Newbie here with FAT Paso


Tracy Dore
 

Hello all -
I joined this group over a month ago and have lurked trying to learn.
We had to put our sweet Doberman down a month ago so I'm just now
getting my head back into the game of solving my fattie Paso's issues.

Here is some info about him and what my vet called me about yesterday:
Salsero is a 9 yo Paso Fino gelding.
I have had him for about 2.5 years now. He is on pasture 24/7 with two
buddies.
He gets a handful (I barely cover the bottom of his feed pail) of
Strategy 1x a day so I can get a supplement called Remission in him
(been on that maybe 2 months now) and BugOff Garlic to help with ticks
and flies.
Even with a grazing muzzle he's fat. His neck is cresty. He does not
seem lethargic nor do his feet seem to bother him.
Monday I hauled him to the vet and she checked his insulin and T4.
We did not do a whole blood workup b/c the vet said hauling him would
probably cause some false readings on some of the tests due to the
stress of hauling and being away from home etc...
She said it shouldn't impact the insulin and T4 readings so we'd start
there.
Yesterday she calls and says the insulin is normal - right in the
middle of the range - I didn't get the number.
His T4 however was 9.3 and she says that is low - should be around 15.
She wants me to swing by and we'll try the Thyro-L and restest the T4
in about 2 months.
She said she thinks it couldn't hurt to consider putting him on the new
Purina Wellsolve or other low NSC food as well just to be safe.

All that being said I have to admit neither of my horses have been
ridden in about 18 months.
We have an 11 month old daughter and I've just not had time to ride and
I didn't ride when I was pregnant.
I know some of that weight is from the extreme lack of work.
Salsero sheds out his winter coat so I'm not very worried about
Cushings.
I am however concerned that the thyroid issue is not primary
hypothyroidism but could be secondary or tertiary hypothyroidism.
This after reading an article from 1998 from Dr Messer (think that was
his name) that he presented to the AAEP yearly meeting at that time.

He mentions that a TSH test is called for to make sure it's the thyroid
before treating but said at the time there is no equine TSH test out
there.

After digging around online last night I'm not sure 10 years later that
there is an equine TSH test.

At this point I am wondering if I go ahead with the Thyro-L?
OR
Do I have the vet come out and do more bloodwork and hold off on the
Thyro-L? And IS there an equine TSH test out there?
OR
Do I try a nutritional supplement to boost the thyroid - and if so
which one?

One concern - I stay home with our daughter so I want to spend money
wisely on this.
I can't go berzerk with the moolah.
We're not broke - but I have to be careful of what I'm spending here.

Thanks in advance and sorry so long!
Oh - and yes - I am watching the "weight gain/hypothyroid/laminitis
worries" post as well.

Tracy


Mandy Woods
 

Hi Tracy,
Welcome to the group! OH BOY~ do you have a lot of reading to do! The files that were sent to you when you joined (or go to the Start Here file) will start Salsero on the road to health. His problem in a nut shell is you're feeding him sugar. He's IR. He needs his sugar reduced! This is how you do it. The DDT/E's. Diagnosis, Diet, Trim and Exercise. Ask you vet for the actual numbers of his insulin test. Get the lab units and normal ranges. Many horses's numbers fall in the ''normal'' range but they are still IR. We'll show you how to compute that. Then start the Diet. NO GRASS! Get him off the pasture unless his muzzle hole is taped shuts with the side slates woven shut too. Grass is full of sugar. Have a read at www.safergrass.org Soak his grass hay for one hour in cold water. Drain and serve. Get some plain shredded beet pulp and rinse/soak/rinse it till the water runs clear. Thats a great carrier for the emergency minerals. Add vitamin e, loose iodized salt and magnesium to the BP. Feed him 1.5% his body weight a day in hay/BP to lose weight. Trim his feet balanced with toes backed and heels down. Exercise him if he's able.
Your goal is to find low sugar/starch hay and balance the minerals to that. Throw out the Strategy- its 28% nsc. We aim for less that 10% nsc (sugar+starch). Hold off on the Purina Wellsolve and the ThryoidL for now. Stop the Remission. Get a 50# bag of Mag/Ox at the feed store for $25. Get your loose salt at Walmart for 33cents a box. Vitamin E in the gelcaps too. 1000iu's twice a day.
When you have a chance, go to File #9 and fill out a case history there. There are some regional feeds that this list recommends.
Please read the Start Here files again. Ask questions and we'll help. You're on the right track!
Mandy and Asher in VA


