Request for everyone using compounded pergolide


cathyjomitchell
 

Wedgewood pharmacist did check into it for me, but called me back and left message saying they do not share that information.
--
Cathy and Mikey (Arabian)  in MN
joined 2008


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Valetta,

This thread is getting too long and cumbersome. Please repost your question with another topic name.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001
The first step to wisdom is "I don't know."


Valletta Lochridge
 

I’ve noticed that there have been no responses to my post in this thread regarding Avril.  I’m curious as to thoughts/opinions of the pergolide experts in this group regarding the stability test cited by the pharmacist during our phone conversation.  I would love for someone who is knowledgeable to speak with him.  His name is Keith.

Valletta in CA
2012


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Cathy,

First of all, if you paid for expedited shipping her opinions are totally irrelevant. You should have gotten that. Again, the 180 days refers to the unopened parent drug, not the compounded capsules.  Pergolide is to be stored at or below 77 F according to data from the human drug.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001
The first step to wisdom is "I don't know."


cathyjomitchell
 

I have also been using Wedgewood and spoke to a pharmacist today. I had paid for expidited shipping, and then they shipped on FRiday, which means it's in the shipping system for 2 extra days, sort of defeating the idea of expidited shipping. So I called them to discuss. The pharmacist told me they have stability testing info but she would have to check with her regulatory department to see if they could send me that info. She also said they are not concerned about normal shipping times impacting the pergolide stability and routinely ship it around the country using standard delivery. She did say if it then spent a week in a hot mailbox (or something to that effect), there would be reason to be concerned about it's stability. And also said it should be good for 180 days stored at room temp. (I'm repeating what I was told to the best of my recollection)
 
--
Cathy and Mikey (Arabian)  in MN
joined 2008


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Hi Barbara,

So long story short the answer it no, they don't have any stability testing. That cost is greatly exaggerated.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001
The first step to wisdom is "I don't know."


Suzy Berkowitz
 

I also use mixlab for Scout’s compounded pergolide capsules. I pulled blood on Monday and am waiting for the ACTH and Insulin results from Cornell.


--
Suzy in Fl 2020
Scout Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Suzy%20and%20Scout
Scout Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=260915


Barbara Sollner-Webb
 

For ages we have been getting our horses' compounded pergolide from Thriving Pets (a compounder which this Equine Cushings group used to recommend) and we have always been pleased with their service and product.

When I called Ian ( the head-guy there) to ask whether they do stability testing, he said they of course do get each batch of pergolide tested initially (and it is always within 2% of the specified amount) but when he asked about testing the stability over time, their testing company said it would cost over $1000, so they didn't do the longer-term testing,

yours, Barbara (member since 2003?)


--
Barbara Sollner-Webb in Maryland 2010


Valeree Smith
 

Dawn,

I work for (2) vets.  I can ask our BI rep if he can provide stability testing.

There was a previous response from someone else from a manufacturer who apparently only shared that info directly with veterinarians.  Their reasoning didn't quite ring true with me.

Valeree/SoCal
09/03

From: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io> on behalf of celestinefarm <celestinefarm@...>
Sent: Thursday, September 29, 2022 6:40 AM
To: main@ECIR.groups.io <main@ECIR.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ECIR] Request for everyone using compounded pergolide
 
Interesting statement on BI website for Prascend.

--
Dawn Wagstaff and Tipperary   

Saline, MI  2003

Tipperary Case History

Juniper Case history: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Dawn%20and%20Juniper/Case%20history%20Juniper.pdf .


--
Valeree Smith
Southern CA
2003


Valletta Lochridge
 

Yesterday I spoke with a pharmacist named Keith at Avrio in AZ and I'd like to share my experience with the group in hopes that someone more knowledgeable than me (maybe one of our veterinarian members or pergolide pros) will speak with him about our concerns.

The temperatures where I live are similar to those in AZ so in warm months, I always ask for FedEx overnight, on ice and in a foil pouch which they pack in a cardboard box.  I have had no problems with delivery until yesterday.  My pergolide capsules arrived in a Fed Ex plastic envelope, foil pouch inside containing 3 small, thin "ice packs" (melted and way warmer than room temp), and my warm bottle of 30 pergolide capsules.  I was irate and called Avrio.  The tech told me that the pharmacist would return my call to address my concerns.

Keith called within 20 minutes.  He apologized profusely and told me that he had 21 capsules of my dosage and that it was being packed at that moment as Fed Ex waited at the door.  It would be rushed to me at no expense.  He would note in my file that I was due a credit for 9 capsules on my next order.  Problem solved........ now, on to the bigger questions!  I told him that I was a member of this group and we began discussing the quality control issue.  He told me that he had spoken with a veterinarian who is a member of this group about recent testing that was done.  The sample was on compounded pergolide (I specifically asked if it was the "raw material" and he said that it was compounded capsules).  The un-refrigerated sample was transported over 2 days to a lab for testing and the results showed that the potency was 98%.  This sounds great to me, but I know that I don't know enough to ask all of the questions needed.

