Allergies possible symptom of PPID?


Bonnie Eddy
 

I have a 13 year old Arab mare that has been plagued with chronic ulcers and has had seasonal allergies with hives for a couple of years now. This year starting in the fall, the hives have been really bad and have not been resolved even with dexamethazone, prednisolone, hydroxyzine, and currently finalizing an elimination diet. 

Could increased sensitivity to allergens be a symptom of PPID? No other signs. She has become an easy keeper and possibly become IR although she is on an IR diet.
I've spent many thousands treating everything and will eventually test her but need to wait right now.

Thank you,
--
Bonnie with Racham (over the rainbow) from Southern California, Nov/2016

Case History
Racham's Photos 
Ω 

 


 
Edited

Hi Bonnie,
I certainly noticed that my PPID gelding became more sensitive to things like tick bites when his ACTH became a bit elevated and I don’t think I’m alone here.  He also had other skin issues like pastern dermatitis which became much less apparent with increased pergolide.  His initial diagnosis came about when he was having recurrent ‘colics’ which were quickly relieved with cimetidine.  Once he started on pergolide, those painful episodes disappeared although I did occasionally treat him for ulcers when they became apparent through his choices of feed, most often in fall.
--
Martha in Vermont
ECIR Group Primary Response
July 2012 
 
Logo (dec. 7/20/19), Tobit(EC) and Pumpkin, Handy and Silver (EC/IR)

Martha and Logo


 
 


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

PPID changes the immune system so that it is more inflammatory. There is also some indirect evidence that EMS is associated with allergies, and that is  more likely at her age.

However, the corticosteroids should still resolve them - although they can come back when you stop. Is that what you meant?
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Chronic hives may actually be angioedema. I have no idea how common that is but we had an Arabian with it on this list and I know of two others also. Low dose anabolic steroids once a month can treat it.

Is your horse a chestnut?
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Bonnie Eddy
 

Hi Dr Kellon,
Yes, my horse is a Chestnut. Interesting,  what is the connection?

And yes, the hives came back each time after the course of dexamethasone and the prednisolone. 
I will research the angioedema and EMS, 

Thank you so much,
--
Bonnie with Racham (over the rainbow) from Southern California, Nov/2016

Case History
Racham's Photos 
Ω 

 


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

All the cases I know of were chestnuts and chestnuts are notorious for having skin issues. I'm sure there's a connection in the genetics but no one knows what it is.

Angioedema in horses is usually described as diffuse, plaque-like swellings rather than mimicing hives but if you check the human descriptions you'll find it. I suspected it in the first horse from biopsy findings that showed a reaction in the deeper layers of the skin. That doesn't happen with hives. The prolonged course (months to years) is also suspicious for something other than run of the mill hives.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Bonnie Eddy
 

Thank you Dr Kellon for the information.
Your statement "The prolonged course (months to years) is also suspicious for something other than run of the mill hives."
 
Where do I start trying to figure out why she is so impacted? The vets don't seem to have a clue, and don't seem to want to suggest how to find out.   They just want to treat hives. 
Thank you again,
--
Bonnie with Racham (over the rainbow) from Southern California, Nov/2016

Case History
Racham's Photos 
Ω 

 


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

You could ask for a full thickness skin biopsy that includes a hive and surrounding skin, or just ask if they would be willing to consider a complement mediated problem rather than histamine. If you e-mail me privately I can give you the name and contact info for one of the vets that has treated this with stanozolol.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Cindy Giovanetti
 

Dr. K.,

 

Is a monthly low dose anabolic steroid safe for a horse with EMS?

 

If so, please give specifics.  Oden is itchy year round, worst in summer, but it doesn’t disappear in winter.

 

Cindy

 

 

 

 


--
Cindy, Oden, and Eeyore, North Texas
On ECIR protocol since 2/19
https://www.facebook.com/LifeWithOden/
History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cindy%20and%20Oden
Photos:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=91125


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Yes, it is, but once you start you have to keep it up for life. I use 250 mg of compounded stanozolol. It's not a treatment for itchiness though.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Cindy Giovanetti
 

If it’s not for itchiness, what is it for?  I assume for allergies, and if the allergies are controlled, then the itching will be controlled? 

 

But if it doesn’t work and he’s still itchy, would I still have to keep giving it to him lest something internal gets worse?

 

Is this a shot I could learn to give myself?  My vet will not come out once a month.  He already thinks I’m high maintenance.

 

Cindy


--
Cindy, Oden, and Eeyore, North Texas
On ECIR protocol since 2/19
https://www.facebook.com/LifeWithOden/
History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cindy%20and%20Oden
Photos:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=91125


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

It's specifically for angioedema, which is not an allergy. Have you tried Spirulina and chondroitin?
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Cindy Giovanetti
 

Yes.  He’s been on Spirulina and chondroitin long term.

 

Cindy

 

 


--
Cindy, Oden, and Eeyore, North Texas
On ECIR protocol since 2/19
https://www.facebook.com/LifeWithOden/
History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cindy%20and%20Oden
Photos:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=91125


Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

You might want to try the Pentosan. It can't hurt anything.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001


Cindy Giovanetti
 

Can you tell me or give me a link to the protocol for Pentosan?  Is this shots or pills?  How much, how often?

 

Cindy


--
Cindy, Oden, and Eeyore, North Texas
On ECIR protocol since 2/19
https://www.facebook.com/LifeWithOden/
History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Cindy%20and%20Oden
Photos:  https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=91125


Sherry Morse
 

Hi Cindy,

Pentosan is an IM injection. We used to dose our 30+ year old every 3 - 4 weeks.  I don't recall his dose off the top of my head but we could tell when we were getting to the end of the effective period and he showed a difference in his comfort level within hours.




Lavinia Fiscaletti
 
Edited

Hi Cindy,

Pentosan is an injection. Here's  link to some info from Dr. Kellon:

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/message/254148

Here's a link to more info in the files:

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/Fly%20and%20Pest%20Control/THM%20SPECIAL%20REPORT%20-%20LYME,%20SWEET%20ITCH,%20HIVES.pdf

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR