Purina Integrity SuperFibra


practicalmagic2001@...
 

I have been feeding 2 cups a day , and this pelletized feed is guaranteed max 10% sugar 

SuperFibra Integri-T is a unique and specialized feed. A market leader with a guaranteed 10% (max) sugar/ starch content (NSC - nonstructural carbohydrates). SuperFibra Integri-T is a complete feed designed to meet the special nutrient requirements of maintenance, exercising, breeding horses and yearlings that require a low sugar/starch diet. SuperFibra Integri-T is ideal for horses that “tie-up” and get excited after consuming grains, have a history of laminitis or Cushing’s disease or are insulin resistant. SuperFibra Integri-T is formulated with certified quality ingredients and is manufactured exclusively in our specialized and drug-free facility in Strathroy, Ontario. 


Guaranteed Analysis #35610 Platinum Protein 13.00% Fat 7.00% Fibre 25.00% Calcium 0.90% Phosphorus 0.55% Sodium 0.50% Vitamin A 6500 I.U./kg Vitamin D3 1200 I.U./kg Vitamin E 250 I.U./kg Selenium 0.40 ppm
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We have limited options for feeds in our area. Does this look like a viable option as a vehicle for meds and to keep her 
healthy?


Donna
Ontario, Canada
Joined Jul 2021
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Donna%20and%20Cherubs%20Dolly%20Madison
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=265892 




 
Edited

Hi, Donna.
I'm going to be really picky here, so I want to set out some details about this feed. Just fyi, there is no safe Purina feeds that we know of.

First, the "guarantee" that sugar+starch is 10% max means this feed could be 8% starch and 2% sugar, for example. Safe carriers should not have starch that is higher than 4%. So while this feed initially sounds okay, if may not be safe at all. Also, we don't really know what the guarantee is. Is it a "typical analysis"? Or is it a guaranteed analysis? Those are different things. Does the feed bag specify? Edited to add: the download has a guaranteed analysis of other nutrients like fat, but not sugar and starch.

Second, the fat content is 7%, and we aim for 4% or less. High fat is not suitable for a pony with EMS.

As a practical matter, 2 cups may be safe enough for an equine with well-controlled diet, insulin and exercise. For Dolly, however, given her pregnancy and concerning hooves, this feed is not worth taking a chance on.

Have you looked for Ontario Dehy Timothy Complete Cubes? Here's the list of safe feeds:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/5%20Core%20Diet/2.%20Safe%20Feeds/Safe%20Bagged%20Feeds.pdf 

RSR Beet Pulp is the safest carrier I know. After non molasses BP is rinsed, soaked in hot water for half and hour to an hour, and rinsed thoroughly, it has virtually no starch, very low sugar, virtually no fat, lots of digestible fiber, and good protein and calcium content.
An entire folder of information on BP: https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/9c%20Analyses%20of%20Various%20Feeds/1.%20Beet%20Pulp 
--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos


Lorna Cane
 

Hi Donna,

Cass has a great meesage about this product.

I just wanted to add that soy hull pellets are a good carrier,too.They just need to be moistened,not rinsed/soake/rinsed , andhave almost the same profile as beet pulp.
Your feed store should be able to supply them,or get them in for you.

--

Lorna  in Eastern  Ontario
2002
Check out FAQ : https://www.ecirhorse.org/FAQ.php


Daisy Shepherd
 

is there a brand of the soy hull pellets that you know is good. i live in western colorado .  thank you, daisy and tiko
--
-- 
Daisy, Tiko and Whisper
CO, April 2019
Case History:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Daisy%20and%20Tiko 
Photo Album: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=90099&p=Name,,,20,2,0,0


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Daisy,

Just contact the local feed mills and ask them if they sell soy hulls or soy hull pellets by the bag.




