flavor enhancers


jgpigger
 

Hi Everyone
I have been looking through the files to find the one that gives ideas to flavor supplements for picky eaters. Ellie will eat her evening dose, but will not touch her morning one. I can't seem to find that list in the files, I looked in the ECHOof and Horsekeeping groups as well. Any help.
I know that Horse Tech makes some falvorings, but they contain corn oil as the base and Eleanor was not too keen for me to give Ellie corn oil that was in another product I asked her about recently.
Can someone direct me to where this list is located? I also have some beet root powdered ordered as Eleanor thought Ellie might like that, so waiting on that to come. But I would like another back up plan if miss fussy butt gets her panities in a ruffle with the root powder. Thanks candy 2010 michigan


ejm <ejmico@...>
 

jgpigger wrote:
I also have some beet root powdered ordered as Eleanor thought Ellie
might like that, so waiting on that to come. But I would like another
back up plan if miss fussy butt gets her panities in a ruffle with
the root powder. Thanks candy 2010 michigan
I found to put a little beet root powder in the bottom of the feeder or feeding pan and then the food and a little beet root powder sprinkled on the top worked real well for mine.

Elva in New Mexico
June 2004


Lorna <briars@...>
 

Hi Candy,

What's different about the morning ration?
Something in there that's not fed at night? Or conversely,something not in there that IS fed at night?

Lorna in Ontario
Support/Moderator
2002


jgpigger
 

Thanks Elva, for that suggestion, I will tell Lisa to try that. I got my beet powder today. candy 2010 Michigan


I found to put a little beet root powder in the bottom of the feeder or
feeding pan and then the food and a little beet root powder sprinkled on
the top worked real well for mine.

Elva in New Mexico
June 2004


jgpigger
 

Hi Lorna
Ellie did the same thing to me too. I tried the timothy cubes, with them without them, made everything else the same as night time. Somtimes at night she wouldn't finish them but usually during the morning its a given. Lisa thinks that Ellie knows that she only needs one of the servings and that she knows better than we do, I am sure about that, but all my other horses would eat their vit. every time I served them in minutes. Ellie takes all night, she picks at them. I don't think she likes them very well. She used to really eat everything when I had her on the other diet with a small amount of oats. Can't we feed a small amount of them? I only used 6 oz. Couldn't i put 3 oz. in them? Just wondering. Ellie is not a super sensitive horse and I am kkeping her sugars down with her food. I am wondering whats more important, getting her to eat the vit with a small amount of oats, or not eating them at all? any thoughts on this? THANKS CANDY 2010 Michigan

--- In EquineCushings@..., "Lorna" <briars@...> wrote:



Hi Candy,

What's different about the morning ration?
Something in there that's not fed at night? Or conversely,something not in there that IS fed at night?

Lorna in Ontario
Support/Moderator
2002


Lorna <briars@...>
 

So every detail is exactly the same for morning meal as evening meal?Just asking because sometimes we don't think of a tiny detail which turns out not to be so tiny for the horse.
I would never recommend feeding *any* oats to an IR horse,whose IR was not under control,and who was not getting exercise,Candy.There are a lOT of other things to try....I know it's a pain....that are far safer than oats.
I think details are of extreme importance for Ellie at the moment,but maybe that's just me being anal.

I don't agree that Ellie knows how many servings of minerals she needs.

Lorna in Ontario
Support/Moderator
2002


Kathy Brinkerhoff
 

Hi Candy, I had a lot of questions and frustrations regarding my IR horse's diet. Until I got the diet tight and followed the EC/IR protocol I battled on-going lameness and abscessing issues. I just had to trust that the recommendations worked regardless of any other input or past experiences.

On thing I found very helpful was to sign up for a couple of Dr. Kellon's courses.....NRC Plus and Equine Cushing/Insulin Ressitance. You can find descriptions for the courses at www.drkellon.com

HTH,

Kathy

SE WI/2007

--- In EquineCushings@..., "jgpigger" <forpets@...> wrote:

I only used 6 oz. Couldn't i put 3 oz. in them? Just wondering. Ellie is not a super sensitive horse and I am kkeping her sugars down with her food. I am wondering whats more important, getting her to eat the vit with a small amount of oats, or not eating them at all? any thoughts on this? THANKS CANDY 2010 Michigan


jgpigger
 

Hi Lorna
I don't agree that she realizes that either, so I tell Lisa to keep trying to give it to her.
The only reason I asked about oats, and I know they are frowned upon, is that I read somewhere that a small amount won't upset anything. Even when Ellie was getting oats, and all my horses for that matter, I showed my vet and she's like, oh well that much is okay, its not going to cause any issues.

