Pinworms


kimshu92026@...
 

I posted this over in Horsekeeping, but, there's not much activity over there so decided to post here, too. I'm wondering about the safe deworming treatment for IR horses who have pinworms.

My miniature horse has pinworms and now my QH/Welsh gelding is rubbing the hairs off his tailhead so I suspect he has them, too. My Icelandic mare shows no symptoms so far.

When I first suspected my mini had them, I gave her Ivermectin twice, two weeks apart. Then when she continued to itch, I had the vet out and he didn't know what was causing her itchy bottom, but, said the Ivermectin treatment I had given should take care of any worms. A few days later I pulled a pinworm out of her butt as it was sticking out.

I called the vet back and he said to give moxidectrin (Quest) last week, which I did, but, have since found out that Quest is not recommended by this group. My mini is still terribly itchy.

I gave my mare and gelding their usual treatment of Ivermectin last week, but, after I saw the gelding's tail today, I bought some Pyrantel pamoate and gave a single dose each to my mare and gelding.

I've done some research and read on another site that horses should get a double dose of Pyrantel 6-8 weeks apart for pinworms.

Can someone tell me what the recommended treatment for pinworms is for IR horses?  It seems to take a long time to eradicate these pinworms. I had no idea it was this troublesome!

Thanks!

Kim and Nanna
Southern California
May 2008



kimshu92026@...
 

P.S. My Icelandic mare, Nanna, is now showing signs of rubbing her hind end, too. She is the one that had laminitis six years ago, but, has been controlled since then.


Chanda
 

Since it sounds like you have deworming under control, don't forget that a dirty udder in a mare or dirty sheath in a gelding can make them itchy and the closest they can get to itching where it itches is to scratch their bum.  So, clean the gelding's sheath and wash the mare's udder (the crease between the halves can really get loaded with gunk).   For the mare's udder, baby wipes work pretty darn good to clean up the ick, you might want to wear gloves, as the gunk is almost as smelly as what you find when cleaning a sheath.  And, there are directions for sheath cleaning on the internet, so if you google it, you should find instructions, if you haven't done it before.

Chanda

MT 9/04



kimshu92026@...
 

Thanks for the reminder Chanda, but, I do keep my mare's udders and my gelding's sheath clean.  I'm hoping to get help with a safe protocol for treating the pinworms. Both my gelding and mare are IR and I'm sure my mini is at risk, too, though she's never been tested.

Kim and Nanna
Southern CA
May 2008


kimshu92026@...
 

P.S. Nanna's vulva and area around it is very swollen right now. I imagine it's irritation from the eggs being layed in that area. My mini had the same problem, but, is improving some. I am washing the area twice a day, spraying Zim's Crack Cream with Arnica which is supposed to help the itchiness and then slathering on vaseline so the eggs have a harder time sticking. I pulled another adult worm out of my mini's butt today, but, I think it was dead.


Nancy C
 

Hi Kim

To keep this on topic and specific to your IR horse....

Most often it is not pinworms. From this message

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/conversations/messages/43444

 


> >This is the time of year he usually
> > rubs his tail and mane out. Would that be from migrating larvae
or
> the "no see'ums" fly?
>
> Could be no see-um's, dirty sheath or pinworms, I believe?

Right, or dead skin/scale build up around the anus, irritation from
tick bites. Pinworms are what most people think of first but it's
actually the least likely to be the problem.

Eleanor

****************************

In the above Dr Kellon recommends 5-dy panacur due to resistance and extensive colonic ulceration.  For dewormers now recommended please see FILES section

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/files/Deworming/

Specifically: Dewormers updated 2013.

 

As mentioned earlier for PPID and IR horses, diagnosis control and diet re critical for these issues.

For general horse  keeping suggestions, we need to move this to Horsekeeping.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
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https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
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http://ecirhorse.org/index.php/equine-cushing-s-and-insulin-resistance-group-inc

---In EquineCushings@..., <kimshu92026@...> wrote :

I posted this over in Horsekeeping, but, there's not much activity over there so decided to post here, too. I'm wondering about the safe deworming treatment for IR horses who have pinworms.


 


Nancy C
 

Sorry Kim.  Bad proofing on my part.

Five-day panacur is not longer recommended.  I have corrected the statement below.

In the above Dr Kellon recommends 5-dy panacur but due to resistance and extensive colonic ulceration the group no longer recommends it.  For dewormers now recommended please see FILES section

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/files/Deworming/

Specifically: Dewormers updated 2013.


Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
http://ecirhorse.org/index.php/equine-cushing-s-and-insulin-resistance-group-inc

 





---In EquineCushings@..., <threecatfarm@...> wrote :
****************************

In the above Dr Kellon recommends 5-dy panacur due to resistance and extensive colonic ulceration.  For dewormers now recommended please see FILES section

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/files/Deworming/

Specifically: Dewormers updated 2013.

 

As mentioned earlier for PPID and IR horses, diagnosis control and diet re critical for these issues.

For general horse  keeping suggestions, we need to move this to Horsekeeping.


kimshu92026@...
 

I read the deworming file and just want to confirm that it's OK to use Quest. I thought I read on here in a post that Quest was not safe.

If Quest is OK, should I just give them a single dose spaced 6-8 weeks apart?

Sorry, I get confused and need a step by step procedure to make sure I'm doing the right thing.

