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Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in...
Shannon
My experience is that the water stays cool..... and nasty. No matter how much I have cleaned it, the water comes out rust-colored. Its not the temperature that would make me hate it, its the metallic taste I assume it has. This is not the kind that the horse has to nudge with his muzzle, it just has a floater that tells it to refill when it dips. (Like a toilet works, basically.
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Just my experience with one in a well-ventilated stall, though. Shannon, Rafiq and Majik Houston June 09
--- In EquineCushings@..., "headmare0" <headmare0@...> wrote:
--- In EquineCushings@..., Cathy Huffman <frazzia5@> wrote: |
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Re: Has Anyone Ever Used the Product "Cushing's Secret"???
muff747
Here's the link to Mattys history, http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory2/files/__This%20is%20CaseHistory2/Chris%20Hardaker/
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not updated in detail since November 09 but all test results are within. We can only get tablets here in UK so I crush them to powder and he has 2 mg am and 2mg pm Just to recap, he has no fat pads, still has depressions over his eyes and has never had a cresty neck etc. etc. Thanks Chris/Matty UK 07/09Chris - where is your case history? That will help us sort through the details. |
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Re: at my wits end... now what do I feed her?
Don <don@...>
We are never out of options. Heck, you just used this one, the EC list.
Hang in there. If you can I recommend lightening your mood around your horse. You may hate me for this and have my permission, but unless a horse is showing sick refusing food is more or less a joke for the vast majority of horses. My own are spoiled rotten and when they refuse something in their diet I laugh because I know if I let them go without a meal, and cut way back on their hay, leaving enough to stave off ulcer risk, the entire show is my hands, not theirs. But they are dear things - spoiled or not. One never knows what a horse will take a liking to until the horse has a chance to show them. I'd be looking at all the possible ingredients we use for our PPID and IR horses, trying a bit of this and a bit of that with the mag ox. A pinch of salt? Some ground flax seed, or whole if you can pick some up at the grocery store. Some dried or cracked peas (usually a safe treat - anyone feel free to speak up if I'm wrong on this one), celery, some of the other minerals we feed? And I'd move that temptation of the sweet feed nearby and the pig of a horse next door with it (just teasing, but to your mare it's very insulting). If you get the sweets out of sight out of mind it may help. It's your mare, and her history that you know better than any of us. Keep your ideas flowing, and be sure that as long as you can get a little roughage in her (safe of course) she is not in danger, and likely will be many weeks before she'll starve herself to death. Oh, and have you tried watering the mag ox and spreading it over the BP? I'm sure there will be more ideas coming from the list. Besides the BP she's refusing what other feed is she refusing? Her hay? Or forage replacement cubes? As for BP pellet, while we know it's over limit for sugar, at least the test I had the local feed formulator run for me with Equi-Analytical, a few whole ones handed as an enticement isn't likely to trigger colic. It's percent of sugar in a total diet at a feeding that matters. Don - Pacific Northwest U.S. Temperate Rainforest 11/2007 - EC List Support Team Visit the new Cushings and IR site: http://www.ecirhorse.com/ da_horse99 wrote: ... ...
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Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in...
headmare0 <headmare0@...>
Wow Cathy that is a sweeping statement that is totally incorrect in very high temp areas, like southern AZ where I live. Personally I would never use an automatic watererer for several reasons: as you mentioned they do hold less, however with it being very shallow it rapidly approaches the air temperature and when that goes over 90 degrees, the horses do not like to drink it. Also, the metal holding bowl gets extremely hot, increasing again the temp of the water most esp if located in direct sunlight. The heat of the metal also discourages the horse from pressing the valve as it actually can get so hot it can burn the sensitive muzzle, let alone the human hand. Also the temperature of the water as it comes out of the pipe is extremely warm and I generally have to let the water run for a while until the water cools off. I have several friends who did not realize this as they did not want to deal with cleaning water tubs, but I would rather do that than deal with the automatic system.
