Prune Question & Blood Work Update

Rita Creitz

Hi all,

Well, bummer, I typed my entire message, then went to attach the link to my CH, and lost the whole starting over. How do you save a draft? 

The prune question:  I've read that prunes are OK as treats for IR horses.  How come, since the sugar is so much higher than apples, for example?  It's really a curiosity question at this point, tho, since Houdon turned his finicky nose up.  I have found his Prascend at the bottom of his food bowl on occasion and, in a pinch, I've given it to him in a small piece of apple, which I know is not recommended, but since the sugar is lower, can a bit of apple be really bad?  Just wondering.  I've tried salted peanuts in the shell, go.

I'd love some feedback on his latest blood work (Cornell).  His ACTH came back at 74.9 (up from 41 in Jan).  He's been on 1 mg Prascend, but it's been upped to 2.  It was surprising to me that it went up so much, especially at this time of the year, during the seasonal low.  Has anyone experienced that?  His other results were better.

Leptin:  1.21 (same as in Jan)

Glucose:  89 (not tested in Jan)

Insulin:  54.72 (down from 82 in Jan)

Lyme:  negative

When my trimmer was here 2 weeks ago, she suspected that his ACTH had risen because of his clinical signs (not shedding well, pulses).  Houdon had been in an eaten-down paddock wearing his muzzle, with two other horses, but when the pulses showed up, he's now in a small mostly bare pen.  It's not the best, but there's no larger dry lot at my barn.  I notice Houdon is not eating the bitty grass that's there (and which I've covered with old, dirty hay), but eats the plentiful hay and ODBC given him.  He's definitely foot-sore, seems the pulses might be a tiny better, but are still there. He'll be trimmed again in another week and I hope before then I notice a change in his soreness once the increased dose of pergolide kicks in....he had his 3rd dose today.  I switched to compounded capsules from ThrivingPets....very helpful folks there.  My former vet would not prescribe compounded, but my new vet does (Yay!)  There's so many folks with successful management of PPID using compounded pergolide.....made perfect sense to switch. 

Houdon's diet has been balanced, so am working on the recommended changes.  Don't have to soak the hay...yay!

Thanks in advance to any feedback.  Learning lots from everyone.

Rita and Houdon

Gaithersburg, MD

Sept 2013


Dawn Wagstaff

I'll let the experts answer the bloodwork questions. In regard to prunes, prunes are very high in fiber which causes the sugar in them to be utilized very slowly. Hence, they are very low on the glycemic index, in that they have much less effect on insulin than other fruits.
You want to make sure you are using simple dried prunes, not heavily processed types that have added sugar or worse, are in syrup.

Glycemic Index of Prunes | LIVESTRONG.COM

Dawn Wagstaff

Saline, MI 2003 

Lavinia Fiscaletti

Hi Rita,

The safest way to add a link is to use the "insert" icon at the top of the reply box and then don't go anywhere near it again with your cursor or Neo uses that as an excuse to hijack you to the link - and your post goes POOF! You can type a reply into a word document and then copy/paste it into a reply so you have a safe backup in case Neo eats it.

I have one who's ACTH has been doing a similar thing for 3 years now. It's driving me crazy. I can get the numbers dead-center of the normal range during the seasonal rise but then it goes up during the late winter and spring. That is not PPID-induced rise but what IS causing it is a mystery. Haven't quite figured out what to do as it just continues to rise form there and then jumps again during the rise period. Not much help but know you're not alone in this. My boy's insulin won't come down tho, so you are ahead of the game there. Great that the Lyme is also negative.

Good job getting things together for Houdon.

Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut
Jan 05, RI
EC Support Team

Rita Creitz

Hi Lavinia and Dawn,

Dawn, thanks for the prune info.  Remember I said I'd given Houdon's Prascend in a slice of apple?  Well, I did that for 3 days, and now all apples are suspect....will not touch them.  Makes me crazy!

Lavinia, least I'm not alone with this strange spike at the 'low' part of the year.  Does your horse have an increase in pulses and sore feet during this time as Houdon did? 

I will say, though, that since doubling the pergolide only 5 days ago, Houdon looks better, pulses are down, eyes look real good. We went for a short walk in the ring today (in his boots) and he out-paced me, which is a wonderful sign he's feeling better.  BUT, this recent flare two weeks seen on the images today, caused rotation in his RF, which had already sunk. LF had also previously rotated, but not sure if there was more.  So, in spite of his energy, his feet are a mess...definitely not stable.  Well, he's not stable, period.

My trimmer will be out on Monday after having also seen the images.  Houdon's on a 3-week trimming cycle.  I feel like it's a slippery slope at this moment, but I have a village supporting me, so I have to keep the faith.  I really worry that, for lack of a better way to say it....Houdon is not making/growing any laminae at all to help his CB attach.  Has that ever happened????  He's had so many laminitic/flounder episodes.  

My vet will be emailing me the images with her measurements and I'll make a go at loading them on his CH, but, honestly, I get so befuddled and frustrated I give up.  I have no patience with computer stuff.  I think NEO stands for "Not Easily Operated" and whoever developed it.....well, never mind.

Best to all,

Rita and Houdon (aka "Spunky".... for today anyway)
Gaithersburg, Md
Sept 2013

Deb Funderburk <hawkhilldeb@...>

Hang in there, Rita. It sounds like Houdon is a rascal. Glad to hear he's looking better. My pony is having trouble with laminitis, uncontrolled ACTH and growing no wall on his poor little feet. He is a picky eater so I am having a hard time getting him to eat the supplements and hay with acceptable sugar. And I am having a hard time navigating the computer. So what you said about having a village behind us really resonated with me. We couldn't do it without them. Keep asking questions. I learn every time you do.

Deb and Cory in NC
July 2012