Date   

Re: Recent bloodwork concerns

Sherry Morse
 

Hi Jennifer,

You can titrate up by .5 so do 1.5 for 3 or 4 days (all in one dose) and then go to the 2mg in one dose.  If you think you're seeing signs of the veil you can slow the titration rate but going by halves is easiest.  As far as once a day vs. twice a day dosing, there's been some research into it that says it may be effective but from the experiences on the group here 1x is most effective and if people have gone to 2x a day dosing it's usually something like 2mg at one time and then another 1mg to keep the therapeutic level in the blood up.  As you noted, even the vet at BI said dividing the dose in 2 would be for horses with a good level of ACTH and that's not where Firestorm is now.

Hope that helps answer your questions.





Re: Boarding in San Diego area?

LJ Friedman
 

facebook “socal horse community “
you can post a “ looking for”
After you’ve selected a few, I can get the inside scoop from others in the area
--
LJ Friedman  Nov 2014 Vista,   Northern  San Diego, CA

Jesse( over the rainbow) and majestic ‘s Case History 
Jesse's Photos

 


Re: Boarding in San Diego area?

LJ Friedman
 

Can you be specific as to where you will be living. What area?
--
LJ Friedman  Nov 2014 Vista,   Northern  San Diego, CA

Jesse( over the rainbow) and majestic ‘s Case History 
Jesse's Photos

 


early ppid question

LJ Friedman
 

Is there amount of time,months, years etc. where in early PPID horse that only showed with a TRH stim test, can move over to ACTH with good confidence?  Majestic is doing quite well though I don’t test him perhaps as often as I should.
--
LJ Friedman  Nov 2014 Vista,   Northern  San Diego, CA

Jesse( over the rainbow) and majestic ‘s Case History 
Jesse's Photos

 


Re: Recent bloodwork concerns

jennigrossi.jg@...
 

Martha,

Thank you very much for your advice, but I need more help understanding. At one point, when I spoke to a Vet at BI, I was told that dividing your total daily dose in 2 and giving the Prascend 2x a day was preferable to 1x a day and that if a horse isn't having a good symptomatic response to Prascend, but acth in the bloodwork looks good, that dividing the dose and giving 2x a day can often lead to improvement. Is this incorrect? I would much prefer to give the Prascend once a day because it's such a pain, but I thought I was doing something good by doing it twice a day.

Also, my plan was to just increase to 1.5 mg, but I went with 2 mg because Sherry advised it because his numbers are so very high. I have APF on order. I hope it will get here this week. Should I just do 1.5 mg for a few days and then go to 2? I will also hopefully have some news from Cornell tomorrow about any likelihood of this being an error.
--
Jennifer Grossi
Charlevoix, Michigan
2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jennifer%20and%20Firestorm
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=262822


Re: Free feeding tested hay

Bobbie Day
 

Cass
i have a order in route from Adler, I’m pretty sure that at least three of our five are getting ulcers, our vets don’t scope here so I’m going to be proactive and start them all. We lost my husband’s mare two years ago from colic and now (hindsight) I’m pretty sure that was the beginning of her problems. I bought a couple tubes of ulcer meds from my vet just to see if it would help our other mare that is exhibiting symptoms now, At thirty five dollars a tube there is NO way I can afford to treat my horses so I’m anxious to try the pellets from Adler.
--
Bobbie and Desi
NRC Plus March 2020
Utah, Nov 2018

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Bobbie%20and%20Desi 

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=78821


Boarding in San Diego area?

coffincomplex@...
 

Hi everyone,

I will be moving to San Diego soon and I'm looking for good boarding options. I know there are a few board members in the area, so I wanted to post in case anyone had suggestions. I need a place that is workable for a PPID/IR horse: if they are in turnout there can't be grass, and the facility needs to be amenable to feeding my hay. I would prefer them (I have 2 horses total) to live in individual pens 48' x 48' or larger, or if in smaller pens, they'll need turnout for several hours a day. Good shelter/shade is a must.

I'll be working in La Jolla and would like to keep them less than a 45 minute drive away. I've found a few places further out (Lakeside, Escondido, Imperial Beach) that look to fit the bill but they're close to my max drive distance and so I'm still beating the bushes to see if there is anything closer in, like Poway or Olivenhain. I'd prefer a smaller facility (less than 50 horses), but beggars can't be choosers.

