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Urgent Vinnies acute mild laminitis

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Hi need help.  We are back in the acute phase of mild laminitis. Cause is likely the alf in his blue grass that I caught last week or so and likely my suspicion of unmanaged ppid. We are now on tested timothy, test in file.  Ch is about updated except I have decreased hay for 2 to 4lb of odtbc. And we started 10 tabs metformin 2x per day on Sunday night.  Increased prascend to 0.75 last week mid week. He dramatically improved overnight from Sun to Monday:

https://youtu.be/3wWcDBoYC1s

Rads from yday look great thank god.. will upload those when I get them.

Pulled blood to see where we are at metabolically.

I am throwing caution to the wind, and stopping nsaid.

I am trying to get him to eat phyto quench and he will not so far.. mixed in some rsr beet pulp to let him think about it.

He is getting dc from the cbd joint pellets that he would eat, should I increase that til I can get him to eat Phyto-quench?


He is on jherb via laminox (in main bucket at night)  and Glycocemic eq that i feed dry a with a handful of lmf low carb complete and cbd pellets and some ha gel. His gums are a little grayish not too pink. 

Should I increase jherb?

We are on day 3 of acute phase. Hindsight it has probably been brewing for about 2 weeks now. Since i started soaking the old hay.

Started red light today again, and I have a mini pulse pemf unit (should I hold off on either of these?)

He is in a boot on the lf, that I managed to cut a hole in the pad that relieves pressure on the p3 where he has bone loss where he hated pressure and that has provided moderate relief. Rf has a sneaker.

He is not doing the typical laminitis stance or shifting so I think we caught this early enough.  Vinnie is hypersensitive and a great communicator :)

He is ambulatory, though slow.. have him in back on track standing wraps up to the knees lightly bound so that he is not cold. His rf has a back on track bell boot as well for warmth.  We dropped to the low 30's this week so keeping him warm.

Someone had posted a pad company on another post, could you repost here again please?

Lots of questions I know.

--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104
Cass in NorCal
 

So sorry to hear this, Nancy. He looks very sore. Here’s the link to the hoof pads. 


--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Thanks Cass,, yeah it totally sucks!!! We were going so great there for a bit.

But I am hopeful that we can get back on track... just a momentary pause to regroup.

Thanks for the link :)
--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104
Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Gilly Edwards <gillyedwardsusa@...>
 

I was having great difficulty finding a pad my horse was comfortable in.  I found using a thick sponge cut to the shape of the hoof attached with elastic on did the trick.
--
Gilly 
VA
2020
Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Ok i have been thinking about my plan.....

1. Stopped banamine, he was getting 250# dose 1 time per day for a long time at least a year or more.  As Dr Kellon quoted Einstein in a previous post, "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result"... (is definitely not working for me) since he was getting a low dose i will monitor him to see if I need to wean off more slowly.

2. Tried pq, and Vinnie said no way.. so I am going to try the hemp joint from uckele as he will eat that but double the dose 2x per day for the DC. I have ordered cocosoya granules to see if that will be a game changer for PQ.
3. Added mov ease back and he ate that in his mash.
4. Adding pea 2500 mg 2x per day (starting tonight)
5. Increasing jherb by 1/4 tsp per feeding to pink gums. Since he is eating Glycocemic eq and laminox in his mashes I don't want to mess with  good thing so I am leaving those alone.
6. Starting a course of ulcerguard tonight 2 hrs before any meds/herbs as he was very tummy reactive during our last acupuncture appt. On Saturday and recommended I treat for ulcers.
7. Try to figure out a better pad solution for the left front. I have purchased about 8 different boots with bunch of different pads that I can try different cut outs... i have also read that yoga mats worked for some so that is in my list to try(yah I am crazy...so..I may have some boots for sale or to loan out later :) )
8. Red light therapy daily 
9.  Centurion mini pulse on 2hz daily starting in a week when I get a better idea of his pain tolerance off nsaids.
10. He is getting 10ml  apf syringed in the am still and vit e in the pm, I dont want to syringe too much more...(he may boycott my presence:) I could add something to the vit e syringe if needed but I would prefer not it at all possible.

Since I am trying to give jherb in food as well as pea and mov ease should I increase the dosage or should i really be syringing these?

Still giving meds (metformin, prascend, thyrol)... 

Last but not least even though his insulin st time of testing has never been higher than 88 ans was last 42 should inbe considering invokana because of how high risk he seems to be?

Dr Kellon and all, please let me know your thoughts on my plan and if you think anything sounds incorrect?

Thx in advance Nan
--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104
Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

Sounds fine to me, and hold off on Invokana  unless insulin rises on the metformin.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001
Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Thanks Dr Kellon. :) will continue to update here.

He was more comfortable than I expected bkm to be last night w/o banamine in board which was a plus. We will see how today goes. Knock wood :)


Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104
Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

The abscess at the toe is much smaller on lateral view but on solar margin view he has more bone loss medially and there are two shadows of concern. I'll circle and post them.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001
Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Thanks Dr Kellon, j noticed the none loss myself and incidentally his last two acupuncture appts be hasn't had foor soreness reactivity, but largely reactive for bone ans this time was bone and tummy.

Would you think another tildren profusion would be beneficial?  Of course after addressing what may be the source of the shadows?
--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104
Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

If this is infection, Tildren won't help and is contraindicated. What I would do is retake the film with the sulci on either side of the frog packed with clay or Play-Doh to eliminate any artifacts. If the shadows are still present, get an opinion from a board certified radiologist.
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001
Eleanor Kellon, VMD
 

P.S.  Remember too he has extensive arthritis changes in P2 at the pastern joint which could certainly cause pain (although obviously not sole tenderness).
--
Eleanor in PA

www.drkellon.com 
EC Owner 2001
Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Lavinia Fiscaletti
 

Hi Nancy,

I've uploaded a quick mark-up for the LF:

https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/photo/245855/0?p=Created,,,20,2,0,0

Yellow hashed line is where the bone would be. Really need to bring that medial quarter inward to remove excess pressure, as well as to keep the entire hoof capsule from twisting medially. Also need more off the toe. Coffin bone is ground parallel, which is adding to the stresses on the arthritis he has on P2, and to the tendons/ligaments along the back of his leg.

--
Lavinia, George Too, Calvin (PPID) and Dinky (PPID/IR)
Nappi, George and Dante Over the Bridge
Jan 05, RI
Moderator ECIR
Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

Nancy & Vinnie & Summer
 

So he jas gone off food, could be the increase in prascend, he is shifting more today so definitely not as comfortable and he didn't eat the DC, mov ease or pea last night.

So I think I may have to regroup a little..maybe back down on the prascend...he has not gone off food from metformin before.

Help??
--
Nancy and Vinnie and Summer
Oakley, Ca
Joined Nov 2018
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=245855

Summer
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/files/Nancy%20and%20Vinnie/Summer 
https://ecir.groups.io/g/CaseHistory/album?id=249104
Cass in NorCal
 

On Wed, Dec 23, 2020 at 11:41 AM, Nancy & Vinnie & Summer wrote:
So I think I may have to regroup a little..maybe back down on the prascend...he has not gone off food from metformin before.
Nancy, did you increase APF to twice daily at the maximum dose?  
--
Cass, Sonoma Co., CA 2012
ECIR Group Moderator
Cayuse and Diamond Case History Folder                
Cayuse Photos                Diamond Photos

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