Re: help haflinger owners!

kelly andersen

I think he's no fuzzier than mine. And cute. And he's sane on a
cold winter day with snow on the ground. And I love, love, love
that color.

I'd put him on the IR diet just to be safe, but I don't see any
cresty-ness to him.

I'm not in the market for another horse, I'm not in the market for
another horse.........

Kelly and Shorty in Iowa.

--- In EquineCushings@..., Abby Bloxsom <dearab@...>

kapleacres wrote:
Is this normal fuzz?

This is normal fuzz.

Buy the pony.


Abby Bloxsom

Re: Diet of new horse: was: Diet of wild horses ?

5 Pine Ranch

----- Original Message -----
From: bchorse1

Well, I've owned her for 2 mos, she's been slightly thin, possibly
leaky gut or just digestive issues, I'm not sure. Since she is thin,
I hadn't even considered IR, I joined the group more because of my
easy keeper pony. She is a 3yr old Holsteiner/TB cross.

==Ooffff - she is going to be a big girl and will still have growth needs given her breeding. Holsteiners can be late to mature, TB`s are notoriously not always easy to keep. I would not be suspicious of IR at this time given her age and your description. I would consider whether she has had enough nutritionally to support her growth and breeding....


but there does seem to be a
bit of a hindend weakness at times and she consistently rests her
left hind leg, no swelling or real lameness. She seems to be
reactive to the saddle and there were a few comments regarding that
from the trainer and previous owner. She also urinates frequently

==hmmm - can`t remember the full diet details you sent earlier and on the fly to go feed horses but in all honesty, since this is getting over my head diagnostically, have you considered a consult with Dr. Kellon or a nutritionist. Best hundred bucks I EVER spent :)


Yes, and I thought that fat calories were safe calories.

==Okay, not a fat fan here and fat doesn`t help growth. So, sometimes we sound like broken records here - when someone joins, we automatically go into the mode of careful because a horse might be IR. I highly doubt we need to be cautious with you with THIS horse although we are going very OT with this.

==If this mare is not keeping on weight with hay alone (good quality hay, good protein and fed free choice) then you need to look at what else to add to the diet. Nutritious alternatives, not empty calorie alternatives like fat. Fat has it`s place in the diet.....but in this case, I would be reaching for better feed, not more fat.


From a digestive point of view, it seems that grains aren't a good
choice for even healthy horses (maybe that is inaccurate. I did
think that oats were a fairly safe form of grain for extra calories)
I think that the trainer fed her (I didn't own her when she was at
the trainers) but maybe the diet/stress of training has upset her
digestive tract. I was just reading an article about the
relationship of Dysbiosis (Leaky Gut Syndrome) to Insulin Resistance
& Laminitis.

==You should consider treating her for ulcers or diagnosing or what have you given her time with the trainer. Grains are very good things for horses that are working, horses that need them - they aren`t bad at all. Some are better than others and it depends on your situation. Your mix of alfafa 1 lb and oats 2 lbs is minimal grain in my opinion.

==Please do consider a consult. Holsteiners are notorious for growth related issues and with the anatomy issues plus thin, a consult with Dr. Kellon would be awesome for you - and will benefit all your horses :))



Is there a seasonal rise seen in insulin results?

Sherrie Hilliard

My vet was out yesterday to draw a coggins and I asked her to draw an
insulin and glucose. She said to expect a rise in insulin due to the
winter season. I thought the seasonal rise is related to ACTH, not
insulin. Is there also a seasonal rise in insulin? I had her draw it
anyway figuring that even if it was not comparable to my fall insulin
draw, I'd at least have a winter baseline.

Blue's Mom

Re: help haflinger owners!

5 Pine Ranch

He looks like a cute little halfinger with a winter coat! Not even dry or brittle looking! But nothing rules out Cushings like actually testing for it!

Please Visit Our Site!

Re: cresty neck getting rock hard????? Help

5 Pine Ranch

While I`m not sure if the Yea-Sacc is responsible for the increase in crest, it is in my opinion, likely a waste of money.