Thanks for any ideas!
--
Alanna
May 2018
Los Angeles, CA
Buster's case history: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Alanna%20and%20Buster  .


Re: WAS: Stabul 1 / NOW: Julanne and Oreo

Julanne Baker
 

Sherry, the lab reports I put in the photos section titled “Julanne and Oreo” are the only lab results I have from Cornell. Sorry.
Martha, thanks for that. From here on I will ask my vet not to do the TRH stim test, just the ACTH test.
Learning so much from all of you!


--
Julanne in Florida 2020
CaseHistory
Https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Julanne%20and%20Oreo
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=262881


Riosa and Invokana dose

hdavis
 

I am still awaiting my lab results for my glucose, insulin and triglycerides and Rio is doing well except for not being as forward and wanting to exercise as she once was. I don’t believe she is foot sore but maybe just less energetic.  Should I be perhaps cutting her Invokana dose as could the 300mg dose be part of this?  She is usually a very forward mare and lately she isn’t as enthusiastic to go for hikes or Into her lunge line work outs. She doesn’t appear to be foot sore but wondering if maybe it is the 300mg dose of Invokana?  Could she be needing less of it now that it now thst she is getting properly stored product than before. Or do we just stay on the original dose until we get blood work back?  Thanks in advance.
--
Heather Davis
August 5, 2017, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

Riosa 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Heather%20and%20Riosa

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=8819 


Storm

Case History


 




Re: Candy Elevated Triglycerides on Invokana

Shawn Gould
 

Patti,
You are welcome. It is so true, it’s hard to keep horses healthy now that they are living way beyond what use to be the typical life expectancy. And the village? Oh my yes,   with a team of experts at the ready. One thing I’ve learned is it’s helpful to have a variety of people who can help you. Sometimes what is suppose to work just doesn’t. You are not alone. And a lot of us have had to make a career out of advocating for our horses.
--
Shawn and Candy
Dec 2020, Santa Cruz, CA
Candy Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Shawn%20and%20Candy
Candy Photo Album:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=258140


Re: WAS: Stabul 1 / NOW: Julanne and Oreo

 

Hi Julanne,
Once your horse has been diagnosed with PPID, there is no reason to do the TRH stim test.  There are no reference values for ACTH after TRH stimulation once the horse is on pergolide.  When a horse is borderline PPID, it may not show an elevated ACTH with the endogenous test and the vet thus does a stim test to clarify the diagnosis.  If your vet insists upon doing the stim test, after the horses is on pergolide, it’s important to see the pre stimulation test result as it is the only one you can use to make a meaningful analysis.  
--
Martha in Vermont
ECIR Group Primary Response
July 2012 
 
Logo (dec. 7/20/19), Tobit(EC) and Pumpkin, Handy and Silver (EC/IR)

Martha and Logo


 
 


Re: WAS: Stabul 1 / NOW: Julanne and Oreo

Sherry Morse
 

Hi Julanne,

Do you have copies of the actual test results?  The whole idea of using TRH testing is to have pre and post numbers to look at and every test result I've seen from Cornell always has both numbers. Once you have a confirmed diagnosis of PPID using the TRH outside of the seasonal rise you only need to repeat basal ACTH (which is the equivalent of the pre-TRH number) to see if the current dose of Prascend is controlling the disease.




Re: Free feeding tested hay

 

Hi, Sara.
Yes, I used the Abler product, AbPrazole granules. I believe you were part of the EC Horsekeeping discussion:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/Horsekeeping/topic/71803024#29172 I'd be happy to answer any questions on that forum.
--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos


Request for follow up from Lavinia

riggslippert@...
 

Hi Lavinia,

Thank you in advance for taking the time to look at these photos.  You did markups on Cadet in November which my farrier used for his next trim--see message https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/topic/78267663#257887.  He has been in Clouds with the standard pad on all four feet since then.  My farrier thinks his heels look better and he has been sound since early December (I check him on arena footing or grass without boots).  I was hoping to be able to leave the boots off now that the weather is warmer.  I was also hoping to start riding him again.

