Date   

Is Stevia safe for IRs? Specifically...

Kerry Isherwood
 

Are the Uckele "Equi Sweet" food enhancers/enticers safe for IR horses?   

Thanks,
Kerry in NY
Pinky Sept 2014
Tofurky Nov 2014


Re: grain question

fionn@...
 

Believe it or not, I live in Kentucky, the so-called “Horse Capital of the World” and it was a NIGHTMARE to find feed, supplements, the right hay and a vet that didn’t think “keep him in and give him a flake in the morning and a flake at night” was the right thing to do and a farm that would let him have a dry lot and slow feeder.  In fact, we had to move from our last farm because they decided that winter grass would be “fine” and I should just throw him out there in a muzzle 7 hours a day (you’d have to staple it to his head to keep it on more than 5 minutes).  I’m currently buying Stabul 1 from a HARDWARE store 20 miles away and ordering everything else online.  We have two of the leading vet clinics in America (allegedly) and it took two years to find an independent vet who would let us get compounded pergolide.  If you struggle here, you struggle anywhere (opposite of NY, NY I guess)—it’s just that hard for all of us.

Should have known, any state whose nickname is the Blue GRASS State has to be bad for a Cushing’s horse.

Michelle Peck Williams & Fionn
Lexington, Kentucky USA
Joined June 2012
fionn@...

Case history:  https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ECHistory5/files/Michelle%20Peck%20Williams/

Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory5/photos/album/867903845/pic/list

Foot Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHoof/photos/album/1767999070/pic/list

On Feb 22, 2015, at 4:54 PM, Darlene Peterson mywisky@... [EquineCushings] <EquineCushings@...> wrote:


Wisky can't have the one with alfalfa think I saw one with that in it.  will check the others out
 
question: how can senior feeds have so much beet pulp in them along with the molasses & it can be fed straight out of the bag, pulp on the other hand has to be soaked which mine flatly refuses to eat (and I board so that is kinda a problem in itself), then you have the speed beet treats which don't have to be soaked. Wisk needs weight badly, cushings (yep on Prascend) & kidney so he can't have alfalfa. I just can't wrap my head around the whole concept of the beet thing. You folks over there seem to have great products to choose from & your horse eat soaked beet.
 
Darlene/Pa.
2/2015
 


Re: grain question

Darlene Peterson <mywisky@...>
 

Wisky can't have the one with alfalfa think I saw one with that in it.  will check the others out
 
question: how can senior feeds have so much beet pulp in them along with the molasses & it can be fed straight out of the bag, pulp on the other hand has to be soaked which mine flatly refuses to eat (and I board so that is kinda a problem in itself), then you have the speed beet treats which don't have to be soaked. Wisk needs weight badly, cushings (yep on Prascend) & kidney so he can't have alfalfa. I just can't wrap my head around the whole concept of the beet thing. You folks over there seem to have great products to choose from & your horse eat soaked beet.
 
Darlene/Pa.
2/2015
 
Sun Feb 22, 2015 8:34 am (PST) . Posted by:

"Michelle Peck Williams" mpw709

I can’t ever remember which name is which but the one I use is the more expensive one, because it has some stuff to help their stomach too.

Michelle Peck Williams & Fionn
Lexington, Kentucky USA
Joined June 2012
fionn@...

Case history: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ECHistory5/files/Michelle%20Peck%20Williams/

Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory5/photos/album/867903845/pic/list

Foot Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHoof/photos/album/1767999070/pic/list

> On Feb 22, 2015, at 10:38 AM, Darlene Peterson mywisky@... [EquineCushings] wrote:
>
>
> Hello Michelle,
> ahh which APF are you talking about there seem to be several


Re: Jack has crossed Rainbow Bridge/Thank you

takarri@...
 



I would like to thank everyone for their kind words,emails and thoughts. It means a lot and certainly helps with the healing process. Spur is coping remarkably well at the moment & I'm sure it helped him to be there with Jack until the very end.
It was mentioned  either on this site or Horsekeeping awhile ago, to take the opportunity to gather some mane or tail hair when all is well as you may not get the opportunity to do so at the end. Thankfully I took that advice on board at the time and are so glad I did. I will be getting a lovely bracelet made from Jacks' hair as a treasured memento.

Pauline & Spur

 

Angel Jack & Harry

Sth West Vic/Australia

Aug 07

http://tinyurl.com/7qbdyas




Re: New Group Member - Need Assistance with my IR Cushings & PAINFUL Mare

Maggie
 

Hi Pam,

You are quite welcome!  Yes, for sure the information can be a bit overwhelming at first.  Rest assured, it does get easier.  

