Vitamin E


Valletta Lochridge
 

I’m considering switching from softgels to a powder such as Elevate or the My Best Horse product.  I feed ground flax and ground chia at the same time as the vitamin E.  Will the oil from the ground seeds be enough to metabolize the E or do I need to add another oil?  If so, what type of oil is most beneficial and has the best shelf life?  Thank you…

Valletta in CA
2012


 

Hi Valletta. You must mix powdered Vitamin E with oil so the powder is touching the oil.  Seeds won’t do. Any good quality oil is fine if it’s used quickly. My barn oil is used up and replaced every couple of weeks. I’ve used both olive oil and Coco Soya. I’m no expert on shelf life but don’t use oils that require refrigeration like flax seed oil. 
--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos


Lesley Bludworth
 



From: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io> on behalf of Valletta Lochridge <vallettaloch@...>
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 6:55 AM
To: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io>
Subject: [ECIR] Vitamin E
 
I’m considering switching from softgels to a powder such as Elevate or the My Best Horse product.  I feed ground flax and ground chia at the same time as the vitamin E.  Will the oil from the ground seeds be enough to metabolize the E or do I need to add another oil?  If so, what type of oil is most beneficial and has the best shelf life?  Thank you…

Valletta in CA
2012

--
Lesley Bludworth 
Phoenix, AZ
Sophie Case History 7/2022
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/SophieB%20Case%20History


Lesley Bludworth
 

Valletta,  My new vet recommended the Elevate WS (water soluble)  He said it is much better absorbed.  I haven't looked into this claim it but thinking about it.  Good to know about the powdered version as I am using smartpak vit e and omegas and its in a powderish form, Im hoping its sitting around in with the ground flax so it takes on some of the oil??   In humans, vit E is better absorbed with Vit C or at least if you have Parkinson's Vit E without the Vit C you don't see any benefit.   


From: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io> on behalf of Valletta Lochridge <vallettaloch@...>
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 6:55 AM
To: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io>
Subject: [ECIR] Vitamin E
 
I’m considering switching from softgels to a powder such as Elevate or the My Best Horse product.  I feed ground flax and ground chia at the same time as the vitamin E.  Will the oil from the ground seeds be enough to metabolize the E or do I need to add another oil?  If so, what type of oil is most beneficial and has the best shelf life?  Thank you…

Valletta in CA
2012

--
Lesley Bludworth 
Phoenix, AZ
Sophie Case History 7/2022
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/SophieB%20Case%20History


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Lesley,

Simply being next to ground flax is not going to help powdered Vitamin E be better absorbed.  Once again horses are not humans and the recommendation to take Vitamin E with Vitamin C does not apply to them.  This is a good general overview on Vitamin E but as always, note that it is in reference to normal horses, not those with IR and/or PPID. 

Personally I use Nano E and because my gelding is such a PIA he gets dosed with it on a daily basis.




Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 
Edited

Lesley,

Elevate WS is better absorbed than other dry forms but has not been tested against E in oil. Vitamin C has nothing to do with vitamin E absorption. Vitamin E is fat  soluble, C water soluble. Their absorption is totally different but they do complement each other once inside the body. I can assure you from experience that feeding powdered E with flax is not sufficient to get the fat effect. I've seen horses deteriorate rapidly when that was tried. If you want to use powder, you should mix it into an oil before adding to the feed.

To be absorbed, E has to "find" fat in the intestine then be acted on by bile acids before absorption. The intestinal tract is a huge place. Dissolving the E in oil before feeding is half the battle.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Valletta Lochridge
 

Thank you Dr K and all! Lots of great info so I can move forward with confidence. This group is just the best!

Valletta in CA
2012


Lesley Bludworth
 

Good to know! 
I did not see much difference with my mare when adding the vit e/omega smartpak so will be happy to try the fat option.  
My body is very sensitive to rancid oils and I have not found a human vit e capsule that isn't already rancid by the time I finish the bottle. 
Nano E...is that micronized? Does it have better stability/shelf life?

What is a PIA horse?


From: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io> on behalf of Eleanor Kellon, VMD <drkellon@...>
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 7:05:14 AM
To: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ECIR] Vitamin E
 
Lesley,

Elevate WS is better absorbed than other dry forms but has not been tested against E in oil. Vitamin C has nothing to do with vitamin E absorption. Vitamin E is fat  soluble, C water soluble. Their absorption is totally different but they do complement each other once inside the body. I can assume you from experience that feeding powdered E with flax is not sufficient to get the fat effect. I've seen horses deteriorate rapidly when that was tried. If you want to use powder, you should mix it into an oil before adding to the feed.

