Test Results for Foxy


Barbara <b.dayton@...>
 

I finally recieved a copy of Foxys test results. I am confused about
the results. I tried comparing the results to others posted but her
numbers are so much different. Could someone please tell me what they
mean?

Lab Used: IDEXX Laboratories

Pre Dexamethasone Result 3.0 Reference Range 1-3 ug/dL Flag (blank)
Post Dexamethasone Result 1.7 Reference Range 1-3 ug/dL Flag H

Insulin Result 15 Ref Range 29-179 pmol/L Flag L
Glucose Result 4.3 Ref Range 4.2-6.4 mmol/L Flag (blank)
Insulin:Glucose Ratio Result 3
T4 Result 1.4 Ref Range 0.9-2.8 ug/dL Flag (blank)

THANKS!
Barbara


Barbara <b.dayton@...>
 

Correction on reference range for

Post Dexamethasone Result 1.7 Reference Range <1 ug/dL Flag H



--- In EquineCushings@..., "Barbara" <b.dayton@...>
wrote:

I finally recieved a copy of Foxys test results. I am confused
about
the results. I tried comparing the results to others posted but
her
numbers are so much different. Could someone please tell me what
they
mean?

Lab Used: IDEXX Laboratories

Pre Dexamethasone Result 3.0 Reference Range 1-3 ug/dL Flag (blank)
Post Dexamethasone Result 1.7 Reference Range 1-3 ug/dL Flag H

Insulin Result 15 Ref Range 29-179 pmol/L Flag L
Glucose Result 4.3 Ref Range 4.2-6.4 mmol/L Flag (blank)
Insulin:Glucose Ratio Result 3
T4 Result 1.4 Ref Range 0.9-2.8 ug/dL Flag (blank)

THANKS!
Barbara


Sandra Su
 

Posted by: "Barbara" <mailto:b.dayton@...?Subject=
Re%3ATest%20Results%20for%20Foxy> b.dayton@...
<http://profiles.yahoo.com/almstthr> almstthr

Fri Nov 2, 2007 7:21 am (PST)

I finally recieved a copy of Foxys test results. I am confused about
the results. I tried comparing the results to others posted but her
numbers are so much different. Could someone please tell me what
they mean?

Lab Used: IDEXX Laboratories

Pre Dexamethasone Result 3.0 Reference Range 1-3 ug/dL Flag (blank)
Post Dexamethasone Result 1.7 Reference Range 1-3 ug/dL Flag H
Correction on reference range for

Post Dexamethasone Result 1.7 Reference Range <1 ug/dL Flag H

Insulin Result 15 Ref Range 29-179 pmol/L Flag L
Glucose Result 4.3 Ref Range 4.2-6.4 mmol/L Flag (blank)
Insulin:Glucose Ratio Result 3
T4 Result 1.4 Ref Range 0.9-2.8 ug/dL Flag (blank)
Barbara,
It looks like everything's within the normal ranges except
for insulin being low. You compare your horse's results with the
normal ranges. I'm bad at math, so I won't calculate your G:I ratio
for you, but here are Mandy's instructions from another message:

You divide Glucose by Insulin. The units are important. IF your glucose is
mg/dL and your insulin is uIU/L you leave the numbers as they are. IF your
glucose is in mmoL/L you multiply by 18 first. If your insulin is in pmol/L
you divide by 7.1 first ~ then "I" into "G". There is a file on how to do
this! but I have forgotten the name. Keep scrolling down...you'll see it.
Anything <4.5 is considered IR. 4.5 - 10 is considered compensated IR and
10> is good.

This will tell you if your horse is IR and how severe it is.
I'm not familiar w/ the dexamethasone tests, since we usually
have the ACTH test done, but it looks like it's in the normal range,
so your horse probably doesn't have Cushing's. The numbers are at the
high end, but this is the time of the seasonal rise, which might
account for that.
I hope others will confirm this or correct me.
--

Sandy Su
ssu@...