Ok, I am going to steal Mandy's advice on the emergency diet ingredients--you can get everything you need at Walmart--except for your carrier.  The Magnesium tablets and Vitamin E capsules in the vitamin isle, the ground flax seed and iodized salt in the baking isle.  And in the sports department you can get a fish scale for weighing your hay.  How much does Bailey weigh?  That will determine the amounts of the ingredients you use.  For an average 1000 lb horse, you would use 3 grams of Magnesium, and 2000 IU's of Vit E (that's 5 of the 400 IU capsules), a couple of heaping Tablespoons of iodized salt and 2-4 oz of ground flax seed.  I would start with a teaspoon of salt twice/day and gradually increase the amount until you get to 2 heaping Tbls/day.  This will tide you over until you get hay test results back, but you are always going to add the Vitamin E, flax and salt, so you will eventually want to find a more economical way to provide these ingredients.  We will help you with that as we go along.

Did you have a plan as to what you want to use as a carrier for the emergency diet ingredients?  Do you have non-molasses beet pulp?  If you use beet pulp you need to rinse it well, then soak it and then rinse it again till clear.  If you have never fed beet pulp, it's a different "mouth feel" that some horses have trouble getting used to, but if they will eat it, it's a great low glycemic food. Other options as a carrier are a handful of Triple Crown Lite, Nuzu Stabul 1, or Ontario Dehy Timothy Balance cubes (ODTB's).  Any feed store that carries Triple Crown products can order the ODTBs.  They are Timothy hay cubes guaranteed to be under 10% sugar+starch and the minerals are balanced to Dr. Kellon's specifications.

Ok, that should help you to get his diet squared away.  One thing we ask is that when you post a message, you delete all or most of the message that you are responding to.  It really helps to keep the reams of old messages from piling up!  Thanks!  And don't forget to sign your posts with your name, date of joining and general location.  Once you get your CH done, you will want to include a link to it in you signature as well.  It helsp the volunteers to find it faster and answer your questions faster.  Hang in there!! 

Maggie, Chancey and Spiral in VA
March 2011
EC Primary Response
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory4/files/maggie%20in%20virginia/



Re: New Group Member - Need Assistance with my IR Cushings & PAINFUL Mare

Lorna Cane
 

Hi,

It's Pam, I think?

>I guess that the only thing that I am unsure about is the diet.  I have read the emergency diet info.  I am a bit confused as to where to locate some of the items on the list and the amounts.

We need you to sign your posts, name, location, date of joining-and the link to your case history,after you've had time to do it.

Location would really help in a situation like this,as there may be group members close by,who have sourced what you need.
I get flax seed from my feed store,iodized salt from Costco,vitamin E from Costco.

Take a second before hitting Send,and delete the old messages,or most of old message.
This is immensely helpful  for people reading Digest, and when doing archive searches.

Lots to go over.Don't try to do it all in one day.

Just keep reading and things will begin to all into place.Promise.


Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002


*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf


https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup





Re: New Group Member - Need Assistance with my IR Cushings & PAINFUL Mare

bark@vamddog.com <bark@...>
 

Hi Maggie:

Thank you very much for your email.  I truly a appreciate it. 

I will be getting into the forms today in order to get them filled out, scanned and placed on the site.  I will also place all of Bailey's x-rays, blood work and such within the history portion of the site. 

I guess that the only thing that I am unsure about is the diet.  I have read the emergency diet info.  I am a bit confused as to where to locate some of the items on the list and the amounts.  For instance if I could just obtain a list that provided me the item, an idea as to where to purchase it and the dosage that would be great.  But, I find it to be a little confusing.  But, they is most likely because I have been bombarded with a ton of info and my heading is currently spinning. 

My new Farrier came out on Friday and was able to get some trimming done, but not as much as she was hoping to.  Due to Bailey's pain she did not want to force her to stand on three legs for long periods of time. 

Bailey is currently on Bute until which time my new vet arrives this week to assess her.  She is completely off of the Previcox, Gabapentin and Herio that she was on. 

Bailey is upright most of the time, but is in a good amount of pain even with the Bute (1 gm twice per day).  I was thinking of adding the Gabapentin back in, but am not sure since it did not seem to make much of a difference when combined with the Previcox.   Bailey's dosage of Prescend is remaining at 1 Tablet twice per day until which time I receive the blood work results of which should be in tomorrow or the next day. 

