Two Standlee Timothy test results


beverly meyer
 

I did a full analysis of bags from different times of the year, including the super-hard dark pellets the pony could not chew (#2 test new pellets) and will share if anyone wants them or post to the Files for others.

The ESC on #1 test old pellets is 6.3% and the Starch on #1 is .4%.  This is feed from December or November 2014. 

The ESC on #2 test new pellets is 3.4% and the Starch on #2 is .2%.  This is feed from March 2015 after Standlee went off line in February whcih they said was due to no supply. 

Protein old #1 is 9.7%.  Protein new #2 is 12%.

The ESC + Starch are far under 10% it seems odd to me.  Is it nutritious?

Any other questions?  Like why the protein on the new stuff is so much higher?  Standlee insists there is no Alfalfa but is that why the protein shot up in the new stuff maybe or just the time of harvest?  

Thanks.

Beverly 6/14

Beverly Texas


Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Beverly,

Your test results aren't at all surprising given they are from different batches of hay. They are also likely from different fields and/or suppliers. Nutrition isn't based on ESC + Starch alone, protein plus all the other minerals amounts are what determine the nutrition profile. That nice, low ESC + Starch just means it is safe from a glycemic response perspective for an IR horse to consume and is the prologue of the book. The rest of the analysis makes up the remaining chapters.

The ESC + Starch and protein will vary widely based on growing conditions (soil, temp, water, sunlight, fertilization) and time of harvesting (both time of day and time of year). I have analyses for over 10 years from the same field, same farmer, same type of mixed grass hay that range in ESC + Starch from 4% to 12% and protein that ranges from 6% to 14.5%. Definitely no alfalfa in my hay.

Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut
Jan 05, RI
EC Support Team





Kerry Isherwood
 

Actually, thanks to Beverly's analyses, I think ill switch my young horse to Standlee's Timothy pellets and off their Alfalfa pellet. He seems to have finally finished growing, mercifully...though its likely a trivial point altogether, considering the pellet portion only comprises 2-3 lbs of his daily diet acting solely as his supp carrier. But very nice to know the Timothy's ESC/starch are so low! Thanks, Beverly, for kindly sharing your results.

Kerry in NY
Sept 2014


 

Beverly, I'll take a stab at answering some of your questions. I'm sure knowledgable moderators will correct any misinformation. My statements are based on the NRCPlus course and other Dr Kellon courses I've taken as well as my own hay and pasture tests. Posting your analyses to your case history file would be helpful.

First off, I want to acknowledge that I do not know whether there is a bright line where ESC/starch become too low if you are otherwise meeting your equine's needs for DE.  Your pony isn't in work IIRC.

From a full analysis, you should see that low ESC/low starch hay products can have perfectly adequate digestible energy/DE. I've tested several soaked hays with ESC/starch in the ranges you found with the Standlee Pellets. I have an example of ESC 3.9%, starch 0.5%, and yet DE is 1.81 Mcal/kg, more than adequate, and protein tested out at 17%. Percentages of ESC/starch drop faster than DE. That's because the horse extracts other nutrients very efficiently in the hind gut by fermentation, and those nutrients are NOT sugars and starch.

Variations in protein (and other nutrients) in hay is normal and natural. Even within the same hay field or  bale or same handful of grass, protein will vary depending on whether you analyze the heads of the grass vs the middle of the stems vs the base of the stems (where nitrate accumulates during early spring growth spurts). 

What Standlee doesn't do is provide a guaranteed analysis with maximum and minimums of key nutrients. That is the benefit of a product like ODTBC. Natural variations in nutrients are controlled within ranges. I doubt such control is essential for all equines, as nature's grass supply also varies seasonally. For an aged or ill equine, you may want more consistency.

Cass for Cayuse and Satra
Sonoma County, Calif Oct 12


---In EquineCushings@..., <bmeyer@...> wrote :

I did a full analysis ***

The ESC on #1 test old pellets is 6.3% and the Starch on #1 is .4%.  This is feed from December or November 2014. 

The ESC on #2 test new pellets is 3.4% and the Starch on #2 is .2%.  This is feed from March 2015 ***

Protein old #1 is 9.7%.  Protein new #2 is 12%.

The ESC + Starch are far under 10% it seems odd to me.  Is it nutritious?

Any other questions?  Like why the protein on the new stuff is so much higher?  


Kerry Isherwood
 

....."Percentages of ESC/starch drop faster than DE. ...."

>>>Cass, are you referring to soaked hay in this statement?



Thank you,
Kerry in NY
Sept 2014


 

Apologies to the moderators who may move this to EC Horsekeeping.

Yes, I'm referring to soaked hay. *** 

That is because ESC is only one component of the formula for the calculation of DE. Other components of DE (Crude Protein, fat, hemicellulose and ash) are not reduced proportionately by soaking because they aren't as water soluble as sugars.

An example of my hays as fed:
Dry hay DE:   2.14 Mcal/kg=> soaked DE: 1.64 Mcal/kg (76% of dry)
Dry hay ESC: 7.8%=> Soaked ESC: 4.1% (53% of dry)
As Dry Matter, soaked hay DE was 89% of the dry hay, and ESC was 61% of dry hay. 

***I caution that my water is very very soft. It is not acid but it is very pure, only pH adjusted with calcium carbonate. So YMMV with different water used as the solvent.

I put these hay analyses in Cayuse's CH folder. I have a others.

Cass for Cayuse and Satra
Sonoma County, Calif Oct 12

---In EquineCushings@..., <kerry.isherwood@...> wrote :

....."Percentages of ESC/starch drop faster than DE. ...."

>>>Cass, are you referring to soaked hay in this statement?


Connie Martley
 

Hello everyone I really need your help I have a 15 year old mate that had foundered a couple of times. She was diagnosed with cushings and is on prasend. She is doing better but I really cannot afford $160.00 for 60 days. So is their a way to take her off prasend and manage her with feed, grass, hay? Please please help thank you!!! 

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 1, 2015, at 11:28 AM, kerry.isherwood@... [EquineCushings] <EquineCushings@...> wrote:

 

....."Percentages of ESC/starch drop faster than DE. ...."

>>>Cass, are you referring to soaked hay in this statement?



Thank you,
Kerry in NY
Sept 2014