Date   

Re: Laminitis, EMS Help needed

 

Hello Twyla,
Your official welcome is coming all the way from Australia so it might take a bit of extra time.  I would be interested in knowing the actual values on your Cornell blood test results.  If you have not tested the hay to find that the sugar and starch are below 10%, you should soak it for an hour in cold water or half an hour in hot and then rinse and drain before feeding.  Not sure where you are located but even frozen hay will be eaten.  This can be something very valuable to do for a laminitic friend while sorting out all our information.
--
Martha in Vermont
ECIR Group Primary Response
July 2012 
 
Logo (dec. 7/20/19), Tobit(EC) and Pumpkin, Handy and Silver (EC/IR)

Martha and Logo


 
 


Re: Lowering ACTH levels

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Jane,

Welcome to the group. You'll be receiving a full New Member welcome loaded with information a bit later.

Short answer to your question is that  Evitex has no effect on the ACTH levels. It can help with some of the symptoms that are associated with PPID, such as lack of shedding.

Have a read here on our informational website for some more info:

https://www.ecirhorse.org/treatment-ppid.php

As donkeys are "poster children" for EMS/IR, have you had her insulin and glucose levels tested as well?

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR


Re: PEA Question

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

From personal experience I am gathering it is definitely addressing inflammation. Being that I know my frozen shoulder is caused by inflammation and I felt and immediate relief with improved range of motion. Then,  I ran out two days ago and I am definitely feeling the difference without it on board, range of motion is decreased.  I also see a difference in Vinnie too not having it for 2 days in his freedom of movement.  

Thx Nancy 
--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104


Re: PEA Question

Nancy C
 

Hi Lynn

Will give you what I think I know.

The title of the Equine study is (emphasis mine) :   “Oral supplementation with ultramicronized palmitoylethanolamide for joint disease and lameness management in four jumping horses: A case report,” Animals, August 2020

Here is a paragraph from a human study Therapeutic utility of palmitoylethanolamide in the treatment of neuropathic pain associated with various pathological conditions: a case series :

PEA anti-inflammatory actions allowing for a reduction of peripheral and central sensitization are mediated via both neuronal and nonneuronal cells. The latter comprise glia (in particular microglia, which are the brain’s macrophages) as well as peripheral and central mast cells. This profile of PEA may thus explain its broad potential in treating many different disorders related to pain and inflammation.


I think the above is telling us it works on the nerve pain as well as targeting other cells to reduce inflammation. Any soft tissue or joint that has inflammation and/or nerve involvement would, I think, see reduction in same by using PEA.  It will not prevent issues that arise from improper trim, improper work load, or other assault of the body but reduce the pain from issues like these. Not sure we have seen any effect on laminitis, or specifically, Winter Laminitis which has nerve involvement.

It is not going to "fix" the problem that first started the inflammation and pain.  So, with my PPID boy, Skip, my hope is it will allow him freedom of movement to slowly increase work load, to develop better muscle and ability to carry himself (and me).  He will still be trimmed to continue to develop the back of his foot.  SIDE BAR FOR Dr Bowker: I'm loving how his central sulcus and cuneate frog are looking in the snow.

For my human pain, I will continue to do my own work to bring back flexibility lost due to a couple years of severe life stress. I know I have a small amount of arthritis in my spine but was not diagnosed as being enough to get in the way. I want to prevent what appears to be mostly issues in soft tissue not becoming larger bone or cartilage involved problems.

It sounds like what you are using is working. If Relevante is not struggling with obvious discomfort, I'm not sure I would use it yet.  If I found I reached a plateau in my training and work schedule, I would consider it hopefully with an understanding of what is holding us back.

Not sure I am helping. I am still finding my way on this.
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
ECIR Group Inc. President/Treasurer  2019-2020
Join us at the 2021 NO Laminitis! Conference, August 12-15, Harrisburg, PA


Re: Cutting Invokana tabs

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Thanks Lavinia, that is what I thought, so I was wondering what folks are doing for dosing  horses between let's say 700 and 900 lb and invokana knowing that it comes in 100mg and 300mg pills.
--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104


Re: Cutting Invokana tabs

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 
Edited

If you try to divide any medication into smaller does than what it is scored for on the actual pill, there are no guarantees about the active ingredient(s) being evenly divided into the segments. How to get around that issue is going to depend on which medication you are working with.

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR


Lowering ACTH levels

Goodthingstocome55@...
 

