Relevante - Question About Sweating


Lynn
 

Yesterday Relevante and I went on an early morning trail ride on our farm's 300-plus acres of trails. Six other horses from the farm went with us. Relevante led for the entire ride [approximately 1 hour and 30 minutes walking up and down hills]. I think it's a huge testament to Dr. Kellon, Lavinia, Nancy C and all of the other volunteers/members of the ECIR Group who have contributed to his case, that a 24-year-old PPID/IR horse was leading a group of healthy horses 7 to 18 years younger than him with ease.

My question - With this summer's rides, Relevante comes back soaked with sweat from ears to tail. He is not in distress or overly hot [I've checked him]. As soon as we get back I sponge bathe him with Miracle Groom Bath in a Bottle and buckets of tepid water [the hose only provides very cold well water that gets colder the longer it's on]. I chalked the sweating up to the warmer temps and his being out of shape. He has a white salt block in his feed bin and gets a T of salt 2 X a day in his supplement baggies. Should I be concerned about the amount of sweating and is there anything else I should be doing following a ride as part of his aftercare?
--
Lynn
Beavercreek, Ohio
March 2018
Relevante Case History
Relevante Photo Album

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Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Lynn,

Sounds like you've got a good handle on his reasons for sweating. Also, older horses in general, PPID horses in particular, don't regulate temperature as well as they did when they were younger. Checking for signs of distress like labored breathing, elevated heart rate that doesn't return to normal, lethargy is good. His salt intake is only 1 oz/per day at the current dosing (2tbs = 1ounce), which meets basic requirements at rest. As soon as he starts sweating he needs to have his salt intake increased to compensate for the losses in sweat.:

"in the dead of winter a horse needs at least 1 oz of salt (2
tablespoons) and should go through a 2 pound block or ball of salt in a month. In high
temperatures, with no work at all, that shoots up to 2, 3 or sometimes more ounces depending
on how much they sweat. With light sweating during exercise, the horse needs
another ounce of salt for every hour worked to replace the sodium lost or 1.25 ounces of salt
to make up the chloride losses. If sweating heavily, this goes up 4x higher."


More in the Files:

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/5%20Core%20Diet/3.%20Minerals/Salt%20and%20Iodine/Salt%20Measurement.pdf

https://ecir.groups.io/g/main/files/5%20Core%20Diet/3.%20Minerals/Salt%20and%20Iodine


You can hose him directly with the well water. Start on his legs and move up onto his body to acclimate him to the temp in case he is startled. Let the water sit on him a bit, then scrape off - it will have warmed to body temp by then, which means it's pulling the heat away from him, helping to cool him out. I always used plain white vinegar added to a bucket of water to sponge off with as it cuts sweat really well and the smell can sometimes deter the bugs for a bit. It's available everywhere and is really easy on the budget :)

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR


Lynn
 

Thanks for this Lavinia. I will move to the well water and start at the legs as you say ( he is not fond of cold water.)  The use of white vinegar is a great idea. I use that for so many different things. 

Okay....I have a really stupid question that I'm embarrassed to ask but here goes. Based on what I've read, to give him the correct amount of salt following a ride (I'm defining his sweat as heavy) am I multiplying 1.25 ounces by 4?  (I'm also basing it on 1 1/2 to 2-hour ride - we wouldn't go longer) And am I only giving this amount right after exertion? I plan to spray his hay. He hates syringing.
--
Lynn
Beavercreek, Ohio
March 2018
Relevante Case History
Relevante Photo Album

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Sherry Morse
 

Hi Lynn,

Unless you're going at endurance/CTR pace or doing a heavy workout it's an extra ounce of salt for every hour worked, not 4x as much.  For your 1.5 hour trail ride that's 1.5oz of salt.




Lynn
 

Thank you Sherry! Relevante will be thankful too....much easier to administer an extra 1.5 oz of salt.
--
Lynn
Beavercreek, Ohio
March 2018
Relevante Case History
Relevante Photo Album

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Bobbie Day
 

Lynn
Thats amazing that he is doing so well, you’ve taken great care of him during this journey, and how rewarding that your enjoying some trail rides again.
Great job to you both!