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Carol Sept 2009 AZ
--- In EquineCushings@..., Cathy Huffman <frazzia5@...> wrote:
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Re: at my wits end... now what do I feed her?
Laura Matthews <lauratmatt@...>
I was told about a product called Remission by AniMed Horse Care.I am far from expert on these matters, but I used Remission when my gelding was in the laminitis mode. He improved on it fairly fast and his crest went away in a matter of days. Saying that, there may be real reasons not to use it, but I can't tell you what it is other than it is not balanced to your hay. He liked the taste fine. It looks like corn meal as far as texture goes--but no corn as far as I know. I used Remission before I found this web site, so it was trial and error at that time. Don't know if this gives you any help, but it may be worth trying in a pinch if you can't get your horse to take it any other way. At least it isn't very expensive! Laura and Boo Boo NC 1/2010 |
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Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in...
Mandy Woods
Shannon,
Big NO NO on the mineral block. Just purchase a white block and give him a bucket of loose iodized salt or as you are syringing it. No sense in mixing all the minerals up ~ and those mineral blocks have Iron and Molasses in them which is not approved of. Your goal is to get him on a Balanced diet. Mandy in VA EC First Responder OCT 2003 |
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Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in...
Shannon
Cathy - I totally agree, but not sure Rafiq agrees, LOL. To put this in perspective, however, I must say this is the first time this has ever happened (extreme dehydration, moderately serious colic), and I do not know for certain which came first. When he is closed in his stall (which is when its muddy out), he always gets plenty of water from the automatic waterer, so I don't know. I do keep it clean!
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Thanks! Shannon, Rafiq and Majik Houston June '09
--- In EquineCushings@..., Cathy Huffman <frazzia5@...> wrote:
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Hairing up
Lynn Swearingen <lynngs@...>
My beautiful 6 yr. old mare has grown a hair coat and the temps are in the 90's already.
She was a reiner 2 yrs, showing and kept stalled and under lights. I bought her 2 yrs. ago. She grew a hair coat in the summer and then dropped it in a few weeks the first year I owned her. I figured it was just her system adjusting to turnout, no lights, and a more natural lifestyle. She was fine until just this past month. She dropped her winter coat then she grew it back and the temps are in the 90's. She has very little grass in her pasture, gets hay and supplements balanced to her hay, and is fed TC Lite once a day. I do not ride her anywhere near what she was used to while showing. (Maybe she needs more exercise) The other horses are smooth coated and they all are super shiny with great bare hooves. I'm worried about this. Lynn Swearingen |
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Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in...
Shannon
Greg - Yes! Rafiq is almost due for shoeing (this Friday), so today would be a good day to show how much hoof he is growing, too. I saw this just before leaving for the barn. Great timing! Will try to upload pictures of both Rafiq and Majik ASAP. :)
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Your fellow Houstonians! Shannon, Rafiq, and Majik Houston 05/09
--- In EquineCushings@..., Gregory Sokoloski <hpdmp3486@...> wrote:
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Re: Gastric Ulcers
Shannon
I have had gastric ulcers and I occasionally blame Rafiq for them, LOL. I do know that Gastroguard is well-recommended and it takes time once the stomach acid is rebalanced for the ulcers themselves to heal. You may want to discuss the dosage with your vet.
Also, your horse may highly benefit from a companion other than the *just* the bossy mare. I'm not sure if this is an option or how the mare will react, but even something as simple as a goat will "join the herd." I have some friends who have racehorses and they have had great success with goats as well as miniature horses. Also, there was an article in TheHorse about choosing a good "companion" horse to keep stress down. Adopting an easy keeper (not IR!) who may just be pasture-sound due to an old injury, is also recommended. Just some thoughts! Race horses and show horses are most prone to ulcers, at least in part due to the stresses they face. Maybe your guy is still stressed over the loss of his best buddy and needs a mild-mannered buddy who will fill the spot his previous buddy did. Wishing you and your boy well! Shannon, Rafiq(IR/EC) and Majik(IR) |
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Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in...
