Topics

arginin dose

hdavis
 

Hello,
My IR mare Storm is lame again and I am wondering if suffering from cold weather laminitis.  She is on 2 tsps of j herb twice a day along with tested hay and balanced mineral.  I was wondering if perhaps adding arginin might be helpful.  If so what would the dose be?  Thoughts and advice?

--
Heather
August 5, 2017, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

Riosa Case History
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Heather%20and%20Riosa

 Photos

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=8819&p=pcreated,,,20,2,0,0  .


Storm

Case History



photos

 
 

 



Nancy C
 

Hi Helen

It is usually aakg that is recommended with jiaogulan for winter laminitis. It can feed inflammation, so be aware of that. This doc that reviews all the details, dosage and contraindications, including the need for the foundational support of a tight diet. Dosing is to effect.

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/Pain%20Medication%20and%20Alternatives/Jiaogulan,%20Nitric%20Oxide%20Support,%20AAKG%20and%20Supps/AAKG%20Guidelines.pdf

I assume you have tried wrapping her legs and booting her feet with sox. Sometimes just that can point you in the right direction.

HTH
--
Nancy C in NH
ECIR Moderator 2003
ECIR Group Inc. President/Treasurer  2019-2020
Join us at the 2020 NO Laminitis! Conference, October 22 - 25, Harrisburg, PA

hdavis
 

Thanks Nancy.

so is AAKG the same thing as Arginine?  I saw on a recent thread that Dr. Kellon suggested  suggested adding arginine for a horse suffering from cold weather laminitis along with j herb.  Perhaps I am not understanding or confusing what was being suggested.

My horse is on a tight IR diet of tested hay, balanced mineral blend, filtered water and no access to pasture at all.  I also have her in wool socks and boots with legs wrapped but she still gets footy and has lameness.  


I did test her ACTH this spring and it tested that she was non PPID but I and suspicious they maybe she is pre PPID and thinking maybe a trial of pergolide might be the next steps.  But saw the message about adding in arginine and thought maybe I should try this first.  
--
Heather
August 5, 2017, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

Riosa Case History
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Heather%20and%20Riosa

 Photos

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=8819&p=pcreated,,,20,2,0,0  .


Storm

Case History



photos

 
 

 



Tara Smith
 

Any recommendation on how to keep soxs in boots dry ,how to we wrap in plastic bags ? Socks I have are a men's wool blend that pull half way to knee on my horse,but in the rain and snow do get wet ,then changing out very frequently  .Any ideas please to stay dry?What do you wrap with and is is warm and waterproof by chance,
Tara and Gavilon
Mass.  Nov 2017
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Tara%20and%20Gavilon

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=11449

Lorna Cane
 

Hi Tara,

I used to use shipping boots over everything. You can get weatherproof shipping boots,fleece-lined,with velcro closures, making them easy to use. Two pairs will leave one pair drying while other is in use....or 4 pairs if you're booting 4 feet.
--

Lorna Cane
Ontario, Canada
2002


 

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

AAKG is a form of arginine - arginine alpha-ketoglutarate.  It is the preferred form for DSLD horses because the alpha-ketoglutarate itself participates in tendon/ligament tissue collagen formation. It may work at lower dosages than straight arginine, but costs more.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com  2 for 1 course sale
EC Owner 2001

hdavis
 

Thanks Dr. Kellon for the explanation.  I spelled the product wrong as well which didn’t help lol.  Where would I find arginine in Canada?  Also what is the dose for the basic cheaper arginine?  I don’t think my mare suffers from DSLD.  Thanks!!
--
Heather
August 5, 2017, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

Riosa Case History
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Heather%20and%20Riosa

 Photos

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=8819&p=pcreated,,,20,2,0,0  .


Storm

Case History



photos

 
 

 



Lecia Martin
 

Hi Heather,  check out Canadian Protein,www.canadianprotein.com.  I buy my supplements from them, including Alcar, AAKG, spirulina and Glutamine.  Free shipping on orders over 100.00.
--
Lecia and Flyte
Alberta, Canada
Mar 2017
 

celestinefarm
 

Tara, 
I haven't used these, but I personally would try them if I find I end up needed to winter wrap a horse.  One thing I can suggest to everyone here is that having more than a decade here of experience, on many occasions, if I had gone to something well made commercially first instead of trying all the home made items , I would have saved money and not put my horse through situations unnecessarily. I know these are expensive, but in reality, trying to wrap plastic wrap or bags is not going to stay on and has a real risk of causing tendon damage if (actually when) they drop down into a rope around the horse's fetlock or leg.  Considering a pair is less than a pair of hoof boots, I would certainly recommend trying these. Sox for Horses has a lot of satisfied customers and they specialize in summer and winter leg warmers and protection for horses. Click on the site and then click on Winter Wellies.

https://soxforhorses.com/

--
Dawn Wagstaff and Tipperary   

Saline, MI  2003

Tipperary Case History

Juniper Case history: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Dawn%20and%20Juniper/Case%20history%20Juniper.pdf .

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

The arginine dose with J to support peripheral vasodilation is 5 to 10 grams, 2 to 4 times a day for an average size horse.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com  2 for 1 course sale
EC Owner 2001

Bobbie Day
 

I bought two pair of these socks, (sox 😊) Desi is pretty short so I actually cut them in half so she has extras (always a pair in the wash), I also took Dr.K’s advice and bought her a pair of shipping boots (wraps). They are on when it’s really cold otherwise she has her socks on with felt padding in her boots. I’ve noticed with the shipping ones they really help with anything entering her boots from the top.
I bought a pair from riding warehouse for about thirty dollars and got four boots.
They stay on her and are really soft, I also have wool socks I put on her on occasion.
Bobbie


--
Bobbie and Desi
Utah, Nov 2018

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Bobbie%20and%20Desi

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=78821

hdavis
 

Thanks so much for all the info everyone!  I ordered the arginine today and will give it a try.  How long does it take to get into the system and when can I expect to look for some results?  Just wondering as I also spoke to my vet about doing a pergolide trial as well if she doesn’t get any better.  
--
Heather
August 5, 2017, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

Riosa Case History
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Heather%20and%20Riosa

 Photos

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=8819&p=pcreated,,,20,2,0,0  .


Storm

Case History



photos

 
 

 



Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

If circulation is the issue, when the J and arginine doses are correct, by gum and tongue color, you see results in a day or two.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com  2 for 1 course sale
EC Owner 2001