Pics of Ponys feets.


bigwhitevan2002
 

I am sorry this is the best i could get at the moment, not so great--- any feed back for farrier will be much appreciated and hopefully applied by said farrier, if not I will find another one. her xrays are somewhere will look for them and post...


dnlf@...
 

Hi Julie,

The pics go along with the xrays - heels are really much too high and need to be lowered. There is a slight wedge on both fronts which appears to have been thinned by the farrier over time to make the hoof look more "normal". Will need to drop the heels without taking anything off the bottom of the foot forward of the tip of the frog. Then will need to back the toes from the top to get the breakover realigned. The resulting foot will look a bit "odd" but this is rehab, not the final product, so need to remember that and not go for aesthetically pleasing.

Your xrays are in your case history folder:

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Julie%20in%20Oregon/

Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut
Jan 05, RI
EC Support Team


bigwhitevan2002
 

Okay , Thanks for the guidelines,--- now, how much lower on the heels?, should I assume that farrier will know this, tho I am thinking he wont, he looked at me funny 2 weeks ago when I had him come out to lower the heels the same day her x rays were taken, he  said something about it , questioning my request, I don't remember what tho I was in 'fight mode' I get that way when I feel I have to defend my reasoning about IR management with professionals like Vets and barn managers etc...so I don't listen very well just get kinda of firm and demanding...( I'm easily intimidated by educated people) doesn't make for a very good reputation for ones self ......

so take heels down to bulbs? , or half way? , should I boot her back up after her trim, she has been out of her boots for 3 days in soft bedding, her feet just seemed too warm and moist in them....no heat at this point, and she is walking better. not laying down as much if at all..
Julie 
Oregon06



dnlf@...
 

Hi Julie,

Ummmm - I would say that the farrier won't know or he would have done it already. It is likely he was telling you that you should not lower the heels as that will put more pressure on the DDFT (deep digital flexor tendon) and cause more rotation; that you must raise the heels to relieve this tension. This is an unfortunately common (and outdated) misconception.

I put some mark-ups in your folder to give you an idea of what you're looking to accomplish.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/photos/albums/1006585884

 Need to be careful to only drop height in the heels as there appears to be sinking so the total amount of hoof capsule that pony has, which looks excessive, is needed as the bony column is sitting lower inside than it should be. DO NOT lower the wall height in the front part of the foot, esp in the area of the pillars. This is what is protecting the leading edge of the coffin bone. Will also need to back the toes to relieve the lever forces that are tearing the laminar connections with each step.

Need some pics of the sides of the hooves, with the camera at ground level, to be able to show you what these changes would look like from the outside.

Use boots/pads as needed to keep her comfortable. If she walks OK without them then great. The smaller guys generally bounce back much more quickly than the bigger ones.

Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut
Jan 05, RI
EC Support Team


bigwhitevan2002
 

Wow , thanks that is nifty , I will print or e-mail pics and text to my guy and hopefully we can re educate him. and i will take some ground level pics with my ghetto phone when I get out there today and post...

and yes he was saying something about the tendon, when I wasnt listening ....that would explain the puzzled look on his face when I said , her heels are way to high..
I will humbly listen and then explain all this to him this time...now that I understand what I mean....


---In EquineCushings@..., <dnlf@...> wrote :


>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ummmm - I would say that the farrier won't know or he would have done it already. It is likely he was telling you that you should not lower the heels as that will put more pressure on the DDFT (deep digital flexor tendon) and cause more rotation; that you must raise the heels to relieve this tension. This is an unfortunately common (and outdated) misconception.

I





palomino.1982@...
 

Julie-

The subject of the DDFT pulling the coffin bone down comes up often. The DDFT does not cause the coffin bone to continue rotating but the destruction of the laminar connections does. For a great explanation of this see here:

http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/EquineCushings/message/154519

It is a post from Lars and he addresses the issue from an engineering standpoint.

More reading ( I know,,,,,,,,,)

Susan
EC Primary Response
San Diego 1.07


bigwhitevan2002
 


Thanks Susan, I read that over a few times and this passage ( copied below) makes me nervous, sounds like you have to really know what your doing and now I am starting to question, my farrier of 10 years..

.so when Lars says lower the heels while addressing the toe he means during the same trim correct..? and am I to understand that the mark ups done on pony's  x rays are to be done in ONE trim or over a few weeks? I ask because it seems like if that much comes off she wont have any toe left...like he will be cutting into some part of her foot that shouldn't be cut...


My guy is a very good farrier, and is well sought out, and often is called upon to fix the mistakes other trimmers have done to various horses in larger facilitys , he has been very loyal to us even thou we stopped boarding in the big wig facilities years ago,, he comes over on his days off to trim our little herd and charges us less than others ( shhhh).but I am starting to think he is not up to par with a founder rehab.....
Ugh...

Julie
Oregon, 06






"Since the displacement of the P3 is caused by high mechanical stress in the lamellae, the most important thing to do mechanically with a laminitic horse is to remove as much of the load on the hoof wall as possible. Especially in the toe area where the force on the hoof wall gives rise to high tensile stress in the lamina. Items (2) and (3) above help to do that. However, item (1) raising the heels is something I definitely would advise against. It's true that you will reduce the tensile stress in the lamellae if you raise the heels by applying heel wedges but at the same time you will increase the shear stress in the lamellae which can lead to distal decent of P3 (sunken coffin bone). On the other hand, if you lower the heels without first addressing the toe you will increase the tensile stress in the lamellae which may lead to further rotation". 


PapBallou@...
 

Julie -

I don't seem to be able to trim excess text -

Anyway, raising heels to avoid DDFT pull is a long held belief that is almost impossible to shake from many folks who were trained in hoof care (including vets in school) up until the very recent pas.  Even now, it's dependent on how progressive the school is. 

If you've been using this gentleman for 10 years, he undoubtedly is of that belief.  You may or may not get him to believe you and he can readily point to a multitude of books that say this is what must be done if you are to save the horse.

It's a bit like years ago when people with gastric ulcers were told to drink milk.  Turns out it's one of the worst foods if one has an ulcer.

Linda
EC Primary Response
West Coast
May 2004


bigwhitevan2002
 

ya I cant figure out trimming the text either ...

I emailed the marked x rays to him, as well as the instructions that were written along with it, he has a couple of days to mull this over in his mind...he is not an old guy, just following in the foot steps of his dad, who retired so maybe he can be rehabbed himself..--- his little daughter loves this pony, and comes to ride when he is working, so perhaps that will be incentive for him to learn something new and improved..
Thank all
Julie
oregon 06


periople8
 

Hi Julie,
The rehab trim is part theory, part feel, and part observe the horse.  Many of us trim because we could not find a farrier who could/would do "the rehab trim."  Is a rasp in your hands out of the question?

Bob
SW Washington, 2/13


bigwhitevan2002
 

Ha! Thanks Bob,
I actually have 3 rasps, I look at them once in a while, and have actually picked one up with intent and chickened out. I  think I could learn, its those clipper things they use to cut off the extra hoof that scare me...it would be difficult because of  a frozen shoulder as well as back issues due to a roll over in a truck  , but to quote Monty Python, 'I'm not dead yet." :)

I'll see how thing go Saturday.
Thanks for the confidence..
Julie
Oregon 06