Again, if I could get the diet squared away I would be feel a lot better.  My hay is currently being tested.  I should receive the results sometime this week.  The previous lot was tested to contain little to no starches/sugars.  My Vet did not recommend soaking at that time.

Again, many thanks for your assistance.

Sincerely,


On Sat, Feb 21, 2015 at 10:08 PM, spiral1957@... [EquineCushings] <EquineCushings@...> wrote:
 

Hi Pam in MD!

Welcome to the group!  We are practically neighbors, as I live in VA--not too far down the road from Frederick, MD  I see that Lorna has already sent you an invitation to join ECH8, one of our sister groups where we store case histories (CH's).  We really need you to go and join that site and then put all this information about your mare into the CH form.  With over 12,000 members, it's the only way we can keep track of everyone's story.  Plus the CH form will prompt you to provide us with specific information that will help us to help you better.  Try not to feel overwhelmed--it may take you a little time to fill out, but it's all important information for us to help evaluate your situation.

In the meantime, I will tell you about the group's philosophy, called DDT/E, which stands for Diagnosis, Diet, Trim and Exercise.  Let me break it down and give you some details and why each step is so important.  When all four aspects are in place, you will see results, but it obviously cannot all be done overnight!  

OK, Diagnosis:  A very important first step!  You say that your mare was diagnosed with Cushing's (PPID) about a year and a half ago and started on Prascend.  And then in the fall that her levels were "off the charts".  It would be great if you could give us the exact numbers, or if you have a hard copy of the lab work, you can put it in you CH folder.  Additionally, there is a spot on the CH form where you fill in that information.  Not just the lab results are important, but the dates of the labwork are very important too.  All horses experience a seasonal rise in their ACTH in the fall, but PPID horses often experience an exaggerated and prolonged rise in their ACTH during the seasonal rise, which puts them at risk for fall laminitis.  In fact, fall laminitis is often the first sign of PPID.  Because PPID horses have this exaggerated rise in their ACTH during the fall, they require close monitoring of symptoms and ACTH levels to make sure that the dose of Prascend (pergolide) is keeping their ACTH under control.  You can read more about the seasonal rise on our website here:  http://ecirhorse.org/index.php/cushing-s-disease/seasonal-rise Once we have more information about the labs you have, we can help you better.

Additionally, many PPID horses are also IR (insulin resistant).  IR is not a disease, but a metabolic body type that are usually described as "easy keepers."  You mare's breed is one that is prone to be IR.  SO--you have a double whammy--already a diagnosis of PPID and most likely a diagnosis of IR as well.  To know for sure we recommend these four tests from a single blood draw:  ACTH, insulin, glucose and leptin levels on a NON-fasting horse, preferably sent to Cornell.  They are the only lab in the US that does leptin levels.  The leptin helps to differentiate, when the insulin is elevated, if the horse is IR at baseline, or if the ACTH is "driving" the insulin up.  The blood requires very specific handling as the ACTH degrades very quickly.  The details about how the blood should be drawn and handled can be found on our website here:  http://ecirhorse.org/index.php/ddt-overview/ddt-diagnosis 

So, a horse can have just PPID, just IR or both.  The reason we need to find out is that PPID is treated with medicine, pergolide, which you are already doing with the Prascend, and IR is treated with diet.  A horse that has both PPID and IR would need both pergolide and a carefully controlled diet for the rest of it's life.  Because an elevated ACTH can make the insulin high all PPID horses should be treated as though they are IR until proven (through labwork) otherwise.  So that brings me to the Diet part of our philosophy. Before I go into the details of the Diet, let me just say that while this is the diet that we recommend for an IR horse, it is actually the best way to feed any horse, and is particularly important for PPID horses as it  supports their "challenged" immune systems.  Ok, on to the details of the Diet!