Mary Ann
 


--
Mary Ann & Rosie - Nova Scotia, Canada - Joined August 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=252134
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Mary%20Ann%20and%20Rosie
My vet recommended the Super Fibra Integri T for my PPID mare. I've mentioned about the extra fat and she wasn't concerned. Prior to starting her on the Purina (which I'm only giving her 1 cup daily), she was getting BP, alfalfa pellets and Mad Barn Amino Trace pellets and a small amount of ODTBC, which I've now stopped. I seem to be getting conflicting information between my vet and this group regarding her diet and the need for a follow-up blood test 30 days after increasing her dose. She spoke briefly over the phone and explained that the x-rays looked good, no sign of laminitis. She is concerned that my mare has to be sedated with Dorm gel for any needles and she feels that too much sedation is not good for her and may interfere with the ACTH levels and only wants to take the next blood sample in late fall. She feels no need to increase her dose to 3 mg at this time, due to fact she hasn't had a laminitis episode yet.


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Mary Ann,

Based on Rosie's last blood test I would want to be 100% sure her ACTH was controlled on her current dose of Prascend prior to the seasonal rise this year.  Given her numbers and her history of laminitis I would not be feeding her the Purina product nor alfalfa pellets.  I would continue to use the rinsed/soaked/rinsed beet pulp and ODTBC as a carrier for her minerals as needed. 

Your vet is correct that the administration of Dorm can have an effect on ACTH numbers but saying that there's no need to increase the dosage on a horse that has a reading that's almost 5x the upper limit is playing with fire IMO.  The goal of this group is NO laminitis and we prefer to be proactive rather than reactive.  At the end of the day you are Rosie's advocate, you are the one paying for her bloodwork and other associated care and the vet is providing you with a service.  We as a group have much more experience with PPID/IR/seasonal laminitis than the average vet so that's something to keep in mind as well.



Ann Conn
 

If I had chosen to follow veterinarian's advice instead of the recommendations of this group I firmly believe my horse would have died four or five years ago.
This was my personal experience, but my horse is still with me and I will continue to try to follow ECIR advice as well as I can.
They have been studying EMS and PPID longer and in more depth than absolutely anyone.
My personal opinion only.
Ann Conn
2016, central Texas


Kirsten Rasmussen
 

Hi Mary Ann,

Dr Kellon commented on Rosie's bloodwork in another message thread about high glucose.  I thought you should see what she had to say about Rosie's very low insulin and elevated glucose, which all 3 of Rosie's blood tests have shown (ie, this is not a lab error).

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/message/266612

Her insulin might never be elevated again because of damage to her pancreas, so it's unlikely she will get laminitis.  But if she is in pancreatic failure, the situation is very serious and worth having a second veterinary opinion on.  If your vet is not open to Dr Kellon's advise, then I'd advise searching out another veterinarian that has extensive experience with metabolic conditions in horses.

--
Kirsten - Shaku (IR) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History
Shaku's Photo Album


lamarleau@...
 

Hello Donna

My guy did not do well on purina integri-t, I switched him to timothy pellets from Semican.  Analysis is 5.5 ESC + starch. I am in Quebec so you might be able to get this.
--
Francine & Magic in Quebec Nov 2020
Was a member 10 yrs ago with Shamy