Thanks,

Kim and Nanna
Southern CA
May 2008


Nancy C
 

Hi Kim

Not using the moxidenctin is cautionary.  From the dewormer doc:
New combination dewormer pastes containing either ivermectin or moxidectin plus
praziquantel are available for treating tapeworm infestations. They are quite effective but this
study in rats suggests caution may be indicated with IR horses:!
[see study abstract PRAZIQUANTEL PRECAUTION.pdf in files at http://
groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/files/Deworming/]!
Once the drug wears off, there may be a compensatory rebound insulin spike.!
Would have to agree that the conclusion they reached, that "care should be taken" is
warranted.!
Please note it is NOT known if the same would occur in a horse when using the combination
dewormers but it's worth bearing in mind. Risks vs benefits should be discussed with your
treating vet if your horse or pony is IR.! !

Strongest caution is in thin horses.  it has teh thinest safety margin and needs to be dosed ccurately.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/conversations/messages/147564

Dr Kellon's short course on deworming indicates both moxi and ivermectin are effective for adult and fourth stage larvae.  Also suggests pinworms are often incorrectly blamed for tail rubbing and do not generally happen in horse regularly dewormed. since you've seen them, it appeaars you actualy have them.   If you no longer see them, would recommend you go on a regular ivermectin schedule now and treat the horses topically for the rubbing and perhaps look for other areas that may be contributing to their itching. You might want to ask you vet about a short course of benedryl.  If you see them again, my leaning would be to go back to ivermectin and not the moxidectin.


Again, from reports of many members and my own personal experience, nothing helps these horses with resisting parasites and ealing with allergic type reaction like getting the diagnosis under control and addressing mineral/nutritional  imbalances in the diet.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
Equine Cushing's and Insulin Resistance Group Inc.

 



 





If Quest is OK, should I just give them a single dose spaced 6-8 weeks apart?



kimshu92026@...
 

Thank you Nancy. I considered all things that could cause the rubbing, including onchocerca, sweet itch, bad habit, allergic reaction to something in their diet or environment, etc.

Pinworms makes the most sense right now after seeing them in my mini and how suddenly and voraciously they started itching. The girls rub their vulvas and surrounding area and not the tail heads. The gelding is only damaging his tail at the moment.

I try to keep their hay tested and balanced and just got a new shipment of hay that will be tested soon.

Thanks for clarifying.

Kim and Nanna
Southern CA
May 2008


kimshu92026@...
 

I still need help in making a treatment plan for pinworms if anyone can help me. I haven't gotten much help from my vet who says he's rarely seen pinworms, especially in older horses (I've been reading that there is an increase in occurence and even older horses are getting them now when it used to only be young horses).

I have two horses that are tested and diagnosed IR and a mini that I treat as IR although she's not been tested. All three have pinworms.

When I questioned my vet about how often I can give ivermectin or pyrantel, he just answered that dewormers are relatively safe nowadays.

I took a dead worm that I pulled out of my mini's butt to him yesterday and he said it looked like a pinworm, although, it was deteriorated which made it hard to tell for sure. But, with the severe itching that my horses are having under their tails (with no neck rubbing), it points to pinworms. I am glad to see that the last two times I saw a worm, it was dead.

They are very difficult to eradicate due to their life cycles and it seems that dewormers only kill the adults which take up to five months to mature.

I am washing their hind ends in the morning to remove any eggs deposited during the night. In the evening I wash them again and then slather on vaseline which is supposed to make it harder for the eggs to stick.

I read that it can take up to a year to finally get things under control.

I would like to deworm as often as I safely can to continually kill the adults as they mature. If they have continuously ingested eggs (I have no idea where they got them since my vet said they mainly occur in damp grass pastures. I live in Southern CA and my horses are on a one acre dry lot.)

Can anyone tell me how often I can deworm and which kind is best and whether they should be single or double doses? One article I read said a double dose of pyrantel every 6-8 weeks. Dr. Gordon told me on the EC Horsekeeping site that she took Dr. Kellon's deworming class and Dr. Kellon said to use Fendazibole (something like that) or Iver with praziquantel, but, I don't know how ofen or single or double dose. 

When my mini first started rubbing, I gave her Ivermectin twice, two weeks apart and she still had a live adult worm a week or two later, so I wonder about the effectiveness of the Ivermectin. I then gave her Quest on the advice of my vet and then I saw two dead worms come out of her.

Should I make an appointment to have a consultation with Dr. Kellon?

Thanks,

Kim and Nanna
Southern CA
May 2008


kansteen5545@...
 

Hello -
This brings up a question about manure disposal. If horses have worms and their manure is daily being spread on their grazing pasture, are you not increasing the parasite load in the grass? The pasture is not a dry lot where the manure can dry out, but thick grass.
Karen
Scarborough,ME
May 2014


Lorna Cane
 

>This brings up a question about manure disposal. 

Hi Karen,

Your message has been moved over to our sister site, ECHorsekeeping, which is better suited for general topics,such as manure disposal.


Lots of discussion over there on pinworms,too.


 


Lorna in Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002
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kimshu92026@...
 

Does anyone know if Dr. Kellon is out of town? I've sent her a couple emails asking for a consultation, but, haven't heard back from her.

Kim and Nanna
Southern CA
May 2008