Date   

Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Yes. 23 tabs 2X daily.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Robin
 


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

It should be 23 tabs twice a day.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Phyto-Quench

Sherry Morse
 

Hi Mary,

Has Vandy been started on Metformin as well as the Prascend?  Are you using PQ pellets (which have Devil's Claw added) or just the regular version.  Has her trim been addressed?  Please do not force her to walk when she is obviously in pain.  If she wants to lay down, let her lay down but you need to make sure you're addressing the elevated insulin and her trim as well as using supplements. 




Re: Need assistance with trimming hooves and BCS

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Just for the record, Kelly from HappyHoofPads is wrong. Cracks come from hooves taking abnormal forces because the trim is not correct. Poor nutrition, etc can contribute and yes, overloading a compromised hoof from a problem on the other side doesn't help things, but it's not the primary cause.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Robin
 

vet put him on 10 tabs once a day. He's about 257 lbs and each tab is 50 mg.
So, based on 10 mg/kg of body weight, he should be getting 23 tabs a day? Should I does all at once or maybe 12 tabs 2x daily?
--
Robin

Aiken, SC 2022

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Robin%20and%20Hogan  
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=275012


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

So 10 mg/kg of body weight?
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Need assistance with trimming hooves and BCS

a.k.a.petpalace2@...
 

I added photo album link to my signature page; I thought I did yesterday but apparently didn't hit save button.  Deleted duplicate photo.  If you need them, we took photos of other hoof angles i.e. sole plane 2, concavity and heels.  Apollo's over due for trim as farrier was on cross country vacation for 3+ weeks.  Last trim May 6, next scheduled trim 6/17. 

Toes are getting long.  That could explain why last couple of days, he seems to stumble when stepping out of stall onto concrete aisle.  Wearing cloud boots with 3/4" pads (6# EVA foam from HappyHoofPads) 24/7 (front only).  Have 2 pairs of cloud boots with pads so boots changed daily.  When it rains, water gets inside Apollo's boots as he'd rather stand outside than under lean-to.  Then we leave his boots off overnight so his hooves dry out.  Has several inches of shavings in stall for comfort.

We have a hoof rasp but no nippers, hoof knife or stand to put his foot on.  Thinking about getting them so we can keep up on his trims instead of relying on farrier.  Current farrier started last October.  Previous one who requested x-rays didn't seem to trim him any different even though acutely laminitic.   RF toe crack visible on x-ray, no longer a problem but probably due in part to wearing boots.  Kelly from HappyHoofPads told me that sometimes with hoof cracks, the cause is actually a problem in opposite hoof not the one with crack.  

J-herb made a huge difference in Apollo's hoof comfort, no longer seems stiff in morning and stall isn't trashed.  Unfortunately, vet wasn't receptive to using metformin even though insulin was >200 but somehow Apollo seems to have avoided full blown laminitis.   Had TRH stim test for Dr. K's study as well as repeat insulin and glucose done; results pending.  Keeping my fingers crossed news will be good.  I'm rinsing his high iron hay to remove surface contamination then soaking for 1 hour before draining.  Almost out of hay so also gets Timothy balance cubes.  

--
Karen B.
Wisconsin
2022
Apollo Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Karen%20and%20Apollo


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Robin
 

Hi Dr. Kellon,

He started Tramadol yesterday per your recommendation. So far, not helping.
--
Robin

Aiken, SC 2022

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Robin%20and%20Hogan  
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=275012


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

We don't recommend torturing horses to the point they are not eating! However, you can ask about a prescription for Tramadol instead of NSAIDs.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Phyto-Quench

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

We can't possibly answer your question about where pain is coming from over the internet. What I can tell you is that insulin and PPID are not being well controlled so  you should speak to your vet about increasing Prascend.