Hi, 

I have a Poitou donkey with Cushings. I have had her on Evitex since August. Her no fasting ACTH level was 293.
I just had her re-tested and it is 135. The vet recommended 1/2 pill of Prascend.....which I plan to do.

Was wondering if anyone has kept using the Evitex with Prascend and if it might keep allow her to stay on a lower dosage?
Thanks 

--
Jane W in Virginia 2021


Re: Cutting Invokana tabs

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Thanks Cass, I did originally post a thread a couple weeks back but never got any response. 

I am wondering just out of curiosity for horses smaller than Vinnie what the dosing looks like for let's say of you have a smaller horse. How reliable are these tabs to be scored multiple times? 
--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104


Re: Cutting Invokana tabs

 

Hi, Nancy.
I suggest you post a new thread with a different subject line about cutting Invokana tablets to reach exact  dose.

If Vinnie's weight is still 1087 lb/493 kg, the dosing is so close to 300 mg that it's impractical to cut the tablet to achieve a dose of 295.8 mg. 
--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos


Re: Potential Grain Emergency

Nancy C
 

Hi Anne

Hang in there.  Here is a doc with emergency protocols for grass breakouts.  It also references grain room break-ins and has ideas for icing.

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/Emergency%20Protocols/Protocol%20for%20horse%20that%20got%20out%20on%20grass.pdf

Keep breathing.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
ECIR Group Inc. President/Treasurer  2019-2020
Join us at the 2021 NO Laminitis! Conference, August 12-15, Harrisburg, PA


Re: Laminitis, EMS Help needed

Nancy Kitchen
 

Just a member here but wanted to offer some support during this scary time for you.  We have all felt the same emotions that you are feeling right now.  Keep breathing, you are in the right place, my horse is still with me because of the knowledge that was shared with me on this site..  Take one step at a time and keep breathing...
--
Nancy K
Smoke and Tucky
November 2018, Southeast, MA

Smoke Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Smoke
Smoke Photo Album:    https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=94122
Tucky Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Tuck 
Tucky Photo Album:


Re: PEA Question

Lynn
 

I'm reposting this question originally added to Feb 3   

I learned of PEA for the first time through that thread. When I got Relevante my vet guesstimated his age - from his teeth - to be 20 (not 15 as I was originally told at the time of his rescue). This May he'll be coming up on 24 years of age. I plan to start riding him in March (slowly of course). He's been on Mov-Ease from the beginning [ and I've been trying the Uckele Hemp Joint pellets as well] but it sounds like members are experiencing visible results with PEA. Relevante is not experiencing the type of discomfort [though his rads show some ringbone in his front feet - which has not progressed over the last four years] many described on that thread per se ....but with his age and our plans to ride and slowly get to some real exercise could I give him this almost as a preventative or as extra support for him?  And if so, should I stop the Uckele Hemp Joint? Also, per Maria's question...

Which are the tissues more helped by PEA? Mainly joints and muscle to some extent, or can also help with tendons and ligaments?
--
Lynn
Beavercreek, Ohio
March 2018
Relevante Case History
Relevante Photo Album
--
Lynn
Beavercreek, Ohio
March 2018
Relevante Case History
Relevante Photo Album

Ω


Re: Potential Grain Emergency

Judy and Bugsy
 

I have no idea but would exercise help with the carb overload? Not suggesting, just asking more experienced folk. 


Sitting on pins and needles for sure!  Positive thoughts coming your way. 
--

 

Judy and Bugsy

Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada

Feb. 25, 2020

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Judy%20and%20Bugsy
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=243358

 




Re: Neurogan CBDs 20% off

TERRI JENNINGS
 

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/search?q=Neurogan
-

If you search Neurogan you’ll find the different threads. 



Terri Jennings with Teeny, Finn and Elliott
Arcata, CA
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Terri%20and%20Teeny
Joined 2019


Re: Laminitis, EMS Help needed

Lorna Cane
 

On Sat, Feb 6, 2021 at 09:04 AM, <twylaring@...> wrote:
I sincerely hope that I'm not giving you too much information and if so I apologize.
Hi Twyla(?),

You'll find that  it's difficult to give us too much information.We seem to just keep asking.

You will shortly receive an official welcome,containing tons of details ,to help your girl.

In the meantime,go to our Files and begin reading the Start Here file.I think the links are in your first welcome note.

You'll be asked for specific details,such as lab numbers,exact diet at present,and more,so anything you have will be valuable.

