TC 30% Analysis Follow Up


Kathy Brinkerhoff
 

Hi All,

I called and spoke with Jessica at Triple Crown Feeds this morning.  TC is currently in the process of updating their site.  The 3% Protein for TC 30% was a typo and has been corrected to 30%.  Iodine is not on the Guaranteed Analysis, but she said it runs around 4.3 ppm or 2.0 mg as was reported on my "old" analysis.  

I asked about the ESC + Starch and was directed to the NSC button on the right hand side of the page.  Products are listed in NSC and ESC + Starch and if you read at the bottom of the page TC describes (as do other feed producers) that batches/lots can vary somewhat from analysis to analysis.

http://www.triplecrownfeed.com/products/30-ration-balancer/

Kathy Brinkerhoff

SE/WI  10/12


Nancy C
 

I know you probably know this Kathy but for others following...

All Triple Crown Feeds have fixed ingredient formulas, values reflect an average analysis of multiple feed samples.

When queried, it has never been clear how often this has been updated.  We have had a few members who have test TC Lite especially and found the starch much higher. Some discussion in the archives I believe.

The TC 30 would be way too high for an IR horse.

In the main, I support Triple Crown.  Just want to give folks a place to check for answers if things aren't going the way they had hoped.
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
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Kathy Brinkerhoff
 

Hi Nancy,

I would appreciate clarification... are you saying TC 30% is not approved by the ECIR Board/Dr. Kellon for IR horses at 1#?

Thank you,

Kathy Brinkerhoff

SE/WI  10/12




Nancy C
 

No.  I am saying members have tested TC products and found them to be sometime significantly higher in starch than listed on the web site averages. When they removed this they saw improvement.

To get back to the original thread: a member  who was not feeding hay and was worried about iron content. Suggested she remove the TC 30 and TC Senior both of which add complexed iron and ferrous sulfate to lower intake of iron, and go strictly with ODTB Cubes.

Like I also said, I like TC in general.  Much more than many other bagged feeds out there.
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
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Nancy C
 

Sorry...too many balls in the air. Just re-read what I said.  The TC 30 may be too high for very sensitive horses.

Already spoke about the iron.

And let me say again.....

In the main, I support Triple Crown.  Just want to give folks a place to check for answers if things aren't going the way they had hoped.
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
ecirhorse.org



LeeAnne Bloye <ecir.archives@...>
 

On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 11:14 am, Nancy C wrote:
We have had a few members who have test TC Lite especially and found the starch much higher.

 Just want to give a link to the Analyses of Various Feeds folder in the files for those who may not be aware it is there. 

(Links to all folders can be found in the File Folder Map located in the wiki.)

--

- ​LeeAnne, Newmarket, Ontario - Email me (If link does't work use ECIR.Archives at gmail dot com)

ECIR Archivist 03/2004

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View the Database Stats
Dawn's 10 Year Case History
Taken For Granite Art - Lightweight Cement Sculpture and Memorials


Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

"I am saying members have tested TC products and found them to be sometime significantly higher in starch than listed on the web site averages"

______

There is a recent analysis (9/2016) for TC 30% in the Analysis of Various Feeds File that illustrates this point well:

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/9c%20Analyses%20of%20Various%20Feeds/Triple%20Crown%20Products/Triple%20Crown%2030%20Percent.pdf

Here is TC's current guaranteed analysis on the website:

http://www.triplecrownfeed.com/products/30-ration-balancer/

And here is the breakdown comparison of their various feeds, with the coefficients of variation given:

http://www.triplecrownfeed.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/CarbohydrateValuesofTripleCrownHorseFeeds.pdf

Should also note the iron in the guaranteed analysis is 750ppm. The analysis in the files (from Sept, 2016) has iron of 1620ppm.
--
Lavinia, Dante and George Too

Nappi, George, Peanut over the Bridge

Jan 05, RI

EC Support Team


Pam Hansen <hansenshorses@...>
 

I feed TC 30. If I switch feeds what ration balancer works for IR horses?

--
Clifford and Pamela Hansen
NW Wisconsin

My favorite trail is the next one!


 

If TC lite starch is higher than listed, what low starch feed would be acceptable?  I cannot get OTBC cubes or Nuzu with out ordering pallets at a time.  I can get LMF stage one about 50 miles away but do-able.  The only other sold in the area is Wellsolve which I wont use.  I only need up to 1/2 lb in the beet pulp for taste.  I have been using the TC Lite as it is easily available locally, but Dance is still struggling a bit and the diet is tight except for this variable as I was using the numbers provided by TC.  With the revelation that the member tests show higher numbers, this may be where the diet is no longer "tight". 