Shannon
Mandy - the giant ice cube idea is genius! Just gotta say that is one idea everyone in a hot zone should know about. If it looks like he is still not drinking enough for the heat, that is definitely something to try. He now has a tub, a bucket and an automatic waterer as drinking options, so water availability is not a problem. (He just chooses to drink from the tub rather than the automatic waterer if he can.)
The colic episode was a FIRST time issue in his life. I am trying to identify if this is going to become a chronic problem. The weight thing is most likely due to needing to move his diet up a step beyond just coastal hay. We added salt yesterday to his syringed supplements, and I'm going to be picking up a salt block and a mineral block (let him choose which, if either, is of interest to him. I may have to give the ODTB cubes a chance. He was on alfalfa when he was staying at the vet clinic. It was an orchard grass/alfalfa mix (soaked before feeding). Alfalfa was recommended by my vet, but the alfalfa I would be buying would not be the same as what they use. I plan to consult with her tomorrow on these issues. Purina L/S feed is still a very likely option as well. As for the Banamine, I believe this was a misunderstanding. Rafiq had a single dose of Banamine (10cc in muscle) the night he was colicking. He is on no regular/daily pain medication. The exercise issue is just something that I'm going to be slowly adding this month once we have decided that the exercise he is getting isn't causing him more harm to the hoof he nearly completely lost. I'm actually hoping he can be turned out in a small shady pen during the day eventually. He just doesn't need to be running around on that foot quite yet. (Not that he agrees with this assessment most days!) A lot of these ideas I'm receiving are great, especially if you have your horse right with you. Rafiq is boarded however (at over $500/mth), and now I'm buying my own feed for Majik (and Rafiq if I give it to him), and buying additional hay cubes or pelleted timothy is going to make expenses skyrocket even more, considering the cost of supplements as well. I will really make myself sick trying to endure a 3x/day routine. Twice a day would be difficult but I'll do it if needed. (I'll do what is needed even if it does make me sick, but the truth is that I could overdo it and then be in a serious jam.) Before last summer, Rafiq never had a health issue in his life aside from finding ways to bang up his legs on occasion. I'd love to get back to a level where he is feeling and looking like he should - I just don't want to risk everything by rushing new foodstuffs too quickly. But, I'm certainly open to any/all suggestions... rather than try one and not ask about the others, only to have the first fail with no back up in place! (Kinda like BP is doing with the oil spill? Grrr... another topic altogether!) Ack, off to the barn! Love y'all for everything! Seriously! (And Rafiq does too!) Shannon, Rafiq(IR/EC) and Majik(IR) Houston, TX |
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Re: at my wits end... now what do I feed her?
Chanda
Sorry, I don't know if Remission would be suitable in your situation, but if someone more knowledgeable here says it is, just wanted to let you know... I feed it to two laminitic mares, and both eat it dry out of thier buckets; initially I did need to mix it in beet pulp, but now they eat it just fine dry. HOpefully it will be an option to try, perhaps after a bucket of REmission, you're mare would go back to the plain magnesium.
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Chanda MT-9/04
--- In EquineCushings@..., "da_horse99" <da_horse99@...> wrote:
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at my wits end... now what do I feed her?
heather broughton
My mare is refusing her feed. It's the magnesium that started it all. I had it in some beet pulp. It didn't matter how much or how little BP we mixed it in, she refused. So I tried to add some alfalfa pellets (i know, I know, but I needed to try something) and she would eat half of it and refuse the rest. Now she's just refusing it all. She'll no longer take it out of my hands either. She's completely disinterested in it even if I take the magnesium out!! But she'll try her best to stick her nose in her buddy's bucket full of sweet feed... so I know she's feeling fine but is just disinterested in what I'm offering.