 

--- In EquineCushings@..., "Barbara" <b.dayton@...> wrote:

Correction on reference range for

Post Dexamethasone Result 1.7 Reference Range <1 ug/dL Flag H
Barbara ~

Basically, they mean positive for Cushing's (the post-dex cortisol
should have been lower).
Everythng else is within their normal reference range (except insulin
which was low - was she fasted? or possibly incorrect handling), so
negative for IR.
Thyroid looks fine.

Do you have a case history up so we can look at these in context?

Patti K
Vail AZ


Barbara <b.dayton@...>
 

I posted a case history but I have not added the test results yet.

I am confused because I was originally told her glucose was off the
chart and that she is definately IR. However, I do not see that in
the test results. I thought maybe I misunderstood the test results. S

If the blood was mishandled could it effect the Dex test?

I posted pictures of her in the photo section, named Foxy. She is so
thin its scary.

I started her on the pergolide (.5 mg dose) a week ago. How long does
it usually take to see if the pergolide is working? How will I know
its working? Her biggest problem is she is severely underweight.

Thanks!
Barbara


5 Pine Ranch
 

Barbara, can you please detail in a post to this list all that she has been fed, when you bought her, what her condition was when you bought her? She is in very rough shape, I'm very sorry for you both, I know you are upset about it. Have you had her teeth checked? Have you considered having a belly tap done? Please ask your vet for specific details on that glucose test and what "kind" of glucose test was performed - specifically, what is "glucose all over the place mean" since to us, an off the charts glucose means a horse could be frankly diabetic and not just insulin resistance. It's important to clarify this.

In my opinion, this mare should have more than .5 mg pergolide. 1 mg is the standard dose to start.

The hay in her stall in the photos looks very mature and I'm not sure how well she might be chewing/digesting and given it's maturity appearance, may be quite lignified. Can you get her on beet pulp asap and let's try to find you more dense, safe feed....if you don't mind, could you let us know whereabouts you live? Can you get any Triple Crown products in your area? How warm is it in your stall, if it's cool, she will benefit from a light blanket.

No pasture! No sweet feeds or oats! Beet pulp should be rinsed, soaked & rinsed. No safe choice. Switch to beet pulp and check to see if you can get Triple Crown Safe Starch. Alfalfa cubes or hay cubes? Soaking these in case of teeth issues.

Lots more details are needed please.

Amberlee
www.fivepineranch.com
Please Visit Our Site!


Barbara <b.dayton@...>
 

Okay here goes! This is going to be long.

I bought her through a rescue (AC4H) in PA in September 2006. She
was a broker owned horse. We live in Gloucester, VA. If memory
serves me, she was about 1,000 lbs based on weight tape when we got
her home. She looked like she needed 100-200 lbs more.

My vet came to do a check on her. Her teeth were good. Her legs
were good. He did not find in problems with her. He said she was
about 16 years old. I pointed out some swelling of glands along the
bone under her face. ( I was afraid it was strangles)He was not
concerned about it. Said it could just be shipping fever. (She had
no fever) He said she could use 100 lbs but no more because she was
so low on her pasterns. Very long toe and high heel.

She received 3 lbs of Safechoice and free feed hay. I de-wormed her
with Ivemectrin. She received rabies, west nile, strangles, Potomac
fever and 5 way vaccines. My farrier started the wild horse trim on
her. She was quarantined for 4 weeks and then slowly introduced to
the herd. She had some odd behaviors. She will stand with all four
legs out from under her body. She ¡¥sprays¡¦ whenever she gets around
my other mares. The other horses shunned her.

Also, she goes down occasionally and can not get up without
assistance. The first time, she must have been down for several
hours during the night. My husband found her in the morning. It
took 3 men to get her up. I rushed home (I work over an hour
away). I thought I would come home to grave news. There she
stood. Mud soaked and stiff but standing. ļ She is a tough girl.

Her feet improved dramatically. She has spirit and life in her eyes
again. She is a sweetheart and deserves a happy life. She has
continued to lose weight.

She was down to 874 lbs weight tape. I took her to another vet.
Her teeth were really bad. She had ulcerations in her cheek. He
took care of her teeth and said she would gain weight and be in good
shape in three weeks. ļ Boy was I excited!