I did get the beet root yesterday so I will take the journey up to Ellie on Thursday to get some to her.
Ellie was one many many chinese herbs when I first bought her for her headshaking, then we pretty much got through that, but all the time I was treating her for headshaking I kept thinking that it was her feet causing it all. I am still convinced that many headshakers are caused from a pain response, (somewhere in the body) then the stress response caused by the pain response. All three of my horses fit that discription. When all of this happened to Ellie, her headshaking was more noticeable again. Her tics were very noticeable whereas no one believed she was a headshaker before. I have been trying to write a short book on my thoughts about these horses, and as I said before, they are wonderful teachers, and Ellie must be trying to get me to finish the book. I know Lady is, my oldest and first aquired headshaker! Again, Lady had alot of feet issues.
I'd be curious to know how many horses with IR or Cushings headshake because so many are feet sore and stressed in their bodies.
Thanks for your response. candy 2010 Michigan


Lorna <briars@...>
 

I don't agree that she realizes that either, so I tell Lisa to keep trying to give it to her.
The only reason I asked about oats, and I know they are frowned upon, is that I read somewhere that a small amount won't upset anything. Even when Ellie was getting oats, and all my horses for that matter, I showed my vet and she's like, oh well that much is okay, its not going to cause any issues.
Hi Candy,

I think it's very important to remember that no one size fits all.
If the IR is managed,and the horse is in exercise we know that the diet can be loosened up.I love it when Kathleen talks about this.
But each horse is different.Some horses are very sensitive to the least increase in s/s.
And if I had a horse who was still having issues,I would stick like glue to the IR diet protocol.
It seems to me,from a distance,that Ellie is telling us that things need to be tightened up,as opposed to adding items which we know can be unsafe,even in tiny amounts.

There are things that some of us don't think about as being tempting.....at least for my horses.....such as J-Herb sprinkled on top,or linseed meal, or a TINY bit of kelp,or an herbal mix used for someone else for arthritis, or ground split peas.Think outside the box and maybe you'll come up with something that you only think of using for other purposes,but which may also be safe and tempting for Ellie.

Lorna in Ontario
Support/Moderator
2002


jgpigger
 

Lorna
Its so odd though its only the morning feed? I would hate to give her all her stuff in one feeding? i.e. night time.
Do you think that would be too much at one time?
I guess if she's eating her night time that's at least some of them.
I am wondering if she eats them at night because she's in the barn with the other horses whereas in the morning, she's out in the areana (at my place) or in Lisa's roundpen alone? Although there are other horses right near her. I know that I could come up with somthing, but the carriers are oils of some kind, which going throug the files and reading on oils, they can present their own issues, so I am trying to stay away from them as well. What's a mom to do? Thanks again for your help, I appreciate it and don't worry I am not going back down that past road traveled if I can help it! candy 2010 michigan


Lorna <briars@...>
 

Do you think that would be too much at one time?
I halve mine.But the only way to tell is try it and see I guess.
Maybe Lisa could increase the base amount,so that the minerals would be less obvious to her in the morning.
Maybe her eating arrangements in the morning can be adjusted,as you have alluded to.

I know that I could come up with somthing, but the carriers are oils of some kind,
I don't understand this statement.

Also I meant to add to my other post that once Steve gets her feet balanced she may well come around.Maybe.In which case you will know that it was the trim giving her the grief.But until you can find an answer her diet,in my opinion ,needs to be tight.There is always a way.
As Dr. Kellon is known to say,"Halfway measures produce halfway results."

Lorna in Ontario
Support/Moderator
2002


jgpigger
 

Yep Lisa and I are working on it, so we'll see how things go. there has to be a solution. Some dogs perfer to eat at night and not during the day, so maybe Ellie is the same way? Who knows. candy 2010 Michigan

--- In EquineCushings@..., "Lorna" <briars@...> wrote:
There is always a way.

Lorna in Ontario
Support/Moderator
2002


Cindy McGinley
 

"jgpigger" <forpets@...> wrote:

Yep Lisa and I are working on it, so we'll see how things go. there has to be a solution. Some dogs perfer to eat at night and not during the day, so maybe Ellie is the same way? >>
Here's a thought: Alf tends to leave part of his breakfast because he is eager to get outside. He will finish it when he comes back inside in the evening. At supper, however, he eats it all, because he knows he's in for the night. Could something like that be going on with Ellie?

