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Prascend in Australia
takarri@...
Prascend will soon be launched in Australia. Date yet to be announced. I'm curious, for those that are currently using this product, as to what you are paying for a 1mg box- of either 60's or 160's. Thanks Pauline & Spur Sth West Vic Australia Aug 07 EC Primary Response
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New file uploaded to EquineCushings
EquineCushings@...
Hello,
This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the EquineCushings group. File : /Australia/Blood Testing in Australia March 2015.pdf Uploaded by : ponyjackpal <takarri@...> Description : You can access this file at the URL: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/files/Australia/Blood%20Testing%20in%20Australia%20March%202015.pdf To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398 Regards, ponyjackpal <takarri@...> |
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Re: Re Jaspers New hoof pictures ( Really need help )
corrine haffner
Hi Lavinia
Will giving him bute for just this time cause an issue with ulcers flaring up? He's got a history of issues with bute ulcers being the main one. Had alot of bruising on both fronts right where coffen bone would be,so not sure what that means? No luck so far on removing his shoes. Have one shoe loosened but not off, He gets pretty upset when any pressure is put on hoofs.. I wonder if this shoe job has set of a laminits attack? his front feet feel very warm compared to hind feet. Farrier pared out a fair amount of sole might be part of why he's come up so lame?? Will try having him stand on a real thick saddle pad,see if it helps,both feet are equally sore :( He's getting tied of me messing with him,sees me coming and pins his ears at me. Thanks, Corrine and Jasper Minnesota 4/2014 |
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Re: Alternatives to Bute
Hi Melanie
I'm sorry to leave you hanging! Yes it sounds like you have most things in place which is important for these things to work as best as possible. Make sure you are keeping an eagle eye on the trim. That can get in the way of complete comfort. jherb dose is to start at one-quarter teasp 2xs a day before being fed their supplement meal. Check gums before you start the regimen. Keep upping very few days until you see them pink. You should also see more foot comfort. ALCAR is 1 gram per 100 lbs of BW to start. Can go up to 2 grams per 100 lb. Should be fed with food. I moved your CH from a stand alone doc to the folder that has your Hay Analysis and labeled as such. Here is the link. Copy and paste this link to a doc and save it on your hard drive for later use in your signature. https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ECHistory8/files/Melanie%20and%20Clyde/
Keep us posted. Nancy C in NH ECIR Moderator 2003 FACT: Standing on cement significantly reduces blood flow to the equine foot. See R. M. Bowker, VMD, PhD, Nerves, Nerves, Nerves: Why Are They So Important To The Horse? 2013 NO Laminitis! Proceedings, www.ecirhorse.org and See RM Bowker, VMD, PhD, The Vascular Cushion Of The Frog What Does It Do? 2013 NO Laminitis! Proceedings, Equine Cushing's and Insulin Resistance Group Inc.
---In EquineCushings@..., <esp_christensen@...> wrote : Hi Nancy, I did read the archive about getting pain under control to promote healing. Clyde is doing better, and I have followed the protocol. Dr. Kellon help me balance out my mineral/vitamin needs. However Clyde is still tender/sore, even when wearing protective boots. He has not been on Bute for at least 2 weeks. Is it okay to try the J-herb and ALCAR? I would like to start a slow exercise program for him, but not while I feel he is still healing, or still so tender. Thank you in advance for your help, Kind regards, Melanie & Clyde, Minnesota January 2015 |
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Re: Alternatives to Bute
---In EquineCushings@..., <esp_christensen@...> wrote : He has not been on Bute for at least 2 weeks. Is it okay to try the J-herb and ALCAR? Absolutely OK to try J and ALCar but remember trim is a critical element here and he may need to drain collections of pus or fluid. Eleanor in PA www.drkellon.com
EC Co-owner Feb 2001 |
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Re: She is in distress
I'm not sure what you sent, LeeAnne. If a video can't see it.
Is she eating, drinking, pooping, peeing? Can you get Numotizine? More efficient than soaking. Abscess can get bad, very bad, just before it breaks. Nancy C in NH ECIR Moderator 2003 FACT: The VA Polytechnic Pony Study is the only study to look at IR and laminitis under natural conditions. See E. M. Kellon, VMD, Diagnosis of Insulin Resistance and PPID, 2013 NO Laminitis! Proceedings, Equine Cushing's and Insulin Resistance Group Inc.