Well she continued to lose weight. She was down to 847 lbs based on
weight tape. I had another vet come out and pull blood. That was
on July 19th and 20th. It took a couple of weeks to get the results
back. She said she had cushings and that her Glucose was off the
chart. She priced pergolide for me at $90 for 90 ml (30 day
supply). I could not afford that.

I opted to try other things first. I tried to get her to eat Chaste
Berry. No go! I tried her on Equi Pride. It did wonders for her
coat. Nice and shiny where it was once dull. She put on a little
weight. Fluctuating between 861 and 874 lbs.

I decided to try the emergency diet. On 10/19/2007 I started her on
Blue Seal Carb Guard (4 lbs per day) and 4 lbs of plain beet pulp
soaked per day with 4t cinnamon and 2t iodized salt. Free feed
timothy hay throughout the day.

I contacted the vet to find out the dosage of pergolide so I could
price shop. She said .5mg. I researched pergolide and found it for
$22.40 delivered. Thanks to the help of the files on this message
board. Definitely affordable. She started her pergolide on
10/26/2007.

The stall she is in the picture needs to be cleaned. I have been
meaning to post pictures and had to take them when I could. She
gets fresh hay every night. She will not eat anything that is bad.
She is very particular about her food. The temps at night here have
been as low as 40 degrees. I have held off on a blanket because I
was afraid if I use one too soon she will not grow a winter coat.
What is a good guideline for starting her blanket at night? I have
a light blanket.

What is a belly tap and why is it done? I can get TC from Southern
States. Is it better than the Blue Seal? Why does the BP have to
be rinsed and rinsed again?

Did I miss anything? :-)

Barbara


5 Pine Ranch
 

Barbara, I'm going to read this again and digest it before responding further. I've also given Dr. Kellon a head's up on the details so I'm hoping she may have more insight.

In the meantime, can you update your history for us?

Contact the vet and it really is significant given her body condition to get the numbers for the glucose.......it's really important to know what kind of test and what the actual results were including lab normal ranges.

The mare's history and her body condition remind me of a horse we had here a few years ago. He was in bad shape like your girl. The vet that examined him floated his teeth, waited a couple of weeks but it still hadn't helped so he drew some fluid out of the gelding's abdomen. The fluid indicated infection and we put him on antibiotics. Now, I couldn't say if this was/is happening with your mare or not but it certainly may be worth checking.

Can you afford any blood panels?

Amberlee
www.fivepineranch.com
Please Visit Our Site!


Barbara <b.dayton@...>
 

I have a copy of the test results. My original post is what the
actual test results say. Glucose is 4.3 Ref Range is 4.2 - 6.4
mmol/L. I am not sure why she said her glucose was "off the
chart". She said she wanted to see if the insilin levels got better
once Foxy is on Pergolide. In a later conversation, after I
requested copies of the test results, she told me her glucose was
normal. I am confused and she does not like it when I ask
questions. Therefore, I am trying to sort things out myself.

Oops see I did forget something! I did have a blood panel done back
in February 2007. It was the day she went down and was down for
hours. Everything came back nornaml except her iron was very
slightly low.

I do not have a copy of those results but can get them. Is that the
same as the blood panel you mention?



--- In EquineCushings@..., 5 Pine Ranch
<fivepineranch@...> wrote:

Barbara, I'm going to read this again and digest it before
responding further. I've also given Dr. Kellon a head's up on the
details so I'm hoping she may have more insight.

In the meantime, can you update your history for us?

Contact the vet and it really is significant given her body
condition to get the numbers for the glucose.......it's really
important to know what kind of test and what the actual results were
including lab normal ranges.

The mare's history and her body condition remind me of a horse we
had here a few years ago. He was in bad shape like your girl. The
vet that examined him floated his teeth, waited a couple of weeks
but it still hadn't helped so he drew some fluid out of the
gelding's abdomen. The fluid indicated infection and we put him on
antibiotics. Now, I couldn't say if this was/is happening with your
mare or not but it certainly may be worth checking.

Can you afford any blood panels?

Amberlee
www.fivepineranch.com
Please Visit Our Site!