Mary Ann
 

Sherry & Kristen,
I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place. My vet's clinic is the only clinic in my area with large animal vets. I would have to trailer her to the other side of my province to find another large animal vet and that is not an option for me at this time, so a second opinion is not likely to happen. She is VERY difficult to administer needles. She needs to be sedated. I've had all five of the horse vets at my clinic try to do it with only a twitch and she becomes uncontrollable to the point it is not safe for handler, vet or horse. We're getting too late into the summer to get a reliable reading now to see if increase in Prascend has brought her ACTH down. She is getting the small amount of alfalfa to help with stomach irritation from her 4mg every 3 days of Flunixin to control her eye pain and inflammation from her uveitis so I will not be discontinuing that. She gets only 1 cup per day. What is the issue with alfalfa that I should not feed it to her? She was on Omeprazole last year while receiving all her NSAIDS for her prolonged uveitis episode. I am discontinuing the Integri-T. I now have a new batch of hay that I need to test and I have not started to feed that, but the hay she is being fed now is last year's crop and well within the low WSC/NSC limits for a PPID horse. Her xrays look clean. I'm not sure if the negative plantar angle on her RH from last year is what you're referring to as laminitis, but that has since corrected with corrective trimming over the last year. I don't see any signs of laminitis in the other feet, unless I'm missing something and would gladly welcome a more experienced member point out to me what they see in her xrays in the other feet that indicate a previous laminitic episode. She is developing a lax suspensory in that RH and both my vet and farrier think that is the link to her developing the negative P angle in that foot and both believe it is related to her advanced age and the PPID. As for pancreatic breakdown and diabetes, what are my options for treatment? What should I be looking at on her blood panel to indicate these issues? 
--
Mary Ann & Rosie - Nova Scotia, Canada - Joined August 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=252134
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Mary%20Ann%20and%20Rosie


 

Hi Mary Ann,
If needles are the issue, I would just increase her Prascend without testing.  Aside from the numbers, hard to manage pastern dermatitis was always a sign my horse needed his pergolide increased. Her eyes might do better as well.  I don’t think it’s fair to stress her out unnecessarily.  I had a mare who was very needle averse.  Then we realized that if you floated her teeth first, she was relaxed enough for anything.
Alfalfa is not always a problem.  If you’ve been feeding it to her and she’s comfortable, it probably doesn’t bother her.  
--
Martha in Vermont
ECIR Group Primary Response
July 2012 
 
Logo (dec. 7/20/19), Tobit(EC) and Pumpkin, Handy and Silver (EC/IR)

Martha and Logo


 
 


Kirsten Rasmussen
 

Hi Mary Ann,

Rosie's very low insulin combined with glucose above the reference range is what you need to look at on her lab results.  This is abnormal and very likely due to the development of diabetes (similar to Type 2 diabetes in humans).  She also has uncontrolled PPID and diabetes is a late stage outcome of PPID.  If your current vet is not worried, a second opinion can be done online or over the phone.  You could contact Dr Kellon here, Dr Frank at Tufts, or any other veterinarian specially in in EMS/IR and PPID.

Diabetes can be treated with a strict diet that minimizes glucose (the same as the IR diet), and medications to increase insulin secretion and help get glucose into the cells so it can be metabolized for energy as well.  One of the authors below suggests feeding more fat but I'm not sure if that's the right thing to do.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3440056/#!po=73.8095
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20383993/

I'm not suggesting she had laminitis.  It's impossible to tell from the rads and photos of her right hind if she has in the past.

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History
Shaku's Photo Album


Mary Ann
 

Thank you Kristen. I've printed these links and will be calling to make an appointment to speak in person with my vet to discuss Rosie's case. And I will increase her Prascend starting tomorrow. 
At this late stage, her insulin/glucose may not be controlled or brought down to a normal level, but it's worth a try.


--
Mary Ann & Rosie - Nova Scotia, Canada - Joined August 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=252134
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Mary%20Ann%20and%20Rosie


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Donna,

In case you missed it, I would suggest checking the independent analysis of this feed that Mary Ann just posted (https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Mary%20Ann%20and%20Rosie/Hay%20Analysis/A_L%20Laboratories%20Canada%20-%20Hay%20analysis%20Aug%202021.pdf) - it's page 3 of the 5.  The important bits when it comes to why we don't always trust a "guaranteed" analysis:

Wet Chem results
Starch 8.42 
ESC (Simple Sugar) 3.5

That's not under 10% and with a horse that you know is IR I would not continue to feed this as it could well be contributing to foot issues.
--

Thanks,
Sherry and Scutch (and Scarlet over the bridge)
EC Primary Response

PA 2014

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Sherry%20and%20Scutch_Scarlet/Scutch%20Case%20History.pdf

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=78891