Can the new hoof pictures (taken 13 days after his most recent trim) give you some idea if the broken back HPAs in his hind feet are improved, or do I need to have more radiographs taken to assess this?

Thank you again.
--
Aunna
October 2018
Oakland County, Michigan, USA
Cadet Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Aunna%20and%20Cadet
Ruger Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Aunna%20and%20Ruger

Cadet Photo Album:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=84102




Re: WAS: Stabul 1 / NOW: Julanne and Oreo

Julanne Baker
 

That last comment was for Lavinia. She had suggested the vet did not send in the pre TRH stim draw. 
--
Julanne in Florida 2020
CaseHistory
Https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Julanne%20and%20Oreo


Re: WAS: Stabul 1 / NOW: Julanne and Oreo

Julanne Baker
 

I’m thinking that may be the case here. When I have labs drawn later this month should I request that she send the pre stim draw as well? So much to learn!
--
Julanne in Florida 2020
CaseHistory
Https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Julanne%20and%20Oreo


Re: WAS: Stabul 1 / NOW: Julanne and Oreo

Julanne Baker
 

Kirsten, I made a photo album of the lab reports you wanted to see entitled “Julanne and Oreo” and added it to my case history. Hope that is helpful. I am struggling to maneuver through the case history downloads on my ipad. Hope it came through for you.
--
Julanne in Florida 2020
CaseHistory
Https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Julanne%20and%20Oreo


Re: Candy Elevated Triglycerides on Invokana

Patti SoCal 2020
 

Hi Shawn,

Thank you so much for sharing this information. Your experience along with that of Nancy's is helping me to determine what dosage to put Sunny on once we determine that his triglyceride and liver levels have decreased.

I'm so grateful for all on this group sharing the ups and downs. It makes me realize I'm not alone in this. Apparently,  it takes a big village 😄. I have a friend who jokes that anyone who says "healthy as a horse" has never had a horse!  Helps me not to take anything for granted.

--
Patti
SoCal 2020                                                 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Patti%20and%20Sunny


Re: Recent bloodwork concerns

 

Hi Jennifer,
I wanted to point out that giving Prascend at 1 mg twice daily really isn’t an increase in dose over 1 mg once daily.  The 2 mg needs to be given all at once to be an effective 2 mg dose.  If you’re increasing from 1 mg to 2 mg, I would suggest a gradual increase.
--
Martha in Vermont
ECIR Group Primary Response
July 2012 
 
Logo (dec. 7/20/19), Tobit(EC) and Pumpkin, Handy and Silver (EC/IR)

Martha and Logo


 
 


Re: Hay Analysis & custom mineral/vitamin blend help

Kirsten Rasmussen
 

If you go with Uckele, Dr Kellon will balance your minerals to your hay analysis.  I would not trust anyone else, especially someone employed by a feed company, to balance my minerals unless they also follow the protocol in the NRC+ course.  We do have a list of people (  https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/6%20Diet%20Balancing/HAY%20BALANCING-1.pdf) that follow these protocols and will look at your hay analysis and determine what you need to custom balance the hay, which you can then send to a supplier and get a custom mix, or buy the individual ingredients and mix yourself.  Or, they might be able to tell you which commercial products, and how much of it, will do a reasonably good job of balancing your specific hay.  I've done both and found ordering a custom mix to be much cheaper than buying a commercial product that balances my hay.  Our approved balancers also know which feeds are safe to recommend for horses with EMS.

It sounds like you are following the general protocol for EMS horses already, but as said more times than I can count on this forum, insulin results that are within lab normals and lab reference ranges do not mean your horse is not IR.  What they have eaten and when they have eaten before testing insulin and glucose does have an effect on the results, but we need more info to know if this was a factor for you or not.  If you didn't feed grain and if their blood was pulled at least 4 hrs after theIR first meal of the day, and the ECIR calculator is telling you they are IR at high risk of laminitis, then the diet needs to be tightened up to reduce sugar/starch and exercise needs to be increased if they are sound.  Balancing minerals is very important for EMS horses, but that is not the reason your metabolic horses are at high risk of laminitis.

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History
Shaku's Photo Album

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