Sandra Su
 

At 3:20 PM +0000 6/20/08, Tracy Dore wrote:
Salsero is a 9 yo Paso Fino gelding.
I have had him for about 2.5 years now. He is on pasture 24/7 with
two buddies. He gets a handful (I barely cover the bottom of his
feed pail) of Strategy 1x a day so I can get a supplement called
Remission in him (been on that maybe 2 months now)
Mandy gave you good advice about changing his diet. Do that
ASAP, since Salsero is in real danger of laminitis.

and BugOff Garlic to help with ticks and flies.
Garlic is not good for horses. Search the old messages about
it. It was mentioned quite a bit a while ago. Basically, I think it
causes something called Heinz anemia in horses if they get too much
garlic, and even a little can't be good. There is no definite proof
that giving a horse garlic repels insects, anyway. Your money will
be better spent on a good bug spray. I like Ultrashield, myself.
Recently, there was some mention of neem oil. I've never tried it,
but it sounds good. Check old messages for more info on that, if you
want to try it.

Even with a grazing muzzle he's fat. His neck is cresty. He does not
seem lethargic nor do his feet seem to bother him.
You are very lucky that he hasn't foundered already. It
sounds to me like he's IR. That means that changing his diet is of
utmost importance. Also, he needs exercise. That really helps, too.

She wants me to swing by and we'll try the Thyro-L and restest the
T4 in about 2 months.
Read up on Thyro-L. It has been useful in reducing weight.
See the old messages.

She said she thinks it couldn't hurt to consider putting him on the
new Purina Wellsolve or other low NSC food as well just to be safe.
That's a good idea, but Wellsolve isn't the safest feed out
there. That has recently been discussed, too, so search old messages
about Wellsolve and why other choices are better. If you use
rinsed/soaked/rinsed beet pulp as a carrier for the things you'll
add, you'll probably spend less, anyway. Besides, a lot of those
additives are in powder form, and the moist beet pulp makes them
stick better than pellets.

All that being said I have to admit neither of my horses have been
ridden in about 18 months.
You need to find a way to exercise them, especially Salsero.
If it's not possible for you to ride, might friends ride them for
you? Many horseless people would love a chance to ride. Maybe you can
get a babysitter a few times a week and start riding again?

Salsero sheds out his winter coat so I'm not very worried about Cushings.
He's too young, anyway. Yes, I think it's IR, not Cushing's.

At this point I am wondering if I go ahead with the Thyro-L?
OR
Do I have the vet come out and do more bloodwork and hold off on the
Thyro-L? And IS there an equine TSH test out there?
OR
Do I try a nutritional supplement to boost the thyroid - and if so
which one?
When his IR is under control, his thyroid may regulate
itself. Till then, it's a judgment call about using Thyro-L.

One concern - I stay home with our daughter so I want to spend money
wisely on this.
We understand. A lot of us are on a limited budget. The diet
changes you will make might actually be cheaper, though perhaps more
trouble and expense in the beginning.
For instance, you should start the emergency diet right away,
but as soon as you can, you should test your hay and then adjust
supplementation to what's lacking in the hay. Also, you will need to
soak your hay till you're sure (from the hay test) that the sugar
(ESC) and starch are less than 10%.
But first, the emergency diet. Once you have that set up, ask
about hay testing and move to the next step.
--

Sandy Su
ssu@...


Jeanette
 

Tracy --

I second Sandy re the garlic warning. Before I read about potential
problems with too much garlic I had used BugOff myself for two summers
here in Colorado, but quit because I didn't see that it did any good.
The only thing that changed as far as I could tell was that my barn
smelled like an equine pizza parlor. Much as I like horses, garlic and
pizza, I couldn't eat pizza for months after. I'm pretty sure the flies
didn't have the same problem :-D

Once you round up the supplies the "emergency diet" is quite do-able
until you can get a hay analysis back.

Good luck.

Jeanette
Colorado