The IR blues...


Kerry Isherwood
 

Crap.  I get one IR stabillized and the other falls apart.  I have no idea why, but now my 8yo gelding's insulin is 70uU/mL, the highest its ever been.  I just dont understand....

I knew something was wrong when he started getting spooky a few days ago.  That's always the first sign.  Then we went on a trail ride and an hour in he suddenly reverted back to crazytown, seriously deranged behavior he hasn't exhibited in over two years.  The other riders were mortified; I was so embarrassed.  Hence the blood draw. 

I will update his case history so fresh eyes can look at it and check for holes.  Briefly, though, he's on 15 lbs/day ODTBC and soaked hay (tiny bit).  VItE/flax/salt.  Strictly drylotted.  Feet are the same as always.  I dont know what changed to cause this insulin surge.  Is 8yrs old too young for PPID?  What do I do, stop the cubes and just feed soaked hay?  The max ESC + starch he's getting is in the cubes (the hay was analyzed and is soaked).  ARGhhhhh!!! 

Please bear with me.  I'm just venting....so right now my 21yo PPID/IR mare is the most stable horse I own.  Unbelievable!

Kerry in NY
Sept 2014


janieclougher@...
 

Gads, how frustrating!!!!!!  I don't have any answers for you - but I would try feeding the soaked hay (Temporary Emergency Diet) for a week and see if it helps.  Is there any chance he is getting fed some verboten foods - apples, carrots etc?

Phooey!

Jaini (BVSc),Merlin,Maggie,Gypsy
BC 09
ECIR mod/support
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---In EquineCushings@..., <kerry.isherwood@...> wrote :

Crap.  I get one IR stabillized and the other falls apart.  I have no idea why, but now my 8yo gelding's insulin is 70uU/mL, the highest its ever been.  I just dont understand....



Kerry in NY
Sept 2014


ThePitchforkPrincess@...
 

Hi Kerry,
You asked if 8 years old is too young for PPID?  The answer is no.  In the Pergolide Dosage Database, there is an Age of Diagnosis Chart (use the Database Statistics link in the Database then scroll down).

In that chart it shows 5 equines who were diagnosed at the age of 8 and under.  

two were aged 6, one was 7 and two more were 8.   

Perhaps the other volunteers may remember other IR horses on tight diets that needed extremely low sugar/starch feed.  

Yes do update the case history -  you - or the volunteers- may find a clue to help bring down that insulin.  
Hang in there Kerry!  

- ​LeeAnne, Newmarket, Ontario

ECIR Archivist 03/2004

 

Are you in the Pergolide Dosage Database?

​​
   
View the Database Stats 
Taken For Granite Art - Lightweight Cement Sculpture and Memorials



Kerry Isherwood
 

Wow, that young for PPID? Incredible. I did an ACTH last fall at IR diagnosis (mid-teens, # not in front of me). Guess ill do another. Why the heck not? Ive alway got a package on its way to Cornell for my mare's ongoing bloodwork ;)

Thx for that info. I forget the database is there. Excellent reference

My gelding had moderate front pulses last night but was only slightly tender on tight circles. Going out now to scalp the fencelines again with the weed-whacker just so i feel like im doing something. CH almost finished, just have to proof it.

Thx so much
Kerry


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Don't forget we're also in peak tick season.  Lyme is the most well known of tick borne infections but likely only the tip of the iceberg.  Infection of any sort will worsen IR.  Could check a CBC, maybe SPEP too, for any signs of infection.

Eleanor in PA
www.drkellon.com
EC Co-owner
Feb 2001



ThePitchforkPrincess@...
 


LOL Yes that young.  I'll pick your jaw up from where mine fell when I first saw that too!

I've cleaned up your case history folders.  You now have one folder with two sub-folders for your two horses.  This was done to cut down on the need for having your hay analysis posted in two different folders.  This way any documents about the individual horses can go in their individual sub- folders and documents that apply to both can be in the Kerry Isherwood folder.  

Your link is 


- ​LeeAnne, Newmarket, Ontario

ECIR Archivist 03/2004

 

Are you in the Pergolide Dosage Database?

​​
   
View the Database Stats 

Taken For Granite Art - Lightweight Cement Sculpture and Memorials 




Kerry Isherwood
 

Is SPEP aka Chemistry?

I have fresh serum in freezer to send out on Monday for iron et al at KSU. Ill also draw & send for

CBC/Chem(?)
Lyme titers
Ehrlichia (?) my local vets idea
ACTH
& the iron

Anything else?

Kerry in NY


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 




SPEP = serum protein electrophoresis.  The lab that does your CBC and chem should be able to do it.

Eleanor in PA
www.drkellon.com
EC Co-owner
Feb 2001



paulah@...
 




---In EquineCushings@..., <kerry.isherwood@...> wrote :

Crap.  I get one IR stabillized and the other falls apart.  I have no idea why, but now my 8yo gelding's insulin is 70uU/mL, the highest its ever been.  I just dont understand....


Kerry in NY
Sept 2014

Hi Kerry,
I know exactly how you feel... I focus on one, start to feel smug and the other one starts to slip...
Hang in there, you are doing great and you will get it under control.
Regardless of what's driving the high insulin, soaking hay for an hour in cold water would be the first thing I would do.  The ODBT cubes are under 10%, but may be too high for your boy, with whatever is going on at the moment.  You know his out of control symptoms, so you'll be able to tell when he starts feeling better, calmer and more like himself.
Great that you are venting your frustration on the grass.  If he can reach it at all and you've been getting the strange weather we have, it may be adding to his misery.  After you scalp it, you may find it helpful to treat it with the vinegar, salt and soap solution, known at my farm as  "Dawn vinaigrette" (1 gal vinegar, 1c salt and a squirt of dish soap).
Good luck and post what you figure out.  It really helps to learn from each other.
Best regards,

Paula with Cory (IR) and Onyx (IR) in Bucks County, PA, USA

EC 2014     NCRplus2011  

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Kerry Isherwood
 

Thanks everybody! Mercifully his pulses are much better tonight, almost normal. He's doing the same thing my mare did when on the Emergency diet--it appears the weight is dramatically & very rapidly melting off of him. He looks 50# lighter in only 24 hrs and his skin & body "feel" different when i groom him. Hard to explain. But makes me think the something in his diet was too high in the sense that now that the offender has been removed, he's experiencing a major metabolic shift of some kind. Something has triggered his body to rapidly transform itself. Maybe Im just crazy from lack of sleep....but to have two horses do this...idk, food for thought. But after some very needed sleep

Thx to everyone, as always,
Kerry in NY
Sept 2014


paulah@...
 


Hi Kerry,
Trust yourself!
I had the same impressions with my highly IR young horse when I started soaking his hay.  It seemed like his whole body was a little swollen when his insulin was high, and reducing the sugar relieved the swelling very quickly.  Cory can't even handle a 7.8% ESC + starch hay, so he is on 6% or soaked hay.  Otherwise, the behavior issues start, the heat starts to creep into his feet, etc.  He gets the balanced hay cubes only as muzzle treats in small amounts.
Glad your boy is feeling better!

Paula with Cory (IR) and Onyx (IR) in Bucks County, PA, USA

EC 2014     NCRplus2011   


---In EquineCushings@..., <kerry.isherwood@...> wrote :

 his skin & body "feel" different when i groom him. Hard to explain. But makes me think the something in his diet was too high in the sense that now that the offender has been removed, he's experiencing a major metabolic shift of some kind.
Thx to everyone, as always,
Kerry in NY
Sept 2014