Just wanted to say you've come to the right place,so keep breeathing.

 
--

Lorna  in Eastern  Ontario
2002
Check out FAQ : https://www.ecirhorse.org/FAQ.php


Laminitis, EMS Help needed

twylaring@...
 

My husband Monty and I have a middle aged molly mule, our beloved Hoalena, who has laminitis,  and we are very concerned for her. When we bought her several years ago her neck was too heavy, rolled to one side with fatty pockets on her body. We feed only grass hay yet recently see some clover in the last bought which we've stopped. She is a gentle, sweet soul.
She first presented with laminitis, stiff slow moving. The Vet sent her bloodwork to Cornell Vet University with suspicion of Cushing's Disease. It was negative for now.  
Hoalena's test results showed;
ACTH- normal 
Insulin- >2x high
Leptin- >6x high 
Vet now suspects EMS (equine metabolic syndrome)which we'd never heard of but learning. 
What do you suggest for an anti-inflammatory for her? Also do you have a suggestion for a vitamin/mineral supplement?
I sincerely hope that I'm not giving you too much information and if so I apologize.
Do you know of a good nutritionist who we should call? 
She's getting bute now but we want to treat the cause vs the symptoms. 
We prefer to only try a couple supplements at a time vs several. 
We're grateful for your help. We love her so very much and we're worried for her. 


Re: Potential Grain Emergency

Brenda Gasch Mittelstadt
 

Wow Anne, that is too bad and I’m sorry you are going through this stress. I hope for you both that his system handles it! It’s one of my fears and one of the reasons I’m trying very hard to (and my fortunate situation with my own bit of land and pasture allows this) keep my two ponies on flexible diets that include some grazing. One reason; the nutrition in grass and other flora. Two; the exercise mentally and physically. Three; the variety that I hope lowers risk of a dramatic event should they get out on grass longer or when I don’t expect it. I know it’s such a fine line, and grass is very different than oats and corn!

I wanted to write this as support to you as I know how easily these things can happen and it’s a concern I have too. We had a quarter horse when I was a kid that got out of a boarding pasture into a garage with a bag of grain. They did put a hose down him and used oils to flush. No idea if that’s a standard for vets. It was the only time I had the experience some forty years ago. 

well wishes!
--
-Brenda

September 2020, Dodgeville WI USA

Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Brenda%20and%20Stormy


Re: Neurogan CBDs 20% off

Brenda Gasch Mittelstadt
 

I missed the discussion and it does not appear here. What was its title please?
--
-Brenda

September 2020, Dodgeville WI USA

Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Brenda%20and%20Stormy


Re: Confused about iron content

bakermouse
 

Thank you for your answer which I found very helpful.
The manufacturer is pointing at the zeolite as being the source of the high iron in their product. I think it's because it's a New Zealand zeolite and we have high iron soils here, so it's plausible the iron's stuck to this particular zeolite.
Here is the answer they gave me about the high iron content: 

"As this is a matter of concern to us, I have just spoken with our suppliers of Zeolite and they have given some more information that will shed light onto this matter.

Due to the natural negative charge of zeolite it will not release the iron within it unless there is a cation exchange required, for this to happen there would need to be a deficiency of iron. The zeolite will also help by absorbing any excess nutrients in the gut and carrying it out with it.

The extent of the capabilities of the zeolite is far greater than I am able to explain, so should you have any further questions around this, feel free to contact Mike at Blue Pacific Minerals  - michael@..."

I am planning to email Mike next. I just want to understand why something this high in iron is being marketed as a horse feed. Or if the iron isn't bioavailable, whether that's been shown in clinical trials and if so, where can I read about that. I'm not planning to feed this to my horse, I'm just exploring this topic out of interest because I have successfully managed my own ponies out of iron overload (diagnosed in blood tests & clinical signs). My friend was feeding this product and she had a health problem in her horse (inflammatory episode). Others are feeding it and describing it as "amazing". 
 
--
Louise B, New Zealand, joined in 2021


Re: Potential Grain Emergency

Sherry Morse
 

You can ice him for the next several days (I would plan on over the weekend at the very least) and administer mineral oil. Have you taken his temperature and checked his feet for pulses and warmth?  If you have an area outside that you can contain him in that's snow covered that may be an option instead of using ice boots.  Continue to monitor his feet and his temperature over the next several days - 48 hours at least - and if anything changes you may need to have the vet out. 

I would not just wait and pray.