Here`s a comment from Dr. Kellon on this subject...from Message 78811

Yea-Sacc has only been shown to be of benefit to horses that are on
high grain diets. Period. Anyone who claims otherwise is
misrepresenting the science, and this organism is the best studied
of all the probiotics (which, sadly, isn't saying much!)


What was the reason Yea-Sacc was added and what about a hay analysis.

Please Visit Our Site!

Re: cresty neck getting rock hard????? Help

Abby Nemec

Mandy Woods wrote:

I think I would review his diet and do some swapping ie: drop the BOSS and
Rice Bran and keep the Yea-Sacc or switch to Forco. Atleast you'd be
feeding gut bugs rather than feeding fat/inflammatories.
Is his hay tested? Soaked? Is the BP r/s/r? Mag/ox can be syringed in if
all else fails. Feed 1.5% to 2% his body weight in hay.
Mandy and Asher in VA

I agree with Mandy - and would add that if the hay isn't tested it should at least be soaked. 1 hour in cold water or 30 minutes in hot, drain the water where the horse can't reach it.


Abby Bloxsom

Re: help haflinger owners!

Abby Nemec

kapleacres wrote:
Ok, I promise this will be my last post for a while! I added a couple pic of me test driving a haffy for my 5 y.o. daughter. Is this normal fuzz? I put my offer in on him today.
This is normal fuzz.

Buy the pony.


Abby Bloxsom

Re: cresty neck getting rock hard????? Help

Mandy Woods

A hard crest is a not a good sign. There are two things that come to mind
after reading your post....
1. Someone gave him something that was higher in sugar/starch/fat.
2. Aging changes the sensitivity of IR.

I think I would review his diet and do some swapping ie: drop the BOSS and
Rice Bran and keep the Yea-Sacc or switch to Forco. Atleast you'd be
feeding gut bugs rather than feeding fat/inflammatories.

Is his hay tested? Soaked? Is the BP r/s/r? Mag/ox can be syringed in if
all else fails. Feed 1.5% to 2% his body weight in hay.
Mandy and Asher in VA

advie on chasteberry dosage?

staci.hummel <staci.hummel@...>

Hi y'all! So glad I found this group but sad to have to use it!
Hoping to get info from anyone using chasteberry/vitus agnes castus for
cushings treatment. Would love to talk also about results I've already
had with kicking glucosamine supplement and changing to low nsc feed.
Have a three year long story with photos of my 20 ear old walker/qtrX
gelding. Hope i may be of some help to someone else out there too.
Thanks, Staci

Flax Oil

Marie Milliman


I'll leave this alone , finally, when I have this last question
answered, OK? On Dr. Kellons advise I am going to give my colt 2 TBSPN
Flax oil in place of Flax seed. This is due to my concern with his
allergies and the flax making his stools loose, and gassy too.
While at Henry's last night, it reminded me of going to Michaels craft
store. OMG too much stuff I know nothing about.

1. There is unrefined, refined, and with or without Lignans. Which is
best suited for him with my allergy concerns in mind?

Thanks again,

Marie, Caillou and Player

cresty neck getting rock hard????? Help

stufflebeam61356 <stufflebeam61356@...>

My friend sent me this question a few minutes ago. Please help

Quick question...
Cowboy has always had a big crest, he is on MagOx and it has reduced
the size some...
I noticed tonight though, that it was rather hard--- stiff as a board
type thing.
Its usually not very floppy, but it seems extra hard... Good or bad

Nothings changed....
He gets minimal hay (maybe 3-4 flakes of hay a day), he gets BOSS,
Flax, a RB, and a maintenance level of MagOx, though I bumped him back
to the theraputic dose. And beet pulp (less then a cup dry) to help
encourage him to eat, as he HATES the MagOx.
oh wait... the only thing that has changed is I added Yea-Sacc to his
diet about three weeks ago.... would the Yea-Sacc cause this? shoud I

Re: Drummer Update/casts


Do they have to have shoes to have casts?

