Fat and Insulin Resistance


Maria Duran
 

Good evening all,

May I ask for the study or article where the 4% fat as a maximum for IR horses comes from please? 

Thank you very much.

--
María Durán Navarro 
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain)

Plutón´s Case History
Plutón´s Photo Album
_._,_._,_


Nancy C
 

Hi Maria

I think the problem is that the safety of high fat feeding has not been studied. The ECIR recommendation for 4% fat or less in the diet comes from analysis of the equine's evolutionary diet. based primarily on forage would not be more than 4% fat.

More comments from Dr Kellon:

High fat diet safety in EMS has never been tested and is contraindicated in other species.

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/message/163420

Also, there are studies showing high fat worsens insulin response such as this one in our files.

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/5%20Core%20Diet/Fats/Fat%20%20and%20Glucose%20Tolerance.pdf

This post is Dr Kellon's explanation of the above study

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/message/163420

The fat data though is very significant. For years it has been claimed that high fat is good for IR in horses, despite solid data from other species to the contrary. This study shows that's not the case. We still need studies to determine the minimum level to have this effect, in both normal and IR horses.

Eleanor in PA

More comments concerning fat and IR here
https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/search?p=%252C%252C%252C20%252C0%252C0%252C0&q=posterid%3A58231+%22high+fat+diet%22


--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
ECIR Group Inc. President/Treasurer  2021-2022



Maria Duran
 

Hi Nancy,

Thank you very much for doing this research, sorry that I didn´t answer sooner, but I was traveling and couldn´t read the links before. 

From this I understand what I thought to be the case, that high fat is considered over 4% of the diet but not a given concentrate or formula even at a lets say 7% because this will not provide as much fat as it would the whole diet. I hope this is correct.

What confused me is the result of these studies Dr. K mentions in this article https://drkhorsesense.wordpress.com/2021/07/22/obesity-and-insulin-resistance/

"Lindase et al [2016] induced obesity in horses that already had moderately elevated insulin by feeding additional fat but the resultant 10% weight gain did not worsen insulin resistance.  Similarly, Bamford et al [2016] studied normal horses and induced obesity by feeding excess fat with or without a once daily high simple carbohydrate meal. Again, the weight gain did not result in insulin resistance in either group"

So I thought I would better ask to make sure I am not understanding wrong. 

Seems like a 13% or so of the diet is needed to worsen IR?

Thank you very much.
--
María Durán Navarro 
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain)

Plutón´s Case History
Plutón´s Photo Album
_._,_._,_


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

The Lindase study used normal horses, not IR.  The ceiling for IR horses is unknown but much lower levels than 13% of the diet have caused insulin resistance.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Maria Duran
 

Thanks a lot Dr. Kellon,

Maybe I understood it wrong when at Lindase study says that horses had already moderately elevated insulin. 

I thought that might mean there was some grade of IR.

So just to understand it, the problem is not a given high fat meal but the whole total intake per DM, correct? 

Otherwise we could not feed linseed.

Or does a high fat isolated meal have some effect in IR too?

Thank you.
--
María Durán Navarro 
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain)

Plutón´s Case History
Plutón´s Photo Album
_._,_._,_


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

In this  study, consumption of 240 mL/day of corn or rice bran oil lowered insulin sensitivity https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16230647/ and intravenous lipids causes IR that lasts a week.  Until there is more information specifically in IR horses I cannot recommend high fat feeding beyond a few ounces of flax.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Maria Duran
 

Thank you Dr. Kellon,

That is very helpful and gives a clear cut for fat feeding.


--
María Durán Navarro 
Dec 2017
Madrid (Spain)

Plutón´s Case History
Plutón´s Photo Album
_._,_._,_


Mialisa@...
 

I am interested in this topic because I have been giving the powdered vitamin E from KP. I read a reply on here that said that powdered forms of vitamin E needs to be given with fat. My pony's diets were balanced and Kathleen said not to add additional fat. As I had already bought the powdered 10lb. bucket I decided to use Olive Oil. They are getting and extra TBSP daily. I did not include this on the CH as I considered this temporary and a minimal addition. The ponies have not had any issues this winter other than thrush. Am I right that this amount is a minimal addition?
--
Rene` in WI 2021
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Rene%60%20and%20Isaac
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Rene%60%20and%20Joshua


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Yes, a tablespoon of fat is of no concern.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


 

If obesity does not cause IR then what does? I have 8 Arabians including three mother/child pairs and three individuals with the same sire (who is now deceased). Is there a genetic component? Should I anticipate IR developing in the offspring of IR mares? I am currently adjusting the diets of all of them but wonder if IR may develop anyway.
--
Susan H TX 2021


Sherry Morse
 

Genetics is definitely a factor in IR as is breed type - thrifty breeds are more likely to develop it.   Some reference reading for you:




 

Here’s another way of looking at it that might help.  Some people are more likely to burn in the sun.  It’s a genetic trait which more likely appears in those with less sun exposure in their ancestry, northern tribes.  People with this trait need to protect themselves more carefully from intense sun exposure.  If these guidelines are ignored, a painful sunburn will be the most likely result.  The details are different but the point is that neither of these susceptibilities is something you can alter but their negative after effects can be prevented with care.
--
Martha in Vermont
ECIR Group Primary Response
July 2012 
 
Logo (dec. 7/20/19), Tobit(EC) and Pumpkin, Handy and Silver (EC/IR)

Martha and Logo


 
 


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

There is very strong evidence that it is genetic.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001