The Diet that we recommend is a forage based low sugar/starch (under 10% sugar + starch), low fat (under 4%) mineral balanced diet.  So we use tested low sugar starch (under 10% sugar+starch) grass hay and then we add minerals to balance the hay to the analysis and to replace what is lost during the hay curing process we add Vitamin E and ground flax seed.  You want to feed 1.5-2% of you mare's BW in low sugar starch hay divided up into several small feedings/day.  We love the small mesh hay nets to slow down the sometimes voracious appetite that many IR horses have.  Here's the lab that we recommend for hay testing:  http://equi-analytical.com/  You want the #603, trainer's package for $54.  Once you get your hay tested one of our balancing folk can help you with balancing the minerals.  In the meantime, until you can get your hay tested we recommend that you start the emergency diet.  Details can be found on our website here:  http://ecirhorse.org/index.php/ddt-overview/ddt-diet  It does involve soaking your untested hay for an hour in cold water or 30 minutes in hot water to remove up to about 30% of the sugar content.  Make sure you dump the sugary water where the horse(s) cannot get to it!  I know it's snowing up there right now and COLD, because it is here too.  And believe me the thought of having to soak hay is not an appealing one to me or anyone else on this list who has had to do so in the middle of winter!  Been there, and done it!  But it's extremely important to get her on a low sugar starch diet right now.  She needs to be in "intensive care" for now.  And getting her ACTH under control, her Diet right, and her TRIM right are the 3 essential elements of getting her better!  So that brings us to the Trim part of our philosophy.

Trim:  A proper trim is toes backed and heels lowered so that the hoof capsule closely hugs and supports the internal structures of the foot.  You said that you have a new farrier who follows Dr Kellon's protocols.  That's great!  One thing you do need to know is that a "rehab" trim is not going to look normal for quite some time.  And a new happy hoof does not happen overnight.  It may take a year or more for the foot to grow out and be normal again--longer even sometimes when there is sinking involved.  It's a commitment that you certainly sound willing to make!  I would strongly urge you to post pictures and any xrays that you have for one of our hoof gurus to evaluate your mare's trim.  Please follow the guidelines on this site below that explains how to take good hoof photos.


And then post the pictures and xrays to the PHOTOS section of ECH8, the group where you fill out your CH.

OK, on to Exercise--the best IR buster there is!  BUT!  A laminitic horse should never be forced to move!!!  Since your mare is foot sore, she needs to be in boots and pads to try and get her more comfortable.  Have you got boots and pads yet?  We can make some recommendations in that area.  Just let us know.

Now, a few more things I want to address.  I have personal experience with Dr Reilly and his HEIRO and other recommendations.  Without going into the grim details, let me just say this.  The HEIRO does nothing, and the recommendation to put your horse on both previcox and bute at the same time is a dangerous combination that can certainly set her up for ulcers.  In fact, we don't recommend bute after the first few days of laminitis because it interferes with the healing process.  But the bute needs to be weaned off not stopped cold turkey.  Read this post by Nancy for more information and please follow the links in the post for more information on how to wean the bute to avoid a NSAID "rebound" effect.


Please stop the ADM Growstrong as well.  There are very few "bagged" feeds that are safe for your horse.  At this point, the emergency diet is your best option.  Once you get your hay tested, we will help you to get your diet balanced.  We know this all sounds like a paradigm shift in horse keeping practices that most people are used to. It does all become second nature and then you will not remember life before ECIR.  

I forgot to mention when I was talking about the diet that as import as what you do feed is what you DON'T feed!  NO pasture, even dead looking winter grass.  NO sugary treats, including apples and carrots.  No molasses or molasses containing foods or supplements.  No grain.  No brown/red salt blocks.  They contain minerals that will interfere with balancing and also iron which we don't want.  Most IR horse are iron overloaded, but we won't go into the details of that right now.  Let's just get your mare some immediate help and we will explore all of they why's of everything as we go along.  Meanwhile, I would strongly encourage you to study all the parts of our website.  Also, there is a TON of information in our files and also in the archived messages.  I dare say, any question you could think to ask has been answered at some point in time and a "search" of the conversations will get you many results.  Don't let that stop you from asking questions though!!

One more thing and I will close this book for the night.  Coming to this group for help with a PPID/IR horse is like bringing your horse to a specialist.  Though they may be well rounded, lots of vets are not up to speed on the latest information about PPID and IR.  Dr. Kellon is the expert in this field and this group provides the largest field trial of horses with these conditions.  We have a lot more information to offer you about how to help your horse.  We are just a click away!  Hang in there, Pam!  And please do take the time to read the website, the files and messages.  There is a wealth of knowledge to be gained there and knowledge is empowerment!

Maggie, Chancey and Spiral in VA





--
Pam Wahl
The Virginia-Maryland Dog
1 College Avenue
Frederick, MD  21701
Tel:  (301) 514-2804
Fax: (301) 694-9799


Re: grain question--now APF

fionn@...
 