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Re: Re Jaspers New hoof pictures ( Really need help )
Lavinia Fiscaletti
Hi Corinne,
You could try giving him some bute, wait a couple of hours for it to take effect then try to pull the shoes. Start with the worst foot first, place padding under the opposite one - garden kneeling pad, folded up fleece, saddle pad, anti-fatigue kitchen-type mat, anything you have handy. Could also see if you can catch him lying down. Depending on what was/wasn't done with the soles, the putty is probably adding pressure where Jasper can't tolerate it. Shoes may be exacerbating existing imbalances too. Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut Jan 05, RI EC Support Team |
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Re: She is in distress
Kerry Isherwood
What are you hot soaking? Is she panting bc she's too hot? Are you able to check her temperature with a rectal thermometer?
kerry in ny |
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Re: Alternatives to Bute
Hi Nancy, I did read the archive about getting pain under control to promote healing. Clyde is doing better, and I have followed the protocol. Dr. Kellon help me balance out my mineral/vitamin needs. However Clyde is still tender/sore, even when wearing protective boots. He has not been on Bute for at least 2 weeks. Is it okay to try the J-herb and ALCAR? I would like to start a slow exercise program for him, but not while I feel he is still healing, or still so tender. Thank you in advance for your help, Kind regards, Melanie & Clyde, Minnesota January 2015 |
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Re: She is in distress
LeeAnne Bloye <ThePitchforkPrincess@...>
How about ice instead of hot soak. She is panting and warm. Outside temp is around freezing
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Sent from my iPhone On Mar 29, 2015, at 2:39 PM, LeeAnne Bloye <thepitchforkprincess@...> wrote: |
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She is in distress
LeeAnne Bloye <ThePitchforkPrincess@...>
Sorry but this just looks so horrible. Off Bute gave. Jherb. Any thing else to be done
---------- Sent from my iPhone |
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Re: Diagnosing PPID
---In EquineCushings@..., <kerry.isherwood@...> wrote : The point is that what horses crave more than grass is companionship, being w other horses as well as with you. They can & will live very happily w/o grass, even non-IR horses do & will. This is very true and they will be perfectly happy with constant access to hay. If you have an acre or more of grass that you can't use because of IR issues, there is more than likely a farmer in your area that would be delighted to harvest that grass as hay and pay you in a portion of the hay. This is a great situation because you can also dictate specifics, like cutting in early morning to get the lowest possible sugar/starch. = = = = = = = = Dont despair, we are here to help get you through the storm. Yes we are! Eleanor in PA www.drkellon.com
EC Co-owner Feb 2001 |
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Re: Diagnosing PPID
christina g
Hi Maggie! Thanks for all the info and help. I am struggling with the case history form indeed - when I try to edit it it's letting me move all of the elements around if I click on them and try to create a text box and it's just VERY slow and frustrating (not like inputting text in a designated area as an edit; I have to create the field/box and the entire form is able to be pulled apart at the slightest misclick) But more importantly in the interim! I have had the barn vet out to do the blood test and the ACTH test last week. Both tests came back "normal" (as per the vet) and I'm still waiting for the copy of the actual results, but the vets words were essentially "the more I think about it, I don't think he's a PPID case because he doesn't have the typical cresty neck and he has a weight gain problem, not a problem gaining too much weight" and this just freaks me out. DJ may not be a PPID case but that sort of approach seems so counter to what I'm reading and I feel at a loss not having someone on my side here. DJ is a 21 yr old TB who in the last 3 to 4 years has gone through these dips - seeming seasonal looking back on it. I'll be straightforward here, the reason I stumbled onto the path of PPID with him is because I was considering EPM, though it wasn't a CLEAR picture of epm (not neurological signs exactly, weakness moreso). But going through the process of diagnosing EPM you must rule out a list of other possibilities that share common symptoms - PPID being the one that fit DJ the most especially with regards to his lack of fever. All of the other causes usually stemmed around fever presence. And the most effecting symptoms in DJ's case are muscle wasting/lethargy and off and on skin issues etc. However - what do I do when his tests come back "normal" and he's a ribby old TB? His current diet is timothy am/meadow grass pm for hay with a standlee timothy pellet based "graining" (of about 5-6lbs total at the moment) am & pm soaked with wheat bran and one serving contains ca trace/salt/and copper/zinc to balance out the iron levels