Date
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First hay analysis of Teff
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Please help. I just uploaded the hay analysis to Solo's case history.
I am looking for some interpretation of the numbers / percentages. The test is from a large quantity of hay purchased to hopefully last until Spring 23. Solo's hay has been, up until now, 8 lbs of Teff and 10 of Bermuda. We do not have a test for the Bermuda and probably won't. I have been soaking 80 percent of the hay he has been fed since September. I think from the Teff hay analysis, I might not need to be soaking it? Supplements: Solo has been getting Platinum GI (2 scoops as recommended) daily. Along with those supplements Solo has also been fed 2 lbs of Timothy Balance Cubes per day. I plan to enlist help on balancing Solo's diet However, since all this seems to take time I'm also looking for any short term things I can do to improve. I am also waiting for well water test results. We will be having more blood tests done on Dec 1st. At this point we are calling Solo IR. Thank you! -- Peggy J November, 2022 Vista, California Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/PeggyJ%20and%20Solo Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=278595 |
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Sherry Morse
Hi Peggy, According to your Case History Solo was somewhere between 125 and 225lbs overweight in September with an ideal body weight of 875. At that weight he should be eating no more than 17.5 pounds a day TOTAL - that includes hay and any concentrates. You indicate you're feeding him 20lbs a day including 2 lbs of Timothy Balance Cubes which are more calorie dense than hay. Is there some reason you have not cut his overall consumption back yet?
Thanks, Sherry and Scutch (and Scarlet over the bridge) EC Primary Response PA 2014 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Sherry%20and%20Scutch_Scarlet https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=78891 |
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Hi Peggy,
Based on the last blood test, you can say Solo is definitely IR/EMS. :) The teff hay is likely ok unsoaked because ESC+starch as fed/sampled = 6.1%, which is well below our 10% cut off. Until you get it mineral balanced I would continue at least rinse it well to remove excess iron in the form of dirt since that's fairly high. And, since you're having blood pulled in just a few days, I would continue to soak the hay until you get those results back. That will give you a baseline of how low his insulin is and it may give you a goid reason to continue soaking if it's still high. If you stop soaking hay, ideally you would check his insulin and glucose again after 1-2 weeks on his new diet of mineral-balanced and unsoaked hay. Nitrates are within the safe range so no need to worry about those. -- Kirsten and Shaku (EMS + PPID) and Snickers (EMS) - 2019 Kitimat, BC, Canada ECIR Group Moderator Shaku's Photo Album Snickers' Case History Snickers' Photo Album |
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Solo seemed to be loosing weight overly fast on 17.5 lbs so I increased the forage a little mid-October. He still looks like he is loosing weight but more slowly. He is getting exercise 5-6 times per week and is happy on the trail. He is running and bucking in his corral again. My thinking is to continue his current diet until we see his blood test results (soon). I am hoping to continue a slow reduction in his weight as time goes on. If he were to stop loosing then I will have to reduce the forage again.
Thank you for taking time to comment. -- Peggy J November, 2022 Vista, California Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/PeggyJ%20and%20Solo Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=278595 |
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Thanks for helping me understand the hay analysis better. I understand your suggestion to test Solo after stopping hay soaking and new mineral balancing of his diet. I'm happy to hear about the nitrate levels. So the iron content in the Teff is high? Or is iron in the dirt on the hay? Does the balancing of minerals in Solo's diet help to reduce iron in his system?
-- Peggy J November, 2022 Vista, California Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/PeggyJ%20and%20Solo Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=278595 |
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The iron is a bit high, likely from some dirt but it could be high in the hay, too. Rinsing the hay should reduce it a bit until you get your new minerals. It's not dangerously high, but it blocks absorption of zinc and copper so those need to be fed in appropriate amounts to compete with and help offset the high iron. Unbalanced diets high in iron cause bloodwork showing iron overload in EMS horses, which is associated with higher insulin. Mineral-balanced diets in EMS horses do not cause iron overload.
-- Kirsten and Shaku (EMS + PPID) and Snickers (EMS) - 2019 Kitimat, BC, Canada ECIR Group Moderator Shaku's Photo Album Snickers' Case History Snickers' Photo Album |
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Starshine Ranch
Kirsten, I have always found Teff hay to be high in iron... at least here in CA. Soaking it would help to alleviate the high iron?
-- Linda in Grass Valley, CA 2020 Midnight and Ostara https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Linda%20Midnight%20OStara |
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As long as your water is not acidic and high in iron (which can drive iron into the hay), soaking can leach out some iron within the hay. But the biggest benefit is just the 'washing', or rinsing of it to remove any iron in dust/dirt.
-- Kirsten and Shaku (EMS + PPID) and Snickers (EMS) - 2019 Kitimat, BC, Canada ECIR Group Moderator Shaku's Photo Album Snickers' Case History Snickers' Photo Album |
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I seem to recall also reading something about not soaking beyond an hour so that if the iron is in the form of dirt that it won’t leach into the hay during the soak? Or shaking it out before soaking? Is this ringing a bell for anyone?
-- Chris H in CA 2021 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Woody%20and%20Chris |
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Shaking will get rid of loose dirt so it's a good idea whether you soak or not. The time limit on soaking is more for bacterial growth. Surface iron will move into the hay if your soaking water is acidic.
-- Eleanor in PA www.drkellon.com |
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Thanks everyone for your input. I have reduced to 17.5 pounds total of forage (including the Triple Crown Timothy hay Balancer). I am awaiting a water test that hopefully will tell us the iron content and now understanding I need to know water's acidity as well.
Thank you! PS Solo just had bloodwork done again and we should know results in a few days. -- Peggy J September, 2022 Vista, California Case History: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/PeggyJ%20and%20Solo Photos: https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=278595 |
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Lori Ricigliano
Which lab is good to send the water to for testing ?
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=276519 |
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