now what?! I feel like I'm out of options. I was told about a product called Remission by AniMed Horse Care. Linked here from ValleyVet - http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail.html?pgguid=d54319d4-0302-4385-932e-3ee2db9f7b2f#tabs Would this be safe to try? Although I'm still confused about what I'd use to carry it... Heather Ontario Oct 2009 |
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Re: Information for Dr. Kellon /Horse 'Freitag'/help please
kunigunde77
Hello Dr. Kellon-hope you could read this mail-cause of
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big communication problems the owner/Helga Wagemann has put all consultation details in 'Freitags'folder-you already confirmed the receipt-beginning of last week they have done their payment on yr paypal account and are still waiting for any sign from you-but nothing happened. Owner feel helpless and cannot understand all these problems.. Could you contact the owner, pls?they are waiting till 2 months now... Or could a moderator help in this situation,pls? Thankyou. Greetings/Katharina with Kuni(IR+PPID),Syke/Germany-member/2007
--- In EquineCushings@..., "helgawagemann" <helgawagemann@...> wrote:
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Re: Myristin® 20% Cetyl Myristoleate -Dr Kellon?-please reply?
deb_dus
Hello Dr Kellon,
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Please comment. The base for the cetyl is corn starch. Any proplem for Cushings/IR 26 yo? Mny thanks Deb
--- In EquineCushings@..., "debbie" <deb_dus@...> wrote:
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Re: low sugar hay.
Anita
HI All, I've not been on for a while and this may have already been covered. I'm out in California so I'm not sure if any of this would even apply.
I just started testing hay at our local feed supply shop. This last batch of grass from Lodi tested 9.1% in sugars. I would like to find some even lower. I realized the other day that soaking is a hastle but needs to be done if your horse is high risk. so my search for low sugar started. My horse is one of those "easy keepers" so low sugar is kind of a priority. Maybe I can post the analysis under files if there was any interest out here to find low sugar. Or you can e-mail me direct at jade1967@... Thanks Anita Sonora,CA |
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Re: Gastric Ulcers
jillray.cabarrus
My 30 yr old mare was diagnosed three years ago. It took about three months of Gastrogard to get her settled (longer than the recommended time) and at one point the vet suggested putting her down. Once I got her healed, I have kept her on a very small maintenance dose and she has thrived. Her diet is mostly grass and hay. Keeps her stomach settled.
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--- In EquineCushings@..., "Allnotwell" <okayfine87@...> wrote:
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Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in...
Cathy Huffman
An automatic waterer keeps water cooler. It holds less and when the horse drinks, the water is kept fresh and cool coming from pipes underground.
Cathy Huffman -- May you always be overwhelmed by the Grace of God rather than by the cares of life Operation Christmas Child (a ministry of Samaritan's Purse) Area Coordinator Upstate South Carolina National Collection Week is November 15-22, 2010 Community Bible Church Alms & Legs Ministry Team Member Easley, South Carolina ________________________________ From: Shannon <skgserenity@...> To: EquineCushings@... Sent: Sun, May 30, 2010 5:38:14 PM Subject: [EquineCushings] Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in... Hi Ronia and Mandy - thank y'all for responding with some good ideas. Lately I'm just beyond exhausted, and at the moment being hit hard by allergies (and benadryl). Hope I make sense here! Ronia - No, I haven't tried mushes. It is definitely something to consider for the hydration if it comes to that, but at the moment I'm really only able to get out there once a day, usually in the evenings. So I wouldn't be able to feed it 3x/day. Putting water on the hay is an old trick that I am kicking myself for not considering until now. I give him his supplements by syringe (salt added as of today), and I also clean his pen/stall, refill water, and go through his medical and treatment protocol. I believe thateven the folks who work at the barn will do that. I'm also going to look into the "soak, rinse, soak" beet pulp suggestion. Definitely going to be more sensitive to the water being as cool as I can make it. Rafiq lives in a 12'x 12' stall with an attached pen that is an additional 12' x 24'. There is very little relief from the sun in ths area where these walk-out pens are located. The water tank is at the far end of the pen to encourage him to move around a bit. With the direct sun most of the day, that thing heats up and it evaporates. Last night I added a hanging water bucket to his stall (since he apparently won't drink from the automatic waterer regardless of how often it is cleaned). This will allow him to get a drink without hitting the direct part of the heat. I have a couple of fans on him now, and another heavy duty one to hang from the upper corner of his stall when I find someone strong enough to even lift it that high. This is going to be a very hot summer. Mandy - I do not feel like a strong person. The heat/humidity plus allergies are kicking my butt! I'm too old for this! Table salt is easily given by syringe, so adding that is easy. The exercise is more complicated as his hoof is still in a transition phase. Taking him for a walk is okay, but with increased exercise there is more of a chance that he will wear down the already-weak feet. It may come down to putting him in a small one-horse turn out to increase his mobility (and digestion). Basically, I would rate Rafiq's weight at a 3 on the body score index. In returning home he definitley has gone down in the quality of hay he was eating and in the intervals of receiving it. I expect that he will need alfalfa or the Purina L/S to help with the weight. I am certainly not going to starve him. Thank you! Shannon, Rafiq and Majik June 2009 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in...
