Couple of Questions


sunygirl06@...
 

I have 2 quick questions.

QUESTION #1
Sunny has been dx PPID/IR for 4 years now. Every year I feel like I am more on top of her symptoms, I feel like I am crazy/obsessively observant. 

-I have noticed last year and now again this year, around this time of year she starts standing in the mud. (I've seen her lay down a few times too, not sure if she just feels like laying down, but I think she may tender-footed.)
-She runs and flags her tail, but she not the nutty horse, she was in early spring.
-The gelding is pushing her around a little bit.
-She is eating well (she lost her appetite and weight slowly last summer, before I increased her pergolide in August)
-She is trimmed every 6 weeks by myself, (self educated by Pete's DVD series, for the past 5 years), and she was super-sound this winter and spring, and her trim hasn't changed

I am assuming the seasonal rise is causing this should I:

-recheck labs? (I was going to wait till July)
-increase her pergolide now?
-something else?

Is she going to feel "doggy" (as in mildly tender footed) every year at this time, even if her ACTH does come back controlled.

I've been increasing her pergolide by 1 mg (prasend equivalent) every year so far. I was kind of hoping to keep the same dose for longer than a year at a time! But she is my horse for giving lessons, so I'd prefer to keep her sound!!

QUESTION #2
Since taking the NRC plus course I would like to give her electrolytes on these hot, humid days we've had in WI. What do you give your horses, how much, and how do you decide when to give?

Thank you for your input.

--
Amber Lauer
September 2016, Black Creek, WI

Sunny Case History https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Amber%20and%20Sunny/Sunny%20Case%20History.pdf


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Amber,

So I feel like you might need a reminder that PPID is a condition that is managed by medication, but never goes away, so you really only need a diagnosis once to know that your horse has it.  IR is a condition that you also really only need to diagnosis once and then manage through diet with the helping aspects of trim and exercise.  For both you can then use repeated bloodwork to know that you are managing the conditions to the best of your ability.

For Sunny I don't see any updates for her glucose or insulin levels since 2017 so there's no way to know if you are managing her IR through her diet and the exercise she gets doing lessons.  The fact that she's standing on soft ground and you feel that she's tender footed every spring is a pretty good sign that she may need tighter management in this area, which could include being kept in a dry lot and/or being muzzled if she's turned out.  However, without actual numbers for her glucose and insulin levels that's a guess at best.  Were she mine that's where I would start, even before getting test results. This has nothing to do with the seasonal rise which effects ACTH beginning in August and continuing through the fall.  Increased ACTH can cause laminitis and increased insulin, but that would be seen mostly in the fall, not now. 

Were she mine I would have blood pulled for insulin, glucose and ACTH now so you can see if her ACTH is controlled on the current dose of pergolide.  If you wait to test her until September you may well find yourself 'chasing the rise' and that is a position you want to avoid if possible.  




sunygirl06@...
 

She is on a dry lot 24/7 with tested hay, balanced diet as recommended from an ECIR balancer. Thank you for your input, maybe her nibbling the grass growing through the edges of the fence are it (otherwise her area is complete dirt only) I will also schedule her bloodwork. I only got an ACTH last year. Thank you very much for your input, I will wait to increase her dose until I get her #'s back.

I will also update her case history. I did get a complete panel in 2018, and I have updated her case history since then- I wonder why I didn't put the #'s in????
--
Amber Lauer
September 2016, Black Creek, WI

Sunny Case History https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Amber%20and%20Sunny/Sunny%20Case%20History.pdf


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Amber,

It may not seem like much but depending on sensitivity and what her numbers are already the bit of grass could be enough to make her owwie but not enough to make her obviously full blown laminitic.  As far as updating the CH - I'm not even going to guess :-)




sunygirl06@...
 

Do you think that just eliminating this, she could bounce back pretty quick?

(I suppose you'll say that I'll have to observe and see, but just wondering what your experience is)

--
Amber Lauer
September 2016, Black Creek, WI

Sunny Case History https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Amber%20and%20Sunny/Sunny%20Case%20History.pdf


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Insulin usually drops quickly when diet is corrected. How soon the feet come around depends on trim and the degree of internal damage.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001