--

Bobbie and Maggie 
Desi (over the rainbow bridge 7/21) 
Utah, Nov 2018
NRC Plus 2020, NAT, C&IR March 2021
ECIR Group Primary Response 

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Bobbie%20and%20Maggie
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=271156

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Bobbie%20and%20Desi 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=78821


Lynn
 

Thanks Bobbie. It's truly been a team effort though, with me being a very small part of that team. Every time we ride we take all of you with us. And every time we come back from a trail ride it's a victory lap for all of us.
--
Lynn
Beavercreek, Ohio
March 2018
Relevante Case History
Relevante Photo Album

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Sherry Morse
 

LOL on the extra salt. If Relevante is like my kids he'd much prefer not so much salt.  When I dose mine for rides I mix it with kaolin so it's not so nasty but none of us is a fan.  

Would love it if you could get one of your fellow riders to get some pics or video of you with Relevante out on trail - this is such awesome news after the long haul you've had!




Lynn
 

Sherry! You were reading Relevante's mind on the salt intake...LOL....and mine on getting some video of us on the trail. I'm trying to put together a short little video in Vimeo that uses still shots to show what he and his feet looked like in 2018 at the time of diagnosis and end it with a short video of us today on the trail with him moving out. I've never done this before but Vimeo actually makes the process pretty straightforward. I'll make sure to get some video this Saturday when we ride.  We are expecting some rain this week but Friday and Saturday are supposed to be dry so we should be good to go. He has a chiropractor appointment today so I'll be anxious to see what she says about how he is doing.
--
Lynn
Beavercreek, Ohio
March 2018
Relevante Case History
Relevante Photo Album

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Kirsten Rasmussen
 

Lynn, don't sell yourself short.  You're the team leader and you're the one putting in the time and effort, and it's because of YOU that everything has come together for Relevante!  I can't wait to see photos/videos!!

--
Kirsten and Shaku (IR + PPID) - 2019
Kitimat, BC, Canada
ECIR Group Moderator
 
Shaku's Case History
Shaku's Photo Album


Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Lynn,

Does he sweat at all when not working, now that we're into the summer and the heat has been taxing just standing around? If so, then he needs to have his daily salt intake increased to 2oz (4 tbsp) just to keep up with normal, non-working needs. Does he have a salt block/loose salt available? Does he use it?

The salt drive is basic but will get shut down when an animal becomes salt-deprived and dehydrated to some degree. Turning it back on can take some time. It took almost 3 years of making sure one of my boys was consuming adequate amounts of salt and remaining properly hydrated before he finally started to use a salt block on his own and stopped resenting it in his food.

Sherry already addressed the working needs part of your question.

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR


Deb Walker
 

Such fantastic news Lynn. Your attention to detail and case history are one of the bests I have ever seen. Being out on the trails with your boy has to be

exhilarating. It was a hard pill to swallow when I had to realize Scotty was just too old to ride. Enjoy it for as long as you can :)


--
Deb and Scotty I/R, PPID
Pecatonica Illinois, May 13, 2019
Case History:
 https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Deb%20and%20Scotty
Photos:
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=90619


Lynn
 

Just got back from the barn. Relevante got a great report from the chiropractor [who is also a vet] ...she said he is doing really well. I posted a photo of him in his album doing his stretches for treats at the end of the appointment. Thanks Kirsten and Deb for your words of encouragement! I talked with our caregiver...she's going to help me get video of him gaiting up and down the driveway as well as when we are on the trail. 

Lavinia - you must have been reading my mind. I checked him today for any sweat when I pulled him out to groom him before the chiropractor came. I didn't detect any sweat at all. It's 85 degrees today with humidity at 55 percent. He does have a white salt block in his feed bin at all times and he is using it. it was a little grungy from the oils/supplements/grain so I took it in the bathroom and rinsed it off.  I'm going to do what you said and up the amount of salt I put in his supplements as we are now moving into the hottest part of the summer. I checked with the caregiver (she lives on-site in an apartment that is part of the barn) and she says he is drinking approximately 5 quarts during the day and 5 at night...she keeps the water bucket filled.

Deb - you are so right....I treasure every moment we have when we are together and when we are riding. My Mom has had two back to back surgeries recently so I've only been able to go out once a week..I'm staying with them right now to care for her but once she gets back on her feet - I want to start going mid-week and just ride him around the farm.
--
Lynn
Beavercreek, Ohio
March 2018
Relevante Case History
Relevante Photo Album

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