"Mad Barn" supplements - ok?


Gymah
 

I'm going to attempt finding a vitamin/ mineral supplement that my pony will eat. Are the Mad Barn supplements ok? Which one is best? Are they palatable? 

They offer the "Amino Trace+" which is apparently formulated for IR/ laminetic horses. https://madbarn.com/product/aminotrace/

They also have the "Omneity" which seems to be more palatable https://madbarn.com/product/omneity/

Any thoughts?
--
Helene A. in BC 2021
Photo album:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=271068


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

There  is no point in feeding any supplement if it doesn't match your dietary requirements. Get a hay analysis first.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Gymah
 

I will be getting some new hay in soon, which I will test (I'm just finishing up the last few bales I have -  no point just testing a handful of bales!). I'm just trying to get an idea of what supplements that are available in my area are safe for a laminitic pony. We also have the Hoffman's minerals here, but from what I understand, that is too high in iron?

For a carrier, my pony is getting molasseses-free beet pulp. I was wondering about switching her to timothy pellets instead, to lessen the amount of sugar/ iron levels?
--
Helene A. in BC 2021
Photo album:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=271068


Kirsten Rasmussen
 

Hi Helene,

Amino Trace+ is a much better option than Hoffman's.  If you want to feed it in the meantime it is better than nothing.

Without knowing your pony's history is hard to say if timothy pellets are going to be ok for her, BUT as a general rule we recommend avoiding hay pellets for IR/PPID equines because they are not tested and guaranteed to be safe.  Any pelleted feed will be higher in iron, too. The beet pulp, if rinsed-soaked-rinsed is a better choice, and it is actually very low in sugar, lower than timothy pellets.  You want to feed the minimum necessary to get supplements in, so that is a very small amount because it expands so much after soaking.  I've found about 1/3 to 2/3 cup (dry measure) is usually enough.  You could also try the Ontario Dehy Timothy Balance hay cubes, which ARE tested and guaranteed to be safe.  They are a bit hard to find but depending on your location you might have a nearby dealer.  The cubes can be soaked into a nice mash for adding supplements to.  Soy hull pellets are another safe option.

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR + PPID) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History
Shaku's Photo Album


Gymah
 

Where my pony is, they can't/ won't always rinse the beet pulp, which is why I was looking into alternatives. 

We only have the AlfalfaTec timothy pellets here. We used to be able to buy soy hull pellets too, but it seems like there is a supply shortage of those now and the stores haven't been selling them for months. 

If the beetpulp can't be rinsed, is it (the molasseses-free version) still better than timothy pellets?
--
Helene A. in BC 2021
Photo album:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=271068


Sherry Morse
 

Helene,

If there's a refrigerator at the barn you can rinse/soak/rinse at home and make up bags to store at the barn.  Some of our members (they'll perhaps chime in) do batches of beet pulp at once so it's not a daily task and store it in gallon plastic bags. If you're a member of the horsekeeping group doing a search over there will probably bring up more options than you've even begun to thought of to get the beet pulp taken care of in as painless a way as possible.




Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

The beet pulp is at least more likely to always have safe carb levels.  Anything pelletized can be very high in iron from contamination.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


maed@...
 

Hi Dr. Kellon, 
     I too am having trouble trying to figure out what to feed and where I board they also can’t do the traditional beet pulp.  I have a hay analysis, but am lost where to go from there.  
--
Mary E in Wi 2021


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

If you are willing to use Uckele products  I will balance for free. Send the hay analysis to drkellon "at" gmail.com. Will they feed her a special feed as carrier if you provide it?
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Gymah
 

Thank you!
Ideally, I'd like to be able to get the product locally (just so it's easier/ I don't have to worry about it getting delayed in shipping).

I think most other carrier feeds would be fine - it's just the double rinsing the beetpulp that is too time consuming/ finicky. We are very limited in the type of products that are available here (really anywhere in Canada. We don't have nearly the same selection as the US).
--
Helene A. in BC 2021
Photo album:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=271068
Case history:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Helene%20and%20Rosie


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Helene,

If you have somebody balance the hay for you usually they will tell you what you need to buy and you can purchase locally, it's probably not going to be a commercial product you buy off the shelf (unless you're lucky and you can buy a base and then add to it as needed). The list of balancers is in our files here: https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/6%20Diet%20Balancing/HAY%20BALANCING-1.pdf




