
--
Tracy and Salsa (1999 model year Paso Fino)
Middle TN USA, September 2019
Case History  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Tracy%20and%20Salsa
Photos https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=95827


Re: DEWORMING PROTOCOL FOR PPID GELDING

Maxine McArthur
 

On Sun, Oct 3, 2021 at 06:24 AM, Cass in NorCal wrote:
If you have a kitchen gram scale, I suggest you  “calibrate” the measure enclosed in the Strongid bucket. The measures in my buckets under-weigh the recommended dosages for both my horses. IOW the markings on the side were inaccurate in estimating the weight of the pellets printed on the measure. 
I would suggest doing this for every product you buy that comes with its own scoop. I just weighed the amount of balancer pellets in the manufacturer's "50 gram" scoop. It came to 35g. So if I had trusted their scoop weight, I would have been under-dosing my horses. 
 
--
Maxine and Indy (PPID) and Dangles (PPID)

Canberra, Australia 2010
ECIR Primary Response

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Maxine%20and%20Indy%20and%20Dangles 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=933

 


Re: dairy one reports

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Daisy,

Every item on the results has an OK range and every one of those ranges is different. It also matters how various items relate to one another. We need to see the actual analysis to be able to give you an answer.

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR


Re: dairy one reports

Daisy Shepherd
 

Thank you Katie. I have taken the nrc course, guess I need to find and see if I can find the info I need. Thank you so much.  Daisy, tiko, whisper 

--
-- 
Daisy, Tiko and Whisper
CO, April 2019
Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Daisy%20and%20Tiko 
Photo Album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=90099&p=Name,,,20,2,0,0


Re: Abscesses

dr.kellylear@...
 

Lavinia, 
Thank you for your response. That is what I thought, I will talk to the vet about that. Hopefully he will listen to me. I really wish she could get healthy enough to go home so I could regulate what she gets and doesn’t get. 

thank you again for all your help! 

Kelly 
--

 

Kelly Lear in Texas 2021

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Kelly%20and%20Saddie

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=267371


Re: Devils Claw and Equioxx

Sherry Morse
 

Hi Patti,

If you have no baseline bloodwork for Dancer, yes you need to get it done sooner rather than later.




Re: Remy is getting Laminitis again and I don't know why

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

A CBC is a Complete Blood Count.

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR


Re: Abscesses

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Kelly,

Applying the Numotizine to the other foot won't hurt, so I'd give that a try.

I know she needs to start eating regularly but it's possible that the grass and alfalfa are triggering foot pain so it would be best if those were cut out.

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR


Re: Considerations for possibly buying a second PPID horse

Maxine McArthur
 
Edited

I have two PPID horses. A couple of thoughts for you: 
1. If you are looking for a quiet, child-friendly mount, odds are that you'll buy a horse over 15, maybe over 18. So thinking about PPID is probably a good thing to do in any case. I tested Dangles when he was 18, results normal. A year later, he was above normal. You need to test proactively with older horses so you can prevent symptoms creeping up on you. So no savings on testing there. And no vet in my area gives discounts for more than one horse.
2. Agree with Dr Kellon and Sherry that a horse in poor physical condition, whether from PPID or not, should not be judged on their docile nature. When I bought my first horse, I knew he could be a bit of a handful, but I knew how much of a handful (he was in a riding school). At the time, there was a very sweet quiet mare who came up for sale--she was in poor condition due to a bad foaling and other issues. She was lovely to ride but I chose to buy the gelding. A year later, that mare was zooming around 1.4m jumping courses, a very fiery ride. 
3. I do find it an advantage in terms of management to have two horses with similar needs. I have been lucky enough to find a paddock buddy whose horse is also 21, retired, with PPID. They can all stay on the same restricted grazing/track/low s-s hay routine together. 
4. The medication is expensive. You have no way of knowing how much a certain horse will need to control the PPID. Dangles is older (21) than Indy (18), his initial ACTH test level was much higher than hers, but he is currently controlled on 0.75mg of Prascend in the seasonal rise, 0.5mg the rest of the year. She has been on pergolide longer, but needs 3.5mg of compounded, and I have just added 0.25mg of Prascend as I was not happy with her levels at the last test. Many horses in this group need more than 3.5mg. 
5. Morgans are often IR/EMS. You may need other medications (metformin, invocana) that are as expensive as pergolide. 
6. You mention that you have minis also. They are often EMS and/or PPID too, especially as they age. You may end up needing medication for them as well. 
7. After all those negative points, I have to say that although there are no perfect horses, I believe there are horses that are perfect for a certain person. If this gelding is perfect for you, maybe it's worth taking the chance. 

Hope this helps.



--
Maxine and Indy (PPID) and Dangles (PPID)

Canberra, Australia 2010
ECIR Primary Response

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Maxine%20and%20Indy%20and%20Dangles 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=933

 


Re: Senior Gelding - first Endogenous ACTH Test

Cheryl Oickle
 

Yes Island Pharmacy is located in Duncan Shawnigan Lake area on Vancouver Island

--
Cheryl and Jewel
Oct 2018
Port Alberni BC Canada
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cheryl%20and%20Jewel
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=81063


Re: Remy is getting Laminitis again and I don't know why

melanie Schwartz
 

I changed the  banamine to devils claw.  I ordered xrays,  cbc and lime test.  Do i need to order a seperate test for blood count?
--
MELANIE SCHWARTZ
DAVIE,  FLORIDA 33328
October 30, 2020
Remy's Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Melanie%20and%20Remy
Remys photos:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=263092


Re: Abscesses

dr.kellylear@...
 

Hi Sherry, 
I think the salmonella is getting better, and that is what my vet is telling me. She has had normal stools for the last two days and her SAA is still low. She lately seems to go through Intermittent gas colic and groan a lot and loot at her side. Her wbc is still high which concerns me along with her liver values (GGT, AST, and ALP). My vet tells me those are elevated because of her triglycerides being elevated for a while and her not eating much. To treat the high triglycerides they are adding dextrose to her fluids. They are also trying to get her to eat and the only thing she is eating is fresh picked grass and alfafa. Could this terrible diet be causing more foot pain?   I have tried offering her teff hay, Timothy, orchard and Bermuda along with tc Timothy cubes but still no interest. Any other suggestions? 

With the other foot hurting would it be smart to go ahead and start applying numotozine to it just in case there is an abscess? 

--

 

Kelly Lear in Texas 2021

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Kelly%20and%20Saddie

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=267371

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