Wondering if either the veterinarian who spoke with Keith a few days ago can share their discussion with him or if that person doesn't want to post, if another veterinarian can follow up with him.

I received my beautifully packed pergolide around 10 this morning.  I'm happy (until I learn that I shouldn't be!).

Valletta in CA  (I hope that my post is ok - I'm not sure how to 'trim.')
2012


Lorna Cane
 

Can't go there right now,Jen.

This is mine:

ISLAND PHARMACY, Shawnigan Lake, B.C.,
Email Kathryn : shawnigangirl@...
TOLL FREE: 1-877-743-6944. Ask for Kathryn

--
Lorna in Eastern Ontario
2002


celestinefarm
 

Interesting statement on BI website for Prascend.

--
Dawn Wagstaff and Tipperary   

Saline, MI  2003

Tipperary Case History

Juniper Case history: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Dawn%20and%20Juniper/Case%20history%20Juniper.pdf .


Jensmccabe
 

Lorna is this the one you use? http://www.islandpharmacy.ca/index.php?page=2

I’m currently using Wedgewood; waiting to see if I can get stability report. 


ty! 
--
Jen McCabe
Laytonsville, Maryland 
Joined 2022
+ Odin (2010 BLM Mustang Gelding - IR, dx 2022), Bella (2008 BLM Mustang Mare - PPID/Cushings dx 2000) + Fiki (2015 Arabian, ok so far!)
Odin and Bella Case Histories


Nancy C
 

We are able to share specific chemical batch data directly with your veterinarian.
I use Mix Lab.

I would follow up on this by requesting MixLab send this and providing the clinic fax number and/or email contact.  I might also add that I am making the request to save time for my very busy vet.

Deb, once I have notified my vet that the info is coming, I will do the same later today.

Thanks
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
ECIR Group Inc. President/Treasurer  2021-2022



Nancy C
 

Susan

It is unclear without a case history what exactly we are talking about.

I would be most concerned about only dosing to 2 mg.  We've shown time and again the EEG's 2 mg limit does not work for a lot horses. My gelding was at 5 mg Prescend without control, before I switched to compound.

--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
ECIR Group Inc. President/Treasurer  2021-2022



Lorna Cane
 

I wouldn't assume anything ,Susan. Here's contact info from our Files.

ISLAND PHARMACY, Shawnigan Lake, B.C.,
Email Kathryn : shawnigangirl@...
TOLL FREE: 1-877-743-6944. Ask for Kathryn

Best to get info right from them.I haven't had to order for several years,but I understood back then they were shipping to the US.
But....that was then.

--
Lorna in Eastern Ontario
2002


Susan Vaughan
 

Lorna - thanks.
I assume those of us in the US could not buy from Island?
And if we could - assume the transit time would be several days - (problematic with extreme temperatures?).
--
Susan Vaughan in Houston Texas
Member since 2004


Lorna Cane
 
Edited

Susan,and others worried about this.
For me Prascend would be way out of the question wrt expense. I had 7 of my herd of 9, requiring pergolide a number of years ago. And back then it was a big deal trying to find a pharmacy that would charge a reasonable price for the compounded drug.This was before Prascend came onto the market.
I found a great pharmacy,and was able to protect my guys even when their doses rose to 14+mg of the drug.This pharmacy(Island Pharmacy ,in B.C.) does test, AND provides results.(see out Files)
It's not a bad thing to be concerned, but bear in mind that hundreds, maybe thousands , of horses in this group have been successfully treated with compounded pergolide,for many years.This is borne out by test results.
I resent the scare tactics(unintentional I like to believe) that some professionals choose to use about compounded pergolide,especially when they have not done their homework.
Those of us with these compromised horses have enough on our plates,trying to protect them,without having to sort out fact from fiction,from those we depend on to help us  help them.

Thank goodness for this group and all the solid data it has amassed over the years,helping us to heal our horses,and keep them safe.

--
Lorna in Eastern Ontario
2002


 

At least there is this in the reply : 
“We are able to share specific chemical batch data directly with your veterinarian.” 

--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos


Susan Vaughan
 

About a month ago I called Wedgewood asking for info re: stability and potency of the capsules.
I'm pretty sure I spoke with a pharmacist.
IIRC I was told they take five samples from a batch and have them tested.
It that's true - how would that transfer to the capsules?
I buy 2mg capsules from WW.
I've done a lot of reading/ research and am having doubts compounded is the way to go.
FWIW my horse was dx'd by TRH Stim.
I have no idea what his dose should be.
This year's seasonal rise has been nerve wracking for me after what all happened a year ago at this time.
Our vet won't be Rx for more than 2 mg (per EEG).
He reluctantly agreed to Rx compounded but won't go above 2mg saying the caps are probably not the correct potency.
That my horse would be better off with Prascend and it's known potency.
One would think the compounding pharmacies want to keep our business.
Would regularly independently test to assure us and prove to vets the caps are - what ?  95% of what they are supposed to be.

--
Susan Vaughan in Houston Texas
Member since 2004