Kirsten Rasmussen
 

Hi Helene,

Once you have your hay balanced by one of the recommended balancers Sherry linked you to, you can email Mad Barn and have them make you a custom granular formula.  Its more expensive than buying the raw ingredients and mixing it yourself, but it easy and I prefer that because you can also have extras added to the custom formula like methionine, lysine, biotin, etc so pretty much everything you feed is in one little scoop.  (you would still need to add ground flax, salt and vitamin E...they can put vitamin E in the custom mix, too, but I'd worry about how absorbable it is so I add it separately, too).  I have never had any delays with Mad Barn shipping to me, usually products are here within a week.  And shipping is free!  However, the custom formulas may take a little longer because they have to make them.  I believe the minimum size for a custom mix is 25 kg, and fed at 100g/day will last 250 days.

If you can't r/s/r the beet pulp, the next best option is to soak some Ontario Dehy Timothy Balance cubes (aka Triple Crown Timothy Balance Naturals cubes).  I know these are hard to source but 0.5 lbs (or about 2 cups) a day soaked in water for a few hours (or 'steamed' with boiling water poured over the cubes and a lid put on for 5 minutes), will double in size to produce a nice mash that your custom minerals will stick to.  Fed at 0.5 lbs/day, four 50 lb bags will last you 400 days.  So I buy a 1 year supply (4 bags) when I get the chance.  This year I am getting them from Vancouver Island but in the past I have got them from outside Edmonton.  I don't know where you are in BC but there's a couple possible sources in the lower mainland and on the Island listed in this thread.  Also, "Feed Store to your Door" outside Edmonton can ship them to you.

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR + PPID) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History
Shaku's Photo Album


maed@...
 

Sounds good!  And I think that if I can put the dry food or supplements in the baggies (or similar), so that they can just grab and go - that it’d work out just fine.  One thing is that he’s a little bit of a fussy eater.  
--
Mary E in Wi 2021


Melanie Pewe
 

I recently switched to MadBarn. I sent them my hay analysis as well as details about my horses feed. I am using Omneity but it isn't very palatable in my opinion. After 6 weeks I am only up to half the recommended amt and thats breaking it into two feedings!  I do have to add extra salt and phosphorus to bring the levels to an acceptable amt.

I'm trying to simplify life and buying 50# bags of magnesium and phoshorus  plus all the individual minerals that doubled in price it has become overwhelming.
--
Melanie
North Dakota 
2005?


Melanie Pewe
 

I suggest soaking and rinsing beet pulp, draining REALLY well and freezing portions in ziplock bags.  They can keep a LONG time this way and are in convenient amts for those who feed your horse/pony. You can store several days worth in a cooler or fridge at the barn too. 

--
Melanie
North Dakota 
2005?


Cheryl Oickle
 

The Ontario Dehy are often found at Buckerfields in Parksville BC on the Island.  Approx 50$ a bag


--
Cheryl and Jewel
Oct 2018
Port Alberni BC Canada
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cheryl%20and%20Jewel
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=81063


Kandace Krause
 

I am also boarding out for the winter and have made up the r/s/r beetpulp ahead of time and frozen it.  Baggies are easy to purchase but I found that reusing plastic 1.5 litre ice cream containers for the beetpulp made it easier for the barn to dump out into a feedpan to thaw.  I add my oil soaked Vitamin E into this before freezing.

I have also reused 2 cup (500ML) sour cream, yogurt etc containers for the dry minerals  and flax.  Or 1 cup (250 ML) for smaller amounts.  I asked on a community social network for people to save these containers for me and gathered up a few more than two weeks worth and premade up my feed and supplements so I knew that K was getting only what I knew was safe.  As keeping stuff frozen in the winter here is no problem, I take it out to the barn about a weeks worth at a time and have it in a cooler in the unheated part of feed stores.  When it goes above freezing I will add a block or two of the cooler ice blocks in and probably take fewer containers.

I knew that the process was long and complicated for the barn staff to have to do and they appeciate it being pick and pour for my mare.  And I know she is being fed as per the guidelines here.

--
Kandace K
Rocky Mountains, Alberta, Oct 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Kandace%20J%20and%20K
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=259062


Gymah
 

I was able to find somewhere to get the Ontario Dehy timothy balance cubes! 
So even though this product also includes some beet pulp, it doesn't need to be rinsed? 
--
Helene A. in BC 2021
Photo album:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=271068
Case history:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Helene%20and%20Rosie


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

The cubes are only 10% beet pulp and we accommodate for that in the mineral balancing.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001