giving a fig newton to IR horse


lj friedman
 

Jesse now refuses the IR treats that I put his prascend in..   he used to eat them readily.. ( flax, unsweet apple sauce, cinammon) So, I need something to give his prascend each day.  I can easily take a handful of timothy pellets and wet them a bit.. It is a bit of a hassle.. can a fig newton be offered without upsetting things like insulin, glucose?  etc  I gave him 2 as a test today and he ate them readily. .  lj friedman san diego nov 2014


corrine haffner
 

Hi LJ 

Don't think i'd be using fig newtons they are loaded with sugar. I use sugar free mints crushed up put pergolide in it and jasper eats it up. 

My guess is the high sugar could effect insulin,so better to be safe then sorry,ask me how i know...


Corrine & Jasper
MN 4/2014


Sheri Becker
 

" I can easily take a handful of timothy pellets and wet them a bit.. It is a bit of a hassle"
 
More of a hassle than treating and dealing with a laminitis attack? I wish the horse I had on pergolide( at the time Prascend was out) would have been that easy to get to take his meds..
Sheri in PA member since 2006/07


Kerry Isherwood
 

...."I can easily take a handful of timothy pellets and wet them a bit.. It is a bit of a hassle.. "....

LJ, consider yourself lucky that your guy will still take the tablet(s) in foodstuffs *at all* -- my mare is so suspicious of anything from my hands bc of the so-called "poisoned" hollowed out carrot w Prascend tablet that I once gave her, that she still will not take a (safe) naked treat from me, ever. If i put said treat on ground or in her bucket -- she willingly eats it. But no way is she taking that chance again, and will likely take that grudge to her grave (the original insult occurred in Oct, 2014). So now Prascend dosing requires two syringes each morning, and some fussing and lip curling, but a tenuous agreement has been reached between us, thankfully.
I dont think fig newtons are a good idea. Stick with your wet pellets for now to be safe.

Kerry in NY
Sept 2014


Kathy Brinkerhoff
 

Lj,

 

My horse, Bailey, often goes "off" his Prascend carrier.  I use a small piece of banana as a "pill pocket"  When he refuses to eat it I change it up for a few days.....hollow out a carrot....put a piece of carrot or teeny piece of apple on the banana/Prascend.  Then I try again and he is fine with the plain banana for weeks.

 

Rather than guessing what might work as a pill carrier and worse yet just experimenting to see if there is a problem with feeding it,  here is a link to a nutrition data site.  I couldn't find fig newton cookies on here, but I did find fig bars, raw figs, dried figs.  I then googled fig newton and got an ingredient and analysis which is probably the same info on your Fig Newton package......so easy to find.  You asked about feeding one fig newton, but fed two?!  I think if you look at the ingredients/analysis you will agree that was not a good choice.   I agree with Sheri who pointed out that laminitis is much more of a hassle than feeding wet timothy pellets or doing a five minute search of a possible pill carrier/feed  for an IR/PPID horse.

 

http://nutritiondata.self.com/foods-fig000000000000000000000.html

 

http://www.foodfacts.com/ci/nutritionfacts/Snack-Foods/Fig-Newtons-Cookies--oz/57057

 

 

The fact that you posted here and asked about using the cookie after I assume you read the label on the package tells me that based on taking the NRC + Course, IR/PPID Course and being an active member on this board who has access to the files and archives that something about feeding fig newton cookies raised a red flag.   Follow your instincts and do a search first before feeding.

 

 

Kathy Brinkerhoff

 

SE/WI. 10/12

 




Nancy C
 

Hi LJ and all,

A great resource for finding out how bad or good a food is, especially human foods, is nutritiondata.com.

Using USDA figures, this independent web site allows you to see carbs, proteins, omegas, minerals and more.

Here's the link to Fig cookies showing 7 grams of sugar

Nutrition Facts and Analysis for Cookies, fig bars

 


Googling Fig Newtons came up with similar sugar content.

http://www.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/fig-newtons/fig-newton

Package labels will give you same info.

 

Using nutritiondata.com to compare foods recommended here is helpful too. One recommendation, a single grape, hiding the pill would have less than one gram of sugar.

You could maybe cut the fig newton in half or thirds and get two - four grams of sugar, however how he would react to this would take monitoring.