With Fionn I kinda play it by ear.  I started him on 6, then tried using it sporadically, then trying to save money went to 5.  That didn’t work.  So now we are at 7, and if something weird happens I bump it up for a couple days, like if he accidentally gets grass or has stress (moving, shows, etc) or if he is working harder than normal, like when it is really hot.  He hates hot.  Or if he has a cold or just doesn’t seem right.  Keep in mind he is 18 and doing hard dressage stuff (well, when its not a frozen Arctic tundra here).  Just experiment.  It’s expensive but I have found with him it is worth it.

Michelle Peck Williams & Fionn
Lexington, Kentucky USA
Joined June 2012
fionn@...

Case history:  https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ECHistory5/files/Michelle%20Peck%20Williams/

Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory5/photos/album/867903845/pic/list

Foot Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHoof/photos/album/1767999070/pic/list


On Feb 22, 2015, at 10:46 AM, Cynthia Brisk in cboriskin@... [EquineCushings] <EquineCushings@...> wrote:


Would you use APF daily or when needed? The directions on the bottle was not clear for performance horses. 

Cynthia from CA
Tucker 10/10

Sent from my iPad



Re: grain question

fionn@...
 

I can’t ever remember which name is which but the one I use is the more expensive one, because it has some stuff to help their stomach too.

Michelle Peck Williams & Fionn
Lexington, Kentucky USA
Joined June 2012
fionn@...

Case history:  https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ECHistory5/files/Michelle%20Peck%20Williams/

Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory5/photos/album/867903845/pic/list

Foot Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHoof/photos/album/1767999070/pic/list


On Feb 22, 2015, at 10:38 AM, Darlene Peterson mywisky@... [EquineCushings] <EquineCushings@...> wrote:


Hello Michelle,
ahh which APF are you talking about there seem to be several


Re: grain question

Nancy C
 

Hi Leigh

I am going to send you a copy of the CH Form in word and .pdf to the equinesrfun yahoo email.  If you fill them out please, and send back to me I will upload in  a fold for you.

Having Case Histories is not only helpful for you going forward but significantly helps the ECIR Group.

I will send them to your yahoo email address. You can send them back to me at threecatfarm "at"cyberpine "dot" net.

Many, many thanks in advance.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
FACT: To diagnose IR, the ECIR Group recommends a non-fasted, simple blood draw for serum insulin, glucose and leptin and the use of VA Polytechnic Proxies. See E. M. Kellon, VMD, Diagnosis of Insulin Resistance and PPID, 2013 NO Laminitis! Proceedings, www.ecirhorse.org
IR Calculator

 




---In EquineCushings@..., <equinesrfun@...> wrote :

Hi Lorna,
I have never been successful in being able to add Ace's or Shadow's case histories to this group.








Re: grain question

 

Would you use APF daily or when needed? The directions on the bottle was not clear for performance horses. 

Cynthia from CA
Tucker 10/10

Sent from my iPad


Re: grain question

Darlene Peterson <mywisky@...>
 

Hello Michelle,
ahh which APF are you talking about there seem to be several
 
Darlene in Pa
2/2015

Re: grain question

Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:42 am (PST) . Posted by:

"Michelle Peck Williams" mpw709

Have you tried APF? It is amazing! It helps with the muscle wasting and lethargy. My horse does WAY better on it.

Additionally, I spent years researching feed and finally found Stabul 1 from NuZu. My horse has done great on this feed and I would highly recommend it! Some of the other ones say they are low starch but aren’t low enough—at least they weren’t for us.

Michelle Peck Williams & Fionn
Lexington, Kentucky USA
Joined June 2012
fionn@...


Re: hay testing

Darlene Peterson <mywisky@...>
 

Thanks, Pam in VA
not only is he cushings he has bad kidneys
 
Darlene/Pa
2/2015
 

Darlene,

Welcome to the list! The moderators can help you and your horse. They have helped me immensely. I have 2 insulin resistant, one prone to insulin resistance and a blind cushings guy who are all doing well with the protocol from this group.

I lived in Warren for several years, so understand the "backwoods&quo t; area well. I adopted one of my IR horses from Julia that lives about an hour from you. She was on this list a few years ago. I have contacted Julia to see if she could perhaps help you source some things (hay, hay probe, feed, etc). Will post on here when I hear back from her.


Hang in okay? I still have relatives in Warren, small world isn't it?


Pam in Va
Story/Frosty/ Butters/Shaqiraj
12/10


Re: Correction/ grain question

Lorna Cane
 



Oh MY GOODNESS, Leigh. Mea culpa.

I read your sentence as free access to grass...........as opposed to free access to grass hay !
Sorry. I must be going blind. Or stupid.