Re: Another question Please help with Pergolide

minesafety <MineSafety@...>

Thanks Sandy. The APF was almost $50, but I think I'll hold off on
using it (I did buy it). The only adjusting I had to do when I found
you guys and the emergency diet was to double-rinse his beet pulp. I
probably should have had the APF when this whole thing started (had I
only known then...). He can't eat hay -- he needs mush -- so he gets a
combination of Ontario Hay Cubes, beet pulp pellets soaked and double
rinsed,hay extender and 4.5 lbs/day of Lite Balance. His IR numbers
were just spectacular (went from 123 to 16) but his ACTH is still a
little high. On July 2: 50.7 -- Jan 10: 40. (added chasteberry in combo
with the pergolide). He is actually happy to be on the trail, walked
briskly, head and ears up and just seemed like good old Triton again.
I'm limiting him to the flat trails. It's just that he seems to stand
by himself a lot in the pasture, always near the gate and water trough
and not hanging with his old best friend as he used to before the
laminitis trauma / losing his hoof this last year. I would still wish
that his ACTH level was lower like it was 2 yrs. ago, but my vet said
to wait and retest in June.

Many thanks for your response.


Linda <lindarollins38@...>

Just needed to search for 21 minutes!

Cornell files

Linda <lindarollins38@...>

Where are they? I've been searching for 20 minutes...

Re: Drummer Update/casts

Claire C. Cox-Wilson <shotgun.ranch@...>

--- In EquineCushings@..., "Leslie Davis" <schedler@...>

Lorna, could you post photos of the casts?

Ditto! would love to see photos. I don't think we have any photos of
hoof casts or do we? At any rate, would love to see Drummer's casts!!!
Claire from AZ

Re: help haflinger owners!

kapleacres <kapleacres@...>

The album is Fuzzy Haflinger I think I titled the photo fuzzy pony. One
is just the pony and one is me bareback on this killer pony. Thanks for
the look.

Cushings and lymph system?

Vicki Kline <vlk@...>

I know I'm going to start out OT here, but bear with me. There's a
horse boarded here that has scar tissue in his sheath from an old
injury (mare stomped him while he was sleeping; broke 2 ribs, tore
his sheath). He always has some swelling there, but it's worse in
winter (lack of movement). After going through several suggestions
by veterinarians that did not seem to help (for swelling), we came
upon that idea that maybe it's not circulatory (blood), but his
lymphatic system that's blocked.

His owner (oddly enough) has lymphedema in both legs and sees a
massage therapist specializing in lymphedema, who (even more oddly)
agreed to come out and look at the horse. She massaged him "locally"
as well as in other areas that would help with the blockage. She
does believe it is lymphatic in origin.

One of the suggestions a vet had given us was to put him on low dose
doxy for it's anti-inflammatory properties. I asked the specialist
whether in her opinion we should keep using that since it was not
helping with the inflammation. Her answer was yes, because of the
antibiotic properties - keeping up the white blood cell count since
the lymphatic system isn't working properly. It's been her
experience, too, that people with lymph problems are more prone to

So - here's the Cushings part. If Cushings horses are more prone to
infections, might they benefit from low dose doxy too? And the ones
with IR from Lyme - might low dose doxy (after "normal" treatment)
help to keep that at bay? Anyone know of long term side effects that
would contraindicate such treatment?

Thanks for hearing me out!

Vicki Kline

Re: help haflinger owners!

Mandy Woods

Hey everyone,
If you want to see new pictures that have just been posted....instead of
running all over the photos section, click on PHOTOS in the blue box on the
left of your screen, then underneath Album it says "view: Thumbnails / list
/ on LIST and you'll get the latest photos entered in
order. That should save you lots of time.
Mandy and Asher in VA

Re: Drummer Update/casts

Abby Nemec

Joan and Dazzle wrote:
It's only been a product that's been discussed here for about the last 6 months. Abby was the wonderful person who tested them and introduced them to us. If you want to look in the archives, look up Equicast or check out their website.
Search the archives using "hoof cast" "casting" or "equicast" and you should get a good feel for what we have going on.

Casts are not a magic bullet (since we know there are none) but they are a very versatile hoof care product and I've got a pretty solid protocol going for chronic laminitis, among other things.

Good luck!


Abby Bloxsom

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