- Cindy and Alf (with entourage) in NY
EC Primary Response Team
May 2006
www.blackhorseconsulting.com

Visit the new Equine Cushings site:
http://www.ecirhorse.com


shabbonawoman
 

My horse is out 24/7. For whatever reason he's very slow to move in the morning; different horse later in the day. Kind of takes after his owner. He doesn't even qualify for the bottom of the pickey eaters list. He's also getting soybean hulls which horses seem to be ga-ga for. He at times won't really touch much of the morning ration with or without supps, but gladly eats them at noon. Ten pm can also be touch and go; 5 pm is fine - but it's the morning ration that at times is the pickle. I just play around with the times if he's in that kind of mood.

Cheryl
No. IL - 10/07

--- In EquineCushings@..., "jgpigger" <forpets@...> wrote:

Hi Everyone
I have been looking through the files to find the one that gives ideas to flavor supplements for picky eaters. Ellie will eat her evening dose, but will not touch her morning one. I can't seem to find that list in the files, I looked in the ECHOof and Horsekeeping groups as well. Any help.
I know that Horse Tech makes some falvorings, but they contain corn oil as the base and Eleanor was not too keen for me to give Ellie corn oil that was in another product I asked her about recently.
Can someone direct me to where this list is located? I also have some beet root powdered ordered as Eleanor thought Ellie might like that, so waiting on that to come. But I would like another back up plan if miss fussy butt gets her panities in a ruffle with the root powder. Thanks candy 2010 michigan


kathryne_heath
 

Candy,

What supplements are you trying to give and how much of it?

-Kathryne & Cerenity
2010
Northern California


jgpigger
 

I don't think so Cindy, because actually I've tried and Lisa too to put Ellie's stuff outside with her and let pick at it, and she doesn't. Even with the Timothy Cubes, she'll leave, those are not a motivator for her to eat her goodies. candy thanks for the suggestion though. 2010 michigan

He will finish it when he comes back inside in the

evening. At supper, however, he eats it all, because he knows he's in for
the night. Could something like that be going on with Ellie?

- Cindy and Alf (with entourage) in NY
EC Primary Response Team
May 2006
www.blackhorseconsulting.com

Visit the new Equine Cushings site:
http://www.ecirhorse.com


jgpigger
 

Hi Cheryl,
I done that will Ellie too, I've tried early morning, mid morning early afternoon, then its late after noon and almost time to come in, well not really, but I just give up after that. candy 2010 michigan

--- In EquineCushings@..., "Cheryl" <shabbonawoman@...> wrote:

I just play around with the times if he's in that kind of mood.

Cheryl
No. IL - 10/07


jgpigger
 

Oh let's see if I can remember, Lisa has them now. She gets or suppose to get: this is one feeding so it would be double this if I fed once a day.

2 scoops (I can't remember the measurement size, but its about 2-3 oz) of her Horse Tech formula (balanced for her hay)
2 oz NutraFlax
4 grm AAGK
2000 IU Vit E
2 1/2 teas J Herb
Teas. Celtic Salt
she was on the Ginseng but really wouldn't eat that at night either.
Organic ACV (she's always gotten that)
1 scoop Horse Tech Probitics

That's pretty much it, I am going to try the beet root powder next.
Don't really want to any oils, (read the article about fats in the files section) so will stay away from those.
Doesn't seem like much for her to eat, so I am wondering if she could have all of this doubled at night only. I know I take my vit. 2 x a day. candy 2010 michigan

--- In EquineCushings@..., "kathryne_heath" <strmtrprcerenity@...> wrote:

Candy,

What supplements are you trying to give and how much of it?

-Kathryne & Cerenity
2010
Northern California


Kathy Brinkerhoff
 

Hi Candy, Just to clarify....are you feeding the below supplements in these amounts twice a day?

Is your Horse Tech formula in a flax base?

Kathy

SE WI/2007

--- In EquineCushings@..., "jgpigger" <forpets@...> wrote:

Oh let's see if I can remember, Lisa has them now. She gets or suppose to get: this is one feeding so it would be double this if I fed once a day.

2 scoops (I can't remember the measurement size, but its about 2-3 oz) of her Horse Tech formula (balanced for her hay)
2 oz NutraFlax
4 grm AAGK
2000 IU Vit E
2 1/2 teas J Herb
Teas. Celtic Salt
she was on the Ginseng but really wouldn't eat that at night either.
Organic ACV (she's always gotten that)
1 scoop Horse Tech Probitics


Lorna <briars@...>
 

Candy?
Has she always scoffed at her morning feed,but finished off the evening meal?
If not,can you pin down when she started doing this?

Lorna in Ontario
Support/Moderator
2002