in the hay (both tested) he's on linseed meal and peas as well to make sure he's getting enough/the right proteins in there. He gets maybe 2-3 hours of grazing in a day on top of it. His teeth are due, and mostly I've forgone that apt this month to try and get this diagnosing done and the soaked pellets are to try and circumvent the possibility of him simply not being able to chew as well as he needs although his teeth were checked and did not seem that problematic, nor does he show obvious sign of struggle with eating hay - he is a slow eater however. Has been since I've known him. I've gone through higher dosages of linseed meal/organic soybean meal, adding oats,etc over the last six months.. and mid winter he seemed to pick back up a little bit - his coat looked super healthy and rich color, but now in the last month he has really tanked again, he's showing signs of stress/anxiety his coat is shedding oddly and his undercoat is not his typical color. he's barefoot and his feet feel like they are changing as well. His skin issues seem to be spiking again and he just looks generally lethargic and like he's wasting again. Had a fecal done two days ago - negative for anything (however I know this does not mean he can't have encysted strongyles or other such things) the last time the vet was out to redraw blood for the ACTH because it didn't get handled properly he suggested treating him for ulcers because he does show symptoms so DJ is now on the compounded gastroguard for a month as well. I don't know what his problem is but it is breaking my heart to see him this way and I unfortunately do not have bottomless pockets. I am racking my brain on what his issue is but I just have a gut feeling that it's hormonal, or there is definitely some underlying issue that is severely hindering him. I have to go back out to work but I will try to have another go at the case history and get him taped if I can etc. I would assume he's ideally 1.1klbs + he's a fairly big/long TB 16.2. He's gotta be at least 50lbs under of muscle weight and it's all topline/hind. He was in light/moderate work (3 times a week) until last week we just stopped it completely. Again, very worrisome but when the vet came to do the testing I asked if we should go ahead with the scheduled vaccinations for the day in the case that he IS PPID and he said "I see no reason not to, we don't worry about that kind of thing with these guys" and so DJ got a 5-way and that just knocked him out of whack completely. Anyway sorry for the short novel, I'm just not sure what to do at all. - Christina & DJ (& Shadow & Lyon too!) March 2015 Sonoma County, CA |
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Re: Diagnosing PPID
Kerry Isherwood
Barbara,
Four years ago we jumped on the chance to buy a foreclosed property w barn & run-down land to be able to realize my dream of retiring my old mare at home. I envisioned sitting at dusk on my porch and gazing lovingly at my old mare grazing alongside her eventual replacement, my younger gelding. She would whisper her wisdom to him and keep him in line as only an old alpha mare can. I couldnt wait to get the property ready Reality came crashing down two years ago when my mare was diagnosed IR. Two years of intensive study and very strict diet kept her sound & showing yet her insulin remained so unstable that even a couple bites of grass swiped accidentally set her back for days. She was diagnosed early PPID last autumn and while pergolide has greatly helped control her insulin swings, grass--even dead grass--remains a dangerous laminitic trigger for her. Alas, my mare will never be able to graze in her twilight on my now beautiful lawn. A dry-lot is definitely not a property enhancer, but its saved my mare's life. In an odd twist of fate, my gelding also tested IR last year as well. So now neither of my horses can graze the acres Ive worked so hard to rejuvenate. Instead of watching my horses graze from my porch, they now watch me curiously from their dry-lot as I mow for hours on the tractor that was supposed to be my new trailer... The point is that what horses crave more than grass is companionship, being w other horses as well as with you. They can & will live very happily w/o grass, even non-IR horses do & will. And as I have learned, having to mow grass is still way way better than watching my horses suffer from sore feet Dont despair, we are here to help get you through the storm. Kerry in NY Pinky Sept 2014 Tofurky Nov 2014 |
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Re: Diagnosing PPID
Hi Barbara,
My paso fino also is severely IR and is currently laminitic. But my other paso fino is at the other end of the spectrum. I currently have them separated and my IR horse is never allowed to have grass. We're in the middle of is building a track system in the pasture, the end result being that the track on the outter edge of the pasture won't have grass. BUT, my IR paso will finally be able to hang out with his buddy again without me worrying about him eating any grass. The track will have hay bag stations instead of grass. Google Pasture Paradise and you'll be able to read about what I'm talking about. The interior part of the pasture will still have grass so my non-IR horse can graze sometimes, but the majority of the time my horses will be together on the track. The theory is they'll move more on the track (better for they're feet and overall health) instead of standing around in the pasture getting fat and laminitic on green grass. Coral & Po Sept 2013 Corpus Christi https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Coral%20and%20Poseido/ https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/photos/albums/1329712784