>Sorry! Can't seem to delete anything when using my phone!

See this message for how to solve this:



Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002


*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf


https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup



 







Re: grain question

Leigh Jacobs
 

Hi Lorna,
I have never been successful in being able to add Ace's or Shadow's case histories to this group. As for the grass, that was my mistake. He has access to Bermuda grass hay. That diet was pretty much designed by one of the nutritionists in this group. The only reason I use Triple Crown light is to get all of the herbs, sups and medications into Ace. What about this diet would you not use to give to an IR horse?
Thank you,
Leigh. Ace, & Shadow
Az 2011
Sorry! Can't seem to delete anything when using my phone!
Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 22, 2015, at 4:27 AM, windybriars@... [EquineCushings] <EquineCushings@...> wrote:

 

Hi Leigh,



>My old guy gets 1 lb Triple Crown Lite or Low Starch along with Mountain Sunrise Timothy pellets and beet pulp, Kirkland Mediterranean Blend oil (6-8 oz) and 1 scoop(25-30gm) of whey protein for muscle. Including free access to grass hay, everything other than the protein is to keep weight on Ace. 

Can you please add your case history to your signature when you post.

The above diet should not be recommended for an IR horse.I'm confused,especially by the addition of 'free access to grass'. Please clarify, especially for new members reading the messages.

Delete the old messages from your own message.



Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002


*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf


https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup








Re: grain question

fionn@...
 

http://www.thrivingpets.com/index.php/apf-advanced-protection-formula.html

I can’t explain the science for why it works (there are many on here who can), but I can attest to it working for my horse.  It helps with the muscle wasting and lethargy.

Michelle Peck Williams & Fionn
Lexington, Kentucky USA
Joined June 2012
fionn@...

Case history:  https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ECHistory5/files/Michelle%20Peck%20Williams/

Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHistory5/photos/album/867903845/pic/list

Foot Photo album: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ECHoof/photos/album/1767999070/pic/list


On Feb 22, 2015, at 1:37 AM, cynthia boriskin cboriskin@... [EquineCushings] <EquineCushings@...> wrote:


>> Have you tried APF? It is amazing!<<

What is APF?

Cynthia Boriskin from CA
Tucker 10/10



On Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:42 AM, "Michelle Peck Williams fionn@... [EquineCushings]" <EquineCushings@...> wrote:
 



Re: New test results on IR, PPID 11 year old gelding

Sharon Manning
 

"you know anyone who is diabetic, see if you can retest him using their glucose meter."
How does one go about doing this? I would like to give it a go.
Sharon

Sent from my iPhone
Please forgive any errors


Re: A list for vets that will rx compounded pergolide

ThePitchforkPrincess@...
 

HI Lj,
No need to start a file - this has been covered already ;-)

In our links section there is a link to that information:

I want to take this chance to remind members (especially the newer ones) that if you aren't using the ECIR Files Table of Contents (TOC) to search for information you should try it.  Even if the files are searchable now, the TOC has a few pluses the files search can't give.  In many places there are "also see" sections that link to all sorts of information that isn't in the files like the link above.  A simple TOC search for "prescription"  gave that and other results.  There is a document about rights to prescriptions especially for Canadians.  

 

LeeAnne, Newmarket, Ontario

ECIR Archivist 03/2004

ECIR Files Table of Contents


Taken For Granite Art - Lightweight Cement Sculpture and Memorials



Re: grain question

Lorna Cane
 

Hi Leigh,


>My old guy gets 1 lb Triple Crown Lite or Low Starch along with Mountain Sunrise Timothy pellets and beet pulp, Kirkland Mediterranean Blend oil (6-8 oz) and 1 scoop(25-30gm) of whey protein for muscle. Including free access to grass hay, everything other than the protein is to keep weight on Ace. 

Can you please add your case history to your signature when you post.

The above diet should not be recommended for an IR horse.I'm confused,especially by the addition of 'free access to grass'. Please clarify, especially for new members reading the messages.

Delete the old messages from your own message.



Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002


*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf


https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup








Re: grain question

Lorna Cane
 

Hi Cynthia,
>What is APF?

Go here in our Files:


Scroll down to APF.

Help yourself to all the other information-packed items in our Files section.


  Lorna in Ontario,Canada

ECIR Moderator 2002


*See What Works in Equine Nutrition*
http://www.ecirhorse.com/images/stories/Success_Story_3_-Ollies_Story__updated.pdf


https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup






75161 - 75180 of 263639