Nancy C in NH
ECIR Group Moderator 2003

The nutrient content of the bulk of the equine diet — pasture and hay — is often not considered. The 2015 NO Laminitis! Conference will explore the benefits of forage analysis and mineral balancing. 2015 Conference Schedule

 




Sharon Manning
 

After many years of trying everything that has been thought of,except this one idea, I syringed her pergolide in her dear picky mouth as easy as pie. I added a couple drops of liquid stevia just for my benefit in case the drug is bitter. Why oh why have I not done this before?? Gezzz I am as stubborn as she! How easy! Even if she starts to refuse this new way I have no qualms halterning her and giving it. Right now I just take her chin in my left hand and standing on her right, with my right hand, into the side of her mouth and up toward the back. two small pushes empties the small 12 cc syringe half full of her dissolved meds and the constant battle of trying to stay one step ahead of her constantly changing taste and moods is now over.
I think I have battle fatigue ... feeling slightly foolish I have not tried this before.
So all who has a picky eater, give it a go.
Sharon
2006

Sent from my iPhone
Please forgive any errors


lj friedman
 

Some posts showing how labs for insulin and glucose are unreliable, have caused me to question Jesse's severe IR status.  In the past, I'd allow him lots of grass and tons of grass, without incident.. I stopped this completely when his labs showed severe IR, glucose, etc.  So, could the labs be wrong as we read that a glucometer?( Kerrry? )  should be used on site as opposed to sending blood to the lab?  I've never heard of poor lab values when we test sugar for human blood.. Wondering why equine blood work is problematic with specific concern to diagnose for IR.  Jesse is clearly cushings and is doing poster great. I had a chiro to adjust him a few days ago and he remarked how he saw no evidence of disease of any kind .  lj friedman san diego nov 2014

ECHistory8

 




Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Lj,

If there is mishandling of the blood sample, the results will be artificially lower that what they really are, not higher. As Jesse is looking so good and doing so well now I wouldn't be inclined to loosen up on any part of his routine.

Lavinia, Dante, George Too and Peanut
Jan 05, RI
EC Support Team

>>>>>>>>>>>>>

ECHistory8

 




Nancy C
 

Just to add personal experience....

I often test with glucometer and, b/c I often get a Chemistry at th same time, receive glucose results there as well.

Except once where blood sat too long before going to glucometer, there has never been a huge difference in the readings;  2-3  points maybe, five at most.

Your mileage may vary.

Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Do you have a mare? Attend NO Lamintis! 2015 and learn about the special issues mares can have that drive Insulin Resistance and laminitis. Be sure to share this with your vet and tell him/her that vet professionals who attend get 13 hours RACE credit.

http://www.nolaminitis.org/…/progr…/2015-conference-schedule




Kerry Isherwood
 

....." his labs showed severe IR, glucose, etc.  So, could the labs be wrong as we read that a glucometer?( Kerrry? )  should be used on site as opposed to sending blood to the lab? ".....


>>> Hi LJ,
the above is not what I said.  I mentioned that I was using a veterinary glucometer for personal use bc I have a PPID/IR mare that has frequently high glucose, although commercial labs were reporting lower (aka high-normal) results on the same sample.  As I said, it is purely an experiment and should not be considered protocol for anyone, by any means.  Furthermore, theoretically it is in support of the exact *opposite* of what your theory is (that Jesse's glucose is falsely high and he's not truly IR -- that scenario is impossible, IMO). 


...."Wondering why equine blood work is problematic with specific concern to diagnose for IR."....

>>> The current tests are not problematic.  Mishandling of the blood tubes on occasion may yield falsely low blood glucose or insulin, which means the IR diagnosis is missed altogether.  Again, opposite of what you are surmising.

If Jesse looks and feels great, then by all means keep on doing exactly what you've been doing.  We should all be so lucky!  Furthermore, I'm not sure I would change what's working for Jesse based on the single observation of a chiropractor?  Do remember that while he/she may be a specialist in one area of equine health, it is unlikely that he/she is also an expert in the vast intricacies of veterinary endocrinology. 

If you take nothing away from this fig newton thread it should be this:  do not change what is working!

Best of luck,
Kerry in NY
Sept 2014

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Kerry%20Isherwood%20/Tofurky/
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/echistory8/files/Kerry%20Isherwood%20/Pinky/  (old version)


paulah@...
 




---In EquineCushings@..., <lj_friedman@...> wrote :

 I had a chiro to adjust him a few days ago and he remarked how he saw no evidence of disease of any kind .  lj friedman san diego nov 2014

Hi LJ,
When a professional looks at your EC and/or IR horse and says he looks healthy, it's confirmation that you are doing a great job keeping him healthy. 
It's a lot of work to take care of these guys and when you get it right, there is no applause, just a lovely comfortable horse to enjoy.
Keep up the good work!  So nice to hear how well Jesse is doing.
-Paula, Onyx and Cory
in Bucks County, PA
2014


lj friedman
 

thanks for your reply,, I dropped my fig newton and now use the timothy pellets.for his meds. 
Jesse doesnt move around much when on his own, But when I turn him out in a very large fenced arena with no grass, he canters around as he chases the  motorized food cart scooter. as the scooter is feeding the horses. . very cute to see how this horse moves when food is involved.

lj friedman san diego nov 2014.