To be absorbed, E has to "find" fat in the intestine then be acted on by bile acids before absorption. The intestinal tract is a huge place. Dissolving the E in oil before feeding is half the battle.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


--
Lesley Bludworth 
Phoenix, AZ
Sophie Case History 7/2022
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/SophieB%20Case%20History


Sherry Morse
 

PIA - pain in the a** (as in everything needs to be syringed). Nano E, Elevate WS and Emcelle are all water soluble and in a liquid form.  Nano E is dosed for an IR horse at 8cc/day so I've never had a bottle long enough for it to go bad. 




Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

I'm very sensitive to rancid oils too! Most horses are as well. Here is the technical sheet for Nano E https://ker.com/wp-content/uploads/NANO-E_TechnicalReviewSheet_US.pdf . To me, the question isn't whether it is more available but whether the cost justifies using it. Unfortunately, we don't have formal research comparing forms like this with E dissolved in oil but in 40+ years I have never been disappointed with E in oil, like Liquid E https://www.uckele.com/liquid-e-pint.html . I should mention too that all the research on vitamin E requirements in horses has used d,l-alpha tocopherol.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Lesley Bludworth
 

Hahahaha! 
Yes, that may be the case here. I like syringing her inedibles tho, we have a nice conversation. She tells me how much she doesn't like it and I tell her I know but its good for and and it will help make her feel better ;)  She seems to appreciate the effort at least.
I just read lable of both Nano E and Elevate WS. 1 cc of elevate has 500 ml Vit E. 
The Nano E has polysorbate 80 in it.  
You can look up the gut issues and immune issues with polysorbates but especially polysorbate 80 it is implicated in inflammatory bowel disease.  Anything with carrageenan (a natural emulsifier) or polysorbate and I will get an ulcer.  I know horses are not people, even though Sophie says she is one, but mammal mucus membranes are very sensitive to emulsifiers.

From: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io> on behalf of Sherry Morse via groups.io <sherry_morse@...>
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 8:12:11 AM
To: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ECIR] Vitamin E
 
PIA - pain in the a** (as in everything needs to be syringed). Nano E, Elevate WS and Emcelle are all water soluble and in a liquid form.  Nano E is dosed for an IR horse at 8cc/day so I've never had a bottle long enough for it to go bad. 




--
Lesley Bludworth 
Phoenix, AZ
Sophie Case History 7/2022
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/SophieB%20Case%20History


Lolly Mindel
 

PIA =

Precious Innocent Adorable

--
Lolly Mindel in Dexter, Michigan joined 9/12/2018


Valletta Lochridge
 

The Liquid E sounds like it will work best for me. We have lots of 100+ degree weather here for about 3 months…. Would this solidify if I refrigerate? If so, maybe I can just keep it in the house.

Valletta in CA
2012


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

I don't think it would solidify in the refrigerator but never tried it! I'll try to find out.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 
Edited

Update: It will thicken but not solidify in the refrigerator. Because there is no water in it, it will not expand on thickening so you can use the same measurement.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Valletta Lochridge
 

Thanks Dr Kellon........ I'll give it a go when it arrives and let the group know.  Just thinking it might delay rancidification but chances are it will heat up significantly during transport.  Worth a try though!

Valletta in CA
2012

On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 6:17 AM Eleanor Kellon, VMD <drkellon@...> wrote:
I don't think it would solidify in the refrigerator but never tried it! I'll try to find out.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Carly
 

Would it work to use high dose human-grade Vit E oil capsules? Or do these still need mixing with another oil?
--
Carly Butler
Nottinghamshire, UK, 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Carly%20and%20Quest


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Carly,

Human grade Vitamin E capsules in oil is what many of our members use.




Valletta Lochridge
 

Yes, that's what I've been using for years and they've worked great but one of the boys decided to start spitting them out so I've been slicing them open and squeezing out the oil.  Thought I'd experiment with something new for him to avoid the inevitable slicing of digits!

Valletta in CA
2012

On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 8:33 AM Carly <carlywbutler@...> wrote:
Would it work to use high dose human-grade Vit E oil capsules? Or do these still need mixing with another oil?
--
Carly Butler
Nottinghamshire, UK, 2020
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Carly%20and%20Quest


 

Valletta, would scissors work better.  I’ve seen that some people snip an ‘X’ in the tip.

Also, we’re trying to remind people not to include previous posts in their texts.  It seems like an obvious thing to do if you’re posting via email but, since those posts are all gathered into one list, it ends up leaving readers to dig around for your signature which gets bumped to the end.  I don’t use email to post here so I’m not exactly sure how that option comes up but it’s been happening with numerous people recently.  Thanks!
--
Martha in Vermont
ECIR Group Primary Response
July 2012 
 
Logo (dec. 7/20/19), Tobit(EC) and Pumpkin, Handy and Silver (EC/IR)

Martha and Logo