Gregory Sokoloski
Can you post pics of Rafiq since he has returned from his long stay? Could you also post some pics of his hooves since his return also?
Greg ________________________________ From: Shannon <skgserenity@...> To: EquineCushings@... Sent: Sun, May 30, 2010 4:38:14 PM Subject: [EquineCushings] Re: A Few Quandries concerning Rafiq as summer closes in... Hi Ronia and Mandy - thank y'all for responding with some good ideas. Lately I'm just beyond exhausted, and at the moment being hit hard by allergies (and benadryl). Hope I make sense here! Ronia - No, I haven't tried mushes. It is definitely something to consider for the hydration if it comes to that, but at the moment I'm really only able to get out there once a day, usually in the evenings. So I wouldn't be able to feed it 3x/day. Putting water on the hay is an old trick that I am kicking myself for not considering until now. I give him his supplements by syringe (salt added as of today), and I also clean his pen/stall, refill water, and go through his medical and treatment protocol. I believe thateven the folks who work at the barn will do that. I'm also going to look into the "soak, rinse, soak" beet pulp suggestion. Definitely going to be more sensitive to the water being as cool as I can make it. Rafiq lives in a 12'x 12' stall with an attached pen that is an additional 12' x 24'. There is very little relief from the sun in ths area where these walk-out pens are located. The water tank is at the far end of the pen to encourage him to move around a bit. With the direct sun most of the day, that thing heats up and it evaporates. Last night I added a hanging water bucket to his stall (since he apparently won't drink from the automatic waterer regardless of how often it is cleaned). This will allow him to get a drink without hitting the direct part of the heat. I have a couple of fans on him now, and another heavy duty one to hang from the upper corner of his stall when I find someone strong enough to even lift it that high. This is going to be a very hot summer. Mandy - I do not feel like a strong person. The heat/humidity plus allergies are kicking my butt! I'm too old for this! Table salt is easily given by syringe, so adding that is easy. The exercise is more complicated as his hoof is still in a transition phase. Taking him for a walk is okay, but with increased exercise there is more of a chance that he will wear down the already-weak feet. It may come down to putting him in a small one-horse turn out to increase his mobility (and digestion). Basically, I would rate Rafiq's weight at a 3 on the body score index. In returning home he definitley has gone down in the quality of hay he was eating and in the intervals of receiving it. I expect that he will need alfalfa or the Purina L/S to help with the weight. I am certainly not going to starve him. Thank you! Shannon, Rafiq and Majik June 2009 |
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Re: Testing Hay question
JMF <jane@...>
No, I was thinking minerals not vitamins. I am balancing the minerals.
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When I tested my hay, I did not rinse or soak it. Would the minerals reflect the hay + the dirt on the hay or do they clean it before they test it? I am thinking ahead for this year's purchase. Would it be beneficial to send two samples, one soaked and the other from the field? jane and Miss Kitty NE MS 10/09
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