---In EquineCushings@..., <vincentbab19@...> wrote : Hi Maggie, The long awaited spring I've so looked forward to is now a source of dread. I do hope there are some times when she can go out with her horse buddy and have some grass and quality horsey time (with grazing muzzle). For just a few hours, at time when grass is lowest in sugar. Not sure how we will cope otherwise. |
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REPOST: WAS Poseido's lab results NOW Questions
Thank you for the answers I've gotten so far! These are the questions I have left: 1) I uploaded new body condition pics of Po in my photo album. Does his body condition look good now? 2) Can I give Phyto-quench all the time, or is it really only for pain management? Thanks, Coral & Po Sept 2013 Corpus Christi https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Coral%20and%20Poseido/
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/photos/albums/1329712784
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Re: Diagnosing PPID
Maggie
Hi Barbara, Can you get her another mini to keep her company in her dry lot? Also would be really helpful to do labs again with a leptin level to help differentiate if she is IR at baseline or if her high ACTH is driving her insulin up. Is she on pergolide? Maggie, Chancey and Spiral in VA March 2011 EC moderator/Primary Response |
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Re: Haylage question
lars_a_swe
---In EquineCushings@..., <gentpony@...> wrote : > How did you perform the analysis on your haylage? Can unwanted weeds be easily identified and removed, as in regular hay, or is this generally a chopped product?
- - - - - Hi Eva, I took samples from four different bales. 3 small samples from each bale (at the top, in the middle and at the bottom of the bale). I kept the samples in the freezer until I had all twelve samples. Then I mixed the samples well and took out one sample which I sent to Equi-analytical. I also have an analysis from the grower. She took out samples on the field before baling. She went diagonally over the field and picked up several small samples which she mixed into one sample. However, she only tested for protein and energy. Crude protein is 10.0% according to her analysis and in the analysis from Equi-analytical it is 10.8%. So I’m quite confident that the sample I took out is reasonably representative. Some haylage are chopped but the majority in our country is not. Our haylage is not chopped. It’s very dry to be haylage, 76.2% DM, it’s reasonably green and it doesn’t look very different from hay. This is the first time we are feeding haylage to our horses. The reason for choosing haylage instead of hay this year is that it’s almost impossible to find hay with a sufficient amount of protein. Due to the weather situation last year all hay was cut very late which resulted in an extremely low protein content. I can only say that we are very happy with this haylage product. The grower is anxious to produce good quality haylage and we will probably be buying haylage from her again. Lars Sweden, July 2008 |
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Re: Haylage question
jennifer
Not Lars, but you use a probe. Afterwards you seal the hole you created. :) It's the same you would do if small holes/ punctures occur in the course of the year. It's not a problem if you catch them early.
Jennifer in Germany Laramie July 2011 ---In EquineCushings@..., <gentpony@...> wrote : Hi Lars, Haylage is not commonly fed to horses here in Canada, but we may need to explore this in the future. When we perform a hay analysis, we take core samples of several bales (at least 25) for more accurate results.
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Re: Diagnosing PPID
Barbara Vincent
Hi Maggie,
I do appreciate all your help and expertise. But I'm feeling profoundly depressed by your advice. As was my mini, when last November, when she had the laminitis episode, and I put a closed grazing muzzle on her. She did not run and play and exercise; she pawed and pawed, and then she put her head down and moped and moped and moped. The long awaited spring I've so looked forward to is now a source of dread. I do hope there are some times when she can go out with her horse buddy and have some grass and quality horsey time (with grazing muzzle). For just a few hours, at time when grass is lowest in sugar. Not sure how we will cope otherwise. I've looked over the multi-page Case History form and will try to find time to get to it sometime in the next week or so. Need to learn quite a few new skills (weight estimating, etc.) to do this. Thanks for the counsel. Barbara Malvern, PA March 2015 |
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