How much PQ is she getting and how often? Do NOT force her to walk.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Sherry Morse
 

Hi Robin,

Did you add in APF as well? Since you changed his Prascend dosage you may be seeing a bit of a veil effect.
--

Thanks,
Sherry and Scutch (and Scarlet over the bridge)
EC Primary Response

PA 2014

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Sherry%20and%20Scutch_Scarlet/Scutch%20Case%20History.pdf

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=78891

 


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Robin
 

Additionally, what I find very strange is that last night he didn't lay down at all. Prior to last night he's been laying down every night and is slow to get up in the morning.
--
Robin

Aiken, SC 2022

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Robin%20and%20Hogan  
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=275012


Re: Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Robin
 

I started Metformin on Wednesday. Yes, I'm syringing his mouth with water after each dose.
I also increased his prascent from .5 to .75 g over 3 days and yesterday to 1 g.
My vet wants to put him on nsaids. So, I haven't called the vet just yet as I think that's what she'd have me do.

He gets timothy balance hay cubes soaked with his supplements mixed in. He's been eating that fine for the last 2-3 wks. He started to back off on his feed after I stopped the nsaids and he's been eating less and less each day (past 5 days) I'd say. Now it's to the point he really isn't eating more than a few bite fulls.

If this group has not seen this before, then I'll have to get the vet in and probably put him back on nsaids. Was really trying to avoid that.
--
Robin

Aiken, SC 2022

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Robin%20and%20Hogan  
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=275012


Re: Getting Started and Trying to Learn

Lucy Butler
 

Thanks, Kirsten! That sounds like a great option!
--
Lucy Butler
Rhode Island, USA
Joined 2022
Rowan Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Lucy%20and%20Rowan
 

 


Phyto-Quench

HBRancher
 
Edited

Another day…
not improving at all…
Vandy has been on Phyto-Quench since June 5 - that’s 5 days now. No improvement. In fact, she can hardly walk. Her legs shake when she tries. She has NEVER been this sore - EVER!  In the 15+ years I’ve had her!  

She’s been on a full Prascend for 5 days. I’m sure she’s getting it.  Also I’m syringing the APF & Phyto-Quench so I know she’s getting that.

I try to take her for some walking exercise but she doesn’t want to even walk out of her stall. 
How long does it take for the Phyto-Quench to start working? She needs some kind of pain relief!  Bute?

Is it her arthritis?  Is it her feet?  Both?

Mary Moreau & Vandy
--
Mary
May 2022,  Holden, Louisiana
Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Mary%20and%20Vandy  .
Vandy's Photo Album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=275053  .


Re: June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Is he drinking, passing manure and urine normally? If not, you need to get your vet involved. How much Tramadol?
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Re: Mouse and Ryn 6/7/2022 blood work results DR Kellon advice please

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

For Ryn, exercise, exercise, exercise.  Otherwise, your next option is an SGLT2 inhibitor. If you e-mail me your vet's e-mail contact I will send information.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Hogan not eating - was Re: [ECIR] June Xrays and continued pain/abscess

Sherry Morse
 

Hi Robin,

Have you started Metformin?  Are you rinsing his mouth after administration? When did he stop eating?  (And does this mean his not eating anything or still eating hay but not hard feed?) Have you talked to your vet?




Re: Mouse and Ryn 6/7/2022 blood work results DR Kellon advice please

Sherry Morse
 

Hi Kimberly,

You would create a folder for Ryn within your current case history folder and then add the link to that folder to your signature.  Another option is rename your main folder to "Kimberly Mouse and Ryn" but you would need to update the link in your signature to go to the correct folder.  We don't usually put a link to a PDF in a signature because each time you update the file the link will need to be updated as well.

Ryn's insulin looks like it's coming down with just the diet change although it would be better if he was getting the metformin as well. Has he lost any weight since you started the diet change?  

For Mouse his insulin level is still in the danger zone for laminitis so trying to get the metformin in him as well as the diet change is even more important than for Ryn.  

Have you worked with either of them on using an oral syringe?

As far as the supplements - the main thing right now is the hay centered diet and getting hay tested to so it can be balanced.  You can add salt to the soaked hay and may be able to do the same with some of the other supplements - had you introduced those prior to throwing the metformin into the mix?  If they were eating r/s/r beet pulp or Stabul 1 with nothing in it I would go back to that and let them start eating it again before adding anything else in.  Then add in one thing at a time so they have time to adjust to the new addition (and you may find they object to one thing but not others).  




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