--
Debora, Montana 

CIR0113/0615

NRC+1112

MPG 0911

NAT


Lorna Cane
 

Debora,have you tried contacting Aurelio and/or Randy about getting their products closer to you?

I know they are very willing to help if they can.


--

Lorna in Eastern Ontario,Canada
ECIR Moderator 2002


https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/PPID%20and%20IR%20Success%20Stories/Success%20Story%20%233%20-%20Lorna%20and%20Ollies%20Story.pdf



Nancy C
 

HI Pam.

You may already know that ration balancers don't balance.

Any of the TC products may work for your horse as a carrier for supplements.

In general r/s/r beet pulp is the lowest esc and starch, ODTB Cubes are also low ESC and starch.
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
ecirhorse.org



Nancy C
 

Hi Deb

If you are using as carrier for supplements I would up the beet pulp as  trial.


--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
Learn the facts about IR, PPID, equine nutrition, exercise and the foot.
www.ECIRhorse.org
Check out the FACTS on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ECIRGroup
Support the ECIR Group Inc., the nonprofit arm of the ECIR Group
ecirhorse.org



Paula Hancock
 

On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 07:25 am, layzdequineservices wrote:
 I only need up to 1/2 lb in the beet pulp for taste.  I have been using the TC Lite as it is easily available locally, but Dance is still struggling a bit and the diet is tight except for this variable as I was using the numbers provided by TC.  With the revelation that the member tests show higher numbers, this may be where the diet is no longer "tight". 

 Hi Debora,

Is there a local feed mill you can check to see if they have distillers grains?  It is very low ESC + starch (<6% when I tested it).  My guys will eat almost anything mixed with a cup of it.  It smells like fresh baked bread.  It is what is left over after extracting the sugar out of the corn.


Paula with Cory (IR) and Onyx (IR)

Bucks County, PA, USA

ECIR Primary Response

NRCplus 2011  ECIR 2014 

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Paula%20and%20Cory

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=1624

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Paula%20and%20Onyx




larockj@...
 

Given the recent revelations about TC 30, I'm wondering if even a very small amount can make a horse footsore?

I've been feeding Mimi 1/3 cup twice a day as a taste tempter over the past four or five months.  It seems that around the same time we started it, she started getting ouchy on stone dust, especially if she hit a pebble.  She moves a lot better on soft ground, but is still a little choppy at the trot.  And although she will canter sometimes, it's not as often as before, and she's more likely to keep a fast trot than break into a canter.

I thought it might be lack of callouses, given our soft pasture and her being mostly confined in a small dry lot over the past year.  She goes out with a fully blocked muzzle twice a day, whereas prior to her PPID/IR diagnosis she was out 24X7 on four acres.

If it IS the TC 30, I'll be really bummed, since it's the only thing I've found that works to get her to eat her supplements!!  

FYI, her diet is otherwise tight and balanced to ECIR standards.  

Thanks,

Jessica & Mimi
NY June 2015
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jessica%20and%20Mimi


Paula Hancock
 

On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 04:43 pm, <larockj@...> wrote:
Given the recent revelations about TC 30, I'm wondering if even a very small amount can make a horse footsore?

 Hi Jessica,

It is possible, but 1/3 cup isn't very much.  If you haven't tested her ACTH, insulin and glucose recently, that would be good.  If the ACTH is increasing and not under good control, it could drive the insulin as well.  If you suspect the TC 30 (and it sounds like you do), you could try to find something safer for her.  Always a challenge!

Good luck!

Paula with Cory (IR) and Onyx (IR)

Bucks County, PA, USA

ECIR Primary Response

NRCplus 2011  ECIR 2014 

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Paula%20and%20Cory

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=1624

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Paula%20and%20Onyx




larockj@...
 

Hi Paula,

Thanks for your feedback. 

I'm waiting for blood test results now, since the vet was here Wednesday.  She started showing signs of seasonal rise about two weeks ago - early winter coat, increased urination/drinking. 

Luckily my vet is willing to increase her Prascend above the 1.5mg she's on now.  (I'll update CH once results are in.)  Aside from ouchiness, she'd been doing well and looking good all year.

I'm also slowly reducing the TC 30 to see how little I can get away with.

Cheers,

Jessica & Mimi
NY